Gormongous Posted February 10, 2015 Thank you Gormongous for being literally the only person I have ever observed using that word correctly (outside of examples illustrating how to use it correctly, anyway). Seriously, I was genuinely elated when I saw that sentence. No problem, I have a passion for good word choice. Someday I'll even be good enough to get Ben X-sempai to notice me... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ben X Posted February 10, 2015 I like your ironic choice of the word "good"! (Also, if I hadn't been so drunk as to defy comprehension, I would have probably praised your correct use of "beg the question" ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 10, 2015 Ahem, hem. It's "senpai", not "sempai". Yes, I know there are various ways to romanize the Japanese language, but fuck you it's "senpai". There's no "m" in the Japanese language, but there is an "n"! And then there's ma mi mu me mo na ni nu ne no. RIGHT?! RIGHT!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 10, 2015 I always use "r" but I am more willing to accept "l" there, because the actual sound is like this weird combination of the two. M OVER N THOUGH? NO WAY!! This is just making me sad that I basically forgot everything that I learned about the Japanese language except this dumb nonsense. I need to relearn the language from scratch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted February 10, 2015 I always use "r" but I am more willing to accept "l" there, because the actual sound is like this weird combination of the two. M OVER N THOUGH? NO WAY!! This is just making me sad that I basically forgot everything that I learned about the Japanese language except this dumb nonsense. I need to relearn the language from scratch. That was actually just a Metal Gear Solid reference (A game I have never played). I know nearly nothing about any Asian languages, and precious little about most of the Romantic or Germanic ones, either. Shame, really. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bjorn Posted February 10, 2015 That was actually just a Metal Gear Solid reference (A game I have never played). Dammit, you outed yourself before I could take this thread down the conspiracy, tin-foil abyss of MG references. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Professor Video Games Posted February 10, 2015 If you were to look up nonplussed in the dictionary you would find a picture of Solid Snake. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bjorn Posted February 10, 2015 If you were to look up nonplussed in the dictionary you would find a picture of Solid Snake. No, I think it would be Otacon. Kojima does show up next to run-on sentences though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eot Posted February 11, 2015 Ahem, hem. It's "senpai", not "sempai". Yes, I know there are various ways to romanize the Japanese language, but fuck you it's "senpai". There's no "m" in the Japanese language, but there is an "n"! And then there's ma mi mu me mo na ni nu ne no. RIGHT?! RIGHT!! Haha, well it's pronounced more like "m" before certain consonants no matter how you spell it. To be fair though, no one writes "gengki" (元気) even though that's how you pronounce it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted February 11, 2015 Haha, well it's pronounced more like "m" before certain consonants no matter how you spell it. To be fair though, no one writes "gengki" (元気) even though that's how you pronounce it. It would be a pain in the ass, but I wish there were a slightly more pronunciation-based romanization for Japanese, just so I never have to hear "Ah-SOO-kah" again in my life. Regardless, I fucked up. Sorry, Twig-sempai! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 11, 2015 Haha, well it's pronounced more like "m" before certain consonants It varies, but this one for sure is not pronounced like "m". It's just the way the "n" and hard "p" blend together that makes it sound like "m". So it's still incorrect. Also you definitely don't pronounce it "gengki" what is happening. It's geh-n-kee. Three syllables! (seh-n-pah-ee. FOUR SYLLABLES!) (n is often blended into the preceding syllable in all practical circumstances though) This was drilled into me by my Japanese teacher who frequently corrected people for making these exact mistakes!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted February 11, 2015 This discussion sounds an awful lot like it's swerving into diphthongs and glottal stops, some of my favorite pedantries. "Seh-n-pah-ee" sounds like it's 3 syllables with a glottal stop. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mawd Posted February 11, 2015 M... G? METAL GEEARRRRR! (I'm sorry I couldn't help myself) As for la li lu le lo I think there's cause to say its in katakana rather than hiragana since I'm pretty sure it's a code made up by a westerner in which case I dare say that the 'l' is allowable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 11, 2015 This discussion sounds an awful lot like it's swerving into diphthongs and glottal stops, some of my favorite pedantries. "Seh-n-pah-ee" sounds like it's 3 syllables with a glottal stop. For purposes of learning to speak the Japanese language, it's an actual full syllable. In practice, it often turns into a glottal stop. When Japanese people explicitly enunciate words, though, like for emphasis or whatever, it's always its own syllable. Another fun example: in specific instances, "su" is just shortened to an "s" sound, as if it's attached to the preceding or proceeding syllable. "suki" (Japanese for "like" or "love", depending on context), for example, is usually pronounced "skee". Or, in the case of "desu" (basically, "it is"), it's often just pronounced "des", as if it's a single syllable. Buuuut sometimes it's fully enunciated! "Deh-soo"! ...I really wish I'd kept up with my Japanese language studies after leaving Japan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted February 11, 2015 That's interesting. In terms of Romantic/Germanic language consonants aren't really capable of being their own syllable. I know essentially nothing about any Asiatic languages, though. I suppose there are African/Eastern languages where glottal stops are entirely part of the phraseology. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 11, 2015 It's a long 'nnnnn' sound basically, rather than the cut off 'n' at the end of, say, "Asian". I mean maybe that's still a glottal stop. I don't really know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
syntheticgerbil Posted February 12, 2015 Oh man are you guys speaking Japanese?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted February 12, 2015 It's a long 'nnnnn' sound basically, rather than the cut off 'n' at the end of, say, "Asian". I mean maybe that's still a glottal stop. I don't really know. Well, those are both nasal consonants, it's just a matter of stress and duration. Even "ng" is a velar nasal, rather than anything glottal, unless someone's doing some kind of overcorrection to pronounce the "g." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tberton Posted February 12, 2015 Oh man, articulatory phonetics and phonology, don't get me started! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 12, 2015 Oh man, articulatory phonetics and phonology, don't get me started! No, please, go ahead! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brkl Posted February 13, 2015 Huh, you have to stretch the definition of a syllable pretty far for that word to be more than two. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted February 13, 2015 That's how the Japanese language was taught to me. It's very rhythmic. a-i-u-e-o-ka-ki-ku-ke-ko--- etc. Those are all individual syllables in Japanese. There are special combinations of some things, like we have s+h=sh, for example, and they have ki+ko=kyo or ri+yu=ryu. Also ryu is one syllable as opposed to the two most English speakers go with (ree-oo, or in some cases the hopelessly incorrect rai-oo). And then ryuu is two syllables. Or two beats, if you prefer. Ryu-u. It's not a stretch of a definition, I think. It's a difference in the way languages are spoken. (Someone who ACTUALLY speaks Japanese - I know there's someone here who does!!! - is welcome to jump in and start correcting me... Please! I'm by no means an authority!) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
