Modest Tech: The NX Generation (Nintendo Switch)

[Griddlelol]

Honestly, it looks like I'm going to skip the switch or wait until it's cheap with a good back catalogue. 

 

Paying for online is not something I've want to do for two services.

 

I love the idea but as others have said, the execution leaves a lot to be desired. 

 

That said, the new Zelda game looks fucking amazing. My Wiiu will have plenty of use from that

[eRonin]

Hey folks, so I got the chance to play the Switch earlier today. The first thing I will say is that despite my large hands, the joycon on its side was quite comfortable, and actually felt better to me than having the joycon attached to the sides of the tablet itself. I played only a handful of games because I had to queue a long time to get to play Zelda, and I unfortunately missed 1 2 Switch, which is probably the game that most needs to be played to understand the appeal. So I can't really speak for that. 

 

I played a few rounds of Splatoon 2, which is fantastic and was being played in the local wireless mode since I played both docked and undocked. I didn't see any kind of stuttering that might have been caused by wireless interference, which bodes well for future big in-person events for Splatoon tournaments. It seems Nintendo is quite serious about making an esport out of Splatoon, since they seem to also finally have added a spectator mode, though I have no idea how the details of this will work. The new special weapons are pretty exciting and interesting, except for one specific one (the sting ray) that nobody thinks is any good at all. 

 

Snipperclips is a game that everyone on my Twitter feed raved about, and it definitely lived up to the hype for me. It's a physics based puzzle action game that involves achieving simple objectives in two-player co-op. The main gameplay mechanic is using your own character's body to cut out shapes in your partner, and using the new shapes to help with the objectives. It's completely freeform and the game never hints which shapes you should use for a particular level. It encourages active communication throughout the game with your partner, which is fun. The real-time physics adds a layer of franticness though I don't think there are time limits in the game, unless maybe there is an additional challenge mode.

 

I played Zelda as well, like I said earlier, but I think most people know what's, up with that. It had a lot of aliasing on the TV I played on, but I briefly switched (haha) to the handheld and it was very sharp and smooth. The screen in general is very vibrant, and I can imagine myself playing a lot of games on the handheld alone. In any case, Zelda doesn't seem to be a significant improvement over the Wii U version so I'm sure I'll just pick that one up, and not get the Switch on release.

 

I also didn't get a chance to play ARMS which is a shame, but I watched two of my friends play and it looked really fun, though as I expected, tilting the controllers to move your character is a bit difficult in the heat of battle. Having different types of arms and different characters go a long way into making this feel like a full-fledged game and not just something that feels like it belongs in a minigame collection, though.

 

I didn't get to ask many questions and I doubt the Nintendo AU staff would know much more than what was immediately presentable. I am still not sure how the OS/UI runs, what the eshop music sounds like, or if things like Netflix will be supported. I imagine it would be an improvement over the Wii U in those aspects...Hopefully.

 

Anyway so I like Splatoon too much not to buy its sequel when it comes out, and of course I am excited for Mario Odyssey, but until then I doubt I will buy a Switch. Snipperclips is fantastic, but I don't think that's a launch title either anyway.

[Kolzig]

I liked pretty much all the software that was shown and all the other software that we have only seen tiny bits of like Fast RMX. There was also some UbiArt engine Rayman game shown in the software reel. I wonder when will Ubisoft announce their games for Switch.

 

The problems however were the price, I was hoping for 249€ because the current situation is that Europe is pretty much fucked since prices like 349€ have already popped up for the preorders which is just fucking insanity like Wii U situation was. Europe is lost already for Nintendo. There's nothing Satoru Shibata can do to save it. I know for sure that stupid shops in Finland will again put some insane prices like 379€ for Switch like they did with Wii U and then wonder why is nobody buying Switch when you can get in current prices PS4 or Xbox 1 for 249€.

 

Also 32gb is such a incredibly dumb internal memory space when the OS will most likely take something like 6-7gb of that space. It was too small in 2012 for Wii U and it's just too damn small for Switch in 2017. SD cards have ok price upto 200gb. I hope in the near future the 512gb to 1tb sd cards will appear and price drop fast.

 

Paid online is a shame since that locks out MK8D and Splatoon 2. I hope 3rd parties will arrive, but I don't know what will happen. EA and 2k support looks right now exactly like Wii U launch.

[dartmonkey]

Thanks for the heads-up, I'd missed this. They need more things like this - little charming games I can play with my family to plug the gaps between big games.

 

I intend to get a Switch when it comes out, not because of a staggering launch lineup, but more due to time limitations. I know I'll get one eventually and I'd rather keep up with the games as they're released rather than wait and have a backlog of stuff I want to play. I've just about caught up with Wii U stuff (only Captain Toad and DK Tropical Freeze to go) and then I can pretty much pack it away and clear some space under the TV. I could play Breath of the Wild on Wii U, but the ability to play it on planes, trains and automobiles is worth a lot. The hardware looks neat even though the lineup looks very thin. Even if it ends up doing a Wii U, that's enough for me.

 

More negatively, they've said there'll be no Miiverse or Streetpass. It was a fun concept but I could take or leave Miiverse (interesting that there were no Miis to be seen anywhere on Switch yet), but Streetpass is a huge loss. Hopefully they'll add it in an update. That little green notification light was always fun.

 

This Eurogamer article sums up my thoughts pretty well.

 

Edit.

Thin. Glad to see Sonic Mania on there, though. And hopefully Yooka-Laylee should come out this year.

[Kolzig]

In the UI pics that I've seen, there's at least your account's Mii character there. So Miis are not completely gone yet. Streetpass is a really shame to lose. Miiverse was cool for certain purposes, but it's not mandatory for future. Though it is interesting that they use time and resources to build a whole social network ecosystem and then just destroy it after one generation.

 

The Switch itself looks really cool, it's just the decisions surrounding it that bother me.

 

I'm playing Zelda on Wii U as it's last big game and will be looking at Switch in 2018 if my backlog has gotten any better and hopefully there's a pricecut for the machine by then. Anyway if I buy it, I'll get it during a yearly vacation to Japan since currently it's going to be ¥30000 = 250€ compared minimum 350€ in Europe. So happy that Iwata's promise was kept and Nintendo returned to region free systems.

[melmer]

Just watched the Mario trailer again. There's no coins!? Mario is collecting purple triangles instead.

 

also, Mario is now a peaky blinder throwing around his razor blade accessorised cap. Nintendo get their inspiration from the funniest places

[Roderick]

The Eurogamer article is a little troubling, BUT. In contrast to the Wii U, I think the Switch offers an inherently attractive proposition to many gamers. Which is why I think that, if it isn't a big hit at first, it'll follow the same trajectory as the 3DS. To wit, a much-maligned system with a barren landscape of games at first (though how a big time Zelda and Mario game can be seen as anything else than system sellers is beyond me), but that after its first year picks up steam enormously as game studios start making more games for it and a few killer apps appear (Streetpass most notably).

 

It's not unreasonable to think that Nintendo might pull the price-lowering card again, like they did with Wii U, come Summer. And we just haven't heard all the games yet that will appear on the system this year. It's entirely possible that somewhere in Q3 or Q4 as surprise Pokémon Stars is coming, and that basically means everyone will buy a Switch. But, really, the first year isn't always that meaningful for a console (even if financial people might disagree). A console can make all sorts of turnarounds. Though I still think the system will outperform the Wii U even in its first year.

[SuperBiasedMan]

Over the last few days the news has largely confirmed and refuted my two biggest concerns. Everyone's talked about the game line up, though I hope they'll have a big showing on the virtual console to flesh that out. 

 

The positive I've seen is that the device itself sounds pretty solid and pleasing, at least from the exposure people have had. 

 

Prices mean I'm waiting though. The console price is fair here at the €330 I expected. But I rarely buy games for more than €30. I could certainly do Zelda at launch, but everything else is higher priced than I would really pay. Down the line I'll be looking at good bundles, especially if news about the virtual console and tertiary Internet apps (like Netflix) seems positive too.

[supasheep]

Is the high price of the games due to the fact they're on a cart as opposed to a disc? I remember seeing an article a few months ago when it was rumoured that carts would be used and it said that they would be more expensive to manufacture than discs.

[rohlfinator]

11 hours ago, Roderick said:

The Eurogamer article is a little troubling, BUT. In contrast to the Wii U, I think the Switch offers an inherently attractive proposition to many gamers. Which is why I think that, if it isn't a big hit at first, it'll follow the same trajectory as the 3DS. To wit, a much-maligned system with a barren landscape of games at first (though how a big time Zelda and Mario game can be seen as anything else than system sellers is beyond me), but that after its first year picks up steam enormously as game studios start making more games for it and a few killer apps appear (Streetpass most notably).

 

Yeah -- if it truly ends up with Nintendo's full development support behind it, it's hard to imagine the library remaining this thin. With the Wii U and 3DS winding down, they must have some more big stuff they're holding on to.

 

It concerns me a bit that Reggie is saying the Switch won't replace the 3DS, but I'm hoping that's just a "third pillar"-style hedge (and not wanting to step on continuing Pokemon sales).

[Kolzig]

Well, DS wasn't supposed to replace Gameboy line, but it did exactly that and not be the third pillar that Nintendo originally said.

 

3DS doesn't have really many upcoming games anymore except Dragon Quest 11 which looks just excellent. The 2D/3D game world is really unique idea that looks really cool and I'm surprised nobody thought of that before the DQ guys.

[juv3nal]

19 hours ago, dartmonkey said:

 

Thin. Glad to see Sonic Mania on there, though. And hopefully Yooka-Laylee should come out this year.

 

Huh. Somehow I spaced that there was a Syberia 3 in the works. I bounced off of 2, but have fond memories of the first one. 

Also I had no idea Rime was so close to being done.

[miffy495]

I already imported a copy of Puyo Puyo Tetris for Xbone, but what the hell, I want to support localizing that nonsense!

[Kolzig]

http://venturebeat.com/2017/01/15/heres-a-closer-look-at-nintendo-switchs-game-cards/

 

Isn't Steep already out on other platforms? Kind of weird if it isn't coming out in the launch window. Ubisoft doing a classic EA move there?

[Simon]

I'll get one but I'm definitely waiting for Super Mario Odyssey - that is exactly what I'd hoped for, but was the only trailer that set my pulse racing. I'm surprised that there's nothing like a new Metroid, Starfox or Kirby game from Nintendo to fill out this year's lineup, as other than Zelda (which looks fine, but isn't even an exclusive) and Splatoon 2, it seems a quite sparse 2017 and a long wait for Mario.

Shouldn't 1-2 Switch have been bundled, like Wii Sports was?

 

So the launch is far from perfect, but on balance I agree with Rodi that things will pick up next year and it'll be more of a 3DS story than a sorry Wii U one. It's not as confusing a proposition as the Wii U and if there are plenty of good games tailored to the handheld mode (like Snipperclips and hopefully whatever Image & Form are working on) that will sustain it nicely.

I'd like to see a grey or white Joy-Con with the coloured buttons, another reason to hold out!

[Badfinger]

7 hours ago, Kolzig said:

Isn't Steep already out on other platforms? Kind of weird if it isn't coming out in the launch window. Ubisoft doing a classic EA move there?

 

It's definitely on Steam. I think it's in official 1.0 now? I feel the same way about Skyrim, but even more. That game's a billion years old, there's no reason it shouldn't have been launch. I mean, of course there are a billion development reasons but logistically for the health of the console it should have been March.

 

I don't know if they're trying to spread the games out so either the lineup doesn't feel so painfully thin OR so that people will be less likely to say there aren't any releases coming down the pipe, but the software situation feels even more dire to me looking at that infographic.

 

Actually the Eurogamer article rings very true to me - it seems like a solid piece of hardware for what it is, but negatively compromised in like 4 different directions in a way that's so uniquely Nintendo, and then no software for it. I don't think it's going to be able to breathe like the 3DS did to eventually become a real juggernaut after an absolute crisis at launch.

[Twig]

Well Metroid and Star Fox don't sell. That's not too surprising.

 

Kirby's absence might be notable, but there's still a possibility it'll show up (that is, be announced?) before the year's end. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Nintendo Directs start picking up more again. Nintendo isn't a company that announces its games years, or often even months, ahead of time anymore. Breath of the Wild being the big notable exception, and Odyssey just because it helps more than it hurts to say "Yeah we do have a new Mario game!"

 

Also I'm curious to see if indie game support picks up. I wouldn't hate to see the Switch become a Vita with Nintendo games. O: Dunno if I expect it, but I have heard mostly positive things with regards to indie dev and Wii U/3DS. Mostly...

[Zeusthecat]

I'm most definitely going to end up getting the Switch. I love Nintendo and want to continue supporting them and experiencing the unique shit they have to offer. But damn there are a whole lot of major concerns that don't have me feeling very enthusiastic about this system doing any better than the WiiU from a business perspective.

 

The first, most obvious issue is the price. I think this is actually a much bigger concern than a lot of people realize. First, there is the base system at $300. Which I think would be acceptable if that was all you needed to spend to get up and running, but unfortunately it looks like there are some fairly mandatory minimum costs on top of that. Right off the bat, I think it is fair to say that the 32 GB of storage they are providing is not going to be enough. Even if you try to go for only physical releases, it is unavoidable that you will need hard drive space for patches, virtual console games, digital only releases, DLC, etc. So let's say that you could get by with an added 128 GB of storage (this would probably be a comfortable amount of space for most people assuming they aren't buying only digital). A 128 GB micro SD card is currently going for around $40 on Amazon.

 

It didn't look like they were bundling any games with the Switch, so let's assume you are just getting a single game to start. Assuming that game isn't 1-2 Switch, that's another $60. To be fair, I don't think there is necessarily anything wrong with the system not coming bundled with a game, but when it costs $300 and requires these other upfront costs, it is a little more frustrating to not have something bundled in with the system and have that be another mandatory cost if you want to do anything with the system.

 

Now this is where it gets really funky. For me, and most other people I know that stick with Nintendo systems, local multiplayer is and always has been one of their biggest selling points. I don't think it would be inaccurate to say that a very large percentage of prospective Switch buyers will be buying the system largely so that they have a good local co-op machine they can play with friends and family. Given how much we play the WiiU together in my household and how many awesome local co-op games we have purchased, that is definitely a large reason I continue to get Nintendo systems and is what keeps them from gathering dust. Unfortunately, if I want to continue having these types of experiences, it looks like I would need to get another pair of joy cons (and let's face it, you will need to get a pair if you really want to guarantee that you can effectively play anything beyond the simplistic waggle mini-game collections). That's another $80. And then it looks like you will definitely need another joy con grip if you want to have an option to make those joy cons into a standard controller (that offset thumb stick on the right hand controller looks like it would be impossible to manipulate without the support you would get by snapping it into the grip) for non waggle games and that is another $30 (not sure if they are offering a cheaper one that doesn't charge the joy cons but I would imagine most people would opt for the charging one since it seems like it would be a major hassle to keep any joy cons beyond the initial 2 charged). So that comes out to another $110 minimum if you plan to play a lot of local co-op. I guess you could opt for the $70 controller for your second controller instead but it is hard to tell exactly how far Nintendo is leaning back into motion controls and how much you would lose by not having the functionality of the joy cons.

 

So that comes out to $300 (base system) + $60 (1 game) + $40 (128 GB storage) + $110 (extra pair of joy cons with grip). That is an absolutely ludicrous $510. Let's be extra generous and say you really don't need the extra storage and are just buying this for the core Nintendo games. That's still $470! That is beyond unreasonable. It's actually kind of insane when you consider what you can get for that money if you opt for Microsoft's or Sony's console, which if you are going to compare is probably the most apt comparison to other things on the market.

 

Unfortunately, for those who are able to put down that kind of money, it looks like this will once again be a situation where there is very little 3rd party support and it will be largely up to Nintendo to ensure that it has a robust enough catalog of games to justify the asking price. Even if it could compete graphically, the storage limitations guarantee that there is no way we are going to see any releases of AAA 3rd party games that are available on other platforms. If the WiiU life cycle was any indication, I think this is going to be another major obstacle to the Switch finding any kind of mainstream success. The new gimmick (console gaming on the go) just isn't enough of a paradigm shift to offset these major obstacles and get people excited enough to bring them onboard the way the original Wii did. In fact, in some ways this is even less appealing than the WiiU because you don't automatically have extra controllers lying around from the previous generation that you can use for multiplayer and there is no backwards compatibility to play any of the existing games you might have. Taking those features away and making the tablet portable seems like a bit of a net loss, or a wash at best.

 

Then there's the fee for online, which isn't as big of a concern to me. But I do wonder how that will impact the online community for a game like Splatoon 2. If its multiplayer requires paid online, that could be disastrous for fostering a strong online community since I doubt most people will want to pay a fee for the lackluster online service that Nintendo will likely be offering.

 

The only possible silver lining here is that the 3DS is sitting around 60 million units of lifetime sales right now. That tells me that there is definitely an appetite at some level for what Nintendo provides. But on the opposite end you have the WiiU, which is sitting at a little over 13 million units of lifetime sales. Looking at the big picture, I would say the 2 biggest factors that would indicate whether this will be a success or not is the price and the core gimmick. The Wii nailed both of those and was a huge success. The 3DS has one of those, the price point (based on the initial sales before the early price drops it looks like the 3D was little more than a "nice feature" for the vast majority of people and being portable was less important than it being affordable), and it has been pretty damn successful too. The Switch, in my opinion, has neither. Gaming on the go will be huge for some people, and won't be much more than a "nice feature" for most. And it's expensive as hell. I think that is going to make it really fucking difficult for this console to take a significant bite out of the 3DS install base. If I'm being as optimistic as possible, this system will hopefully eventually sit somewhere between the 13 million units that the WiiU sold and the 60 million units that the 3DS sold, most likely leaning more towards the lower number. I just really don't think the Switch is doing anything special enough to attract anyone outside of the 3DS and WiiU install base and I fear that the price, weak specs, and lack of meaningful innovation are poised to drive even more people away.

 

Zelda and Mario look great though and I can't wait for both of those games. It just sucks that they are leaning so hard back into motion controls for so many of their other games. Seeing one of their big announced games basically being a re-hash of Wario Ware Smooth Moves just looks sad.

[marginalgloss]

I'm slightly bummed that they seem to be abandoning Miiverse with the Switch. I still enjoy posting screenshots and dumb comments there, both on 3DS and Wii U. But I can imagine the costs of running and moderating their own social network have escalated wildly in relation to its actual benefits in terms of revenue. Does Miiverse sell games to people who don't already have them? I would imagine they'd rather channel those resources towards building communities on existing social networks. 

 

Still, even though Miiverse was hopelessly convoluted as a way of saving screenshots, I always appreciated it when games made the effort to directly implement it. Stuff like player comments in Nintendoland, Mario 3D World, etc. I mean, a lot of that was junk content, but in many cases it was a meaningful act of creation by the people who made it. And for some games, like Monster Hunter or Fire Emblem, Miiverse was an excellent way to ask very specific, obscure game questions that might not get an answer anywhere else. (What are we going to do now - go on GameFaqs? Or...*shudders*...reddit?)

 

And I'll miss StreetPass, too. But I've been thinking about this a bit more, and I actually have no idea what a Switch-based version of the Streetpass suite would look like. We could exchange Miis, sure, but to what end? I really think the 3DS StreetPass games would suddenly start to look lightweight on the new machine, not just because it's more powerful, but because they have to work both at home on the TV and out in the world. I mean, I don't mind picking up my 3D picture tiles while on the bus, but at home on my TV that's suddenly competing with so many other huge experiences. And then there's the tricky question of privacy - you'd have to have separate 'Home' and 'Public' wifi modes for the Switch to hide your profile when you're at home, perhaps...it's an interesting problem, but I'm not sure it's one that Nintendo is especially interested in addressing any more...

[Vader]

It's probably safe to think of Christmas 2017 as the "true launch," the months before then are probably just fans getting to play it early. 

 

The lineup from Nintendo is solid for year one of a new console: Zelda, Mario, Splatoon, and new original multiplayer (Arms). If people were expecting more than that, they probably should have tempered their expectations. Those will be plenty to occupy both my time and bank account for a good while. I was never not going to buy the new Nintendo console eventually, but the Mario and Splatoon announcements coupled with the NES Classic shortage fiasco inspired me to preorder fast.

Now if only they could bring down the cost of those peripherals... 

 

 

[Kolzig]

On 1/16/2017 at 8:05 PM, Twig said:

Kirby's absence might be notable, but there's still a possibility it'll show up (that is, be announced?) before the year's end. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Nintendo Directs start picking up more again. Nintendo isn't a company that announces its games years, or often even months, ahead of time anymore. Breath of the Wild being the big notable exception, and Odyssey just because it helps more than it hurts to say "Yeah we do have a new Mario game!"

 

Also I'm curious to see if indie game support picks up. I wouldn't hate to see the Switch become a Vita with Nintendo games. O: Dunno if I expect it, but I have heard mostly positive things with regards to indie dev and Wii U/3DS. Mostly...

 

I heard from the internet, which never lies, that indie devs are getting excited over the idea of the Switch.

 

At least some of the quality devs that made awesome games for 3DS and Wii U are already confirmed working on new stuff for Switch like the Icelandic Steamworld guys and also the German wonderkids at Shin'en with Fast RMX. Finland also is represented at launch with Has Been Heroes coming from Frozenbyte.

 

Kirby has 25th anniversary this year so I'm 100% sure latest at E3 we will hear about a Kirby game coming for Switch during this year.

 

I feel that EA, 2k and Bethesda are just trying the ice with a stick if it will break or not. EA has committed so far just FIFA and that might not be FIFA18, they are saying it's "FIFA" and Peter Moore already quoted as saying it's a custom build for Switch. 2k's NBA seems to be the real 2k18 with most likely some Switch special features like 2k13 was on Wii U.

 

I have to say I really like the name. Nintendo Switch is really damn great name for their console, also the return to red and white coloring is good and nostalgic. Game packages seem to look nice and have that PSP feel and I just can't say anything bad about the game cards because those are slightly bigger than 3DS cards and still tiny, don't take a lot of space and just as long as they get a lot of games for the console, shops can have tons of games on display and don't need a huge space to do that. I will standby the fact forever that Wii U is a great console plagued by a horrible name.

[Twig]

I absolutely adore the name and the colors of their logo and ESPECIALLY that fucking *switch* sound is just so goddamn perfect.

 

Wii U was great, and the name was terrible. ):

 

I'm fairly optimistic about the Switch's future, even if what we know of this launch year so far is underwhelming (I personally count at least six games that I know I want to try if not buy outright this year alone, and I also know I will never get to all of them, so it's not very underwhelming to me, but I can understand people's trepidation for sure). I don't for a second buy Reggie's "3DS will live on!" rhetoric, but who knows. Maybe I'm dead wrong on this one! But if I'm not, that definitely means the Switch will have proportionally more internal support than any system since, well, since the Game Boy's launch. It'll have it all! No more games split across two platforms! Please please please! (I think even if I am right, though, it will take maybe a year or two. The 3DS' install base is still huge.)

[Roderick]

Good post, Kolzig. Like Twig, I also really really like the name Switch and the logo and the whole branding of the thing. I doubt the 3DS will live on after the first year of Switch (caveat: unless the Switch bombs to an amazing degree, then they'll scramble to revitalise the system and create a follow-up). Reggie's talk is standard procedure.

 

I have a pre-order problem though. I'd love to pre-order (here in Holland it's still possible), but I can't make up my mind if I want the grey joycons or the red and blue ones. I'm verrrry slowly getting used to the colored ones, but my initial reaction was 'yuck', because they seemed so gaudy neon - not quite a strong color but vaguely diluted. Has anyone seen them for real? I suspect they may be nicer in real life than on pictures, but until I get a hands-on, I won't know for sure. Grey is the safe option, of course, though I've lamented before it's also very boring.

[Twig]

I actually wanted the colored JoyCons, but ended up getting gray because that's all that was available when I finally found some available preorders. O:

I figure I'll just buy the neon ones whenever I buy a second pair of JoyCons a year down the line.

[SecretAsianMan]

I'm less optimistic.  While I hope it does well, I'm concerned with Nintendo's history of being groundbreaking in some areas and hilariously outdated in others.  The Switch as a whole is certainly different but they don't have the best record of actually supporting their own tech despite what their press releases will say.  Their online model might very well kill several games if they can't make it competitive with the likes of Xbox and Playstation's respective services.  And while Zelda and Mario do look exciting, the current lineup isn't near enough for me to want to dive into the system at launch.  I've been burned by Nintendo over promising in the past and I'm not anxious to repeat that.

 

The one hope I do have is if it does work out well I think this could be a good first console for my daughter when she reaches that age.  The combination of physical and touch controls plus the portability seems like it would play well with a young child, not to mention the potential of Nintendo's back catalog of classic games.  I would be more than happy to see everything I said above proven completely wrong.