Gormongous Posted November 25, 2014 I feel like we're all just waiting for an immense disappointment. "Disappointment" is the best possible reaction to what is probably coming. The crowd outside the Ferguson police department is huge and not in the highest spirits. Two phone calls from family members worried tonight is the night I die, so far. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Merus Posted November 25, 2014 And yep, there it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted November 25, 2014 I am saddened, frustrated, disappointed, mad, upset. I am not at all surprised. Apparently police or municipal resources now admit that the distance from the vehicle was closer to 150 feet than 50. Quite literally, the police lied and a young man died. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bolegium Posted November 25, 2014 Some people are saying protesters should emulate MLK. Why not Medgar Evers too? There are thousands of pacifists who have been murdered that people could 'emulate'. http://www.vox.com/2014/11/24/7278687/civil-rights-ferguson Fuck this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BusbyBerkeley Posted November 25, 2014 Best counterargument to the "be like MLK" thing I've seen is the fact that he was still fucking assassinated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Merus Posted November 25, 2014 The thing about "be like MLK" is that he still upset a fuckload of white people that wanted him to go home and do things by their terms. But fuck the people who want to tell those in Ferguson how they're allowed to feel about this. This is democracy. They can be however they want. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted November 25, 2014 Apparently police or municipal resources now admit that the distance from the vehicle was closer to 150 feet than 50. Quite literally, the police lied and a young man died. Isn't that admission of at the very least not following procedure? When he's that far away, aren't they supposed to Not Fire, as a rule? I've absorbed a lot of information since this started, and I feel like I've read that somewhere, but I could be wrong. If I'm not, I would think that would be enough... Well, I guess there's already enough, but this hasn't been a fair fight from the beginning. This is terrifying: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/bassemmasri Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
feelthedarkness Posted November 25, 2014 Ugh. Also, good job on the 70% white grand jury in a town that's 71% black. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted November 25, 2014 It was alluded to by thefncrow earlier in this thread, but St. Louis county's prosecuting attorney is incredibly tight with the local police, being that his father was a police officer killed by a black man; his brother, nephew, and cousin all serve as police officers; and he himself wanted to be a police officer before losing a leg to cancer. In a situation involving a grand jury, where law enforcement already receives overwhelmingly preferential treatment compared to ordinary citizens, it verges on the perfect example of one hand washing the other. Protesters briefly closed off I-44 and Grand near Gravois, in St. Louis proper. Both groups were driven away with tear gas and rubber bullets, reportedly because the police felt "surrounded," but local officials are still trumpeting it as a "peaceful" dispersal. Ferguson is burning, but the national guard is only protecting "police" and "command" locations, so there's that. I shouldn't have made plans in West County for tonight, but the drive home wasn't that bad, except for everyone going a million miles an hour so that they'd spend as little time outside the safety of their homes as possible. I don't think that protests will last the week in St. Louis itself, but I think Ferguson is going to be messed up for a long time to come... as will the internet. The number of people in comments threads who seem to believe sincerely that the reasonable response to any crime, let alone to laying hands on a cop, is summary execution by said cop makes me sick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Merus Posted November 25, 2014 Well, if it wasn't a "peaceful" dispersal then they wouldn't have been allowed to use weapons that have been banned for use in war The depressing inevitability of this, and frankly everything else that has been going on, reminds me of Leonard Cohen: Irritatingly, Alex Jones uses it as his theme song. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bjorn Posted November 25, 2014 I don't really have much to say, the evening ultimately played out almost exactly like people expected it to. Just...fucking hell. It's amazing how much righteous indignation a bunch of old white men can muster when a car or building burn, but they don't think people should be getting so worked up when a black man dies. Huh. Shocking. Of course the violence is bad, but the reaction from too many corners of America is equally disgusting, where property damage is viewed as a greater threat to our democracy than death. Edited to add: Can we embed vines here? Fucking war zone out there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gormongous Posted November 25, 2014 I don't really have much to say, the evening ultimately played out almost exactly like people expected it to. Just...fucking hell. It's amazing how much righteous indignation a bunch of old white men can muster when a car or building burn, but they don't think people should be getting so worked up when a black man dies. Huh. Shocking. Of course the violence is bad, but the reaction from too many corners of America is equally disgusting, where property damage is viewed as a greater threat to our democracy than death. Edited to add: Can we embed vines here? Fucking war zone out there. And already we have our Tiananmen Square just from tonight: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henroid Posted November 25, 2014 I was at work and an English man (like from the UK, now living here) told me the jury's decision. His sentiment was the same as mine; what the fuck, fuck those people, that cop murdered Mike Brown. As for surreal shit going on with this, Also the highway in Oakland is shut down from what I hear because it's flooded with people who are demonstrating / pissed the fuck off. I'm gonna be wearing a badge tomorrow at work declaring my solidarity with them (in well-mannered language of course). Edit - I forget if I mentioned it here, but my step-sister, nephews, and nieces are all black. And it terrifies me that they can be murdered without justice (hell even with justice) just because they're black. I mean goddamn it, it's 2015 almost, fuck this goddamn country's racial culture. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nachimir Posted November 25, 2014 Is this from Ferguson or elsewhere? Edit: and I don't have much to say, except what the fuck America? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Griddlelol Posted November 25, 2014 Are there any white people protesting there? When I followed the vine rabbit hole about this it seems to be a bunch of black people, rightly pissed off, and a bunch of white people saying "you have a right to protest, but don't because it upsets me." Personally, I wouldn't protest, because I wouldn't want to be shot and killed for it, but that's the exact reason everyone white and black should be protesting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prettyunsmart Posted November 25, 2014 Are there any white people protesting there? When I followed the vine rabbit hole about this it seems to be a bunch of black people, rightly pissed off, and a bunch of white people saying "you have a right to protest, but don't because it upsets me." Personally, I wouldn't protest, because I wouldn't want to be shot and killed for it, but that's the exact reason everyone white and black should be protesting. The criminalization of political protest is one of the most legitimately disturbing developments of recent years (accepting of course that protestors throughout history have been beaten and killed, but in those cases it was understood as happening outside of the law to some extent). I was a part of a teacher's union in Wisconsin a couple of years ago during the protests surrounding Act 10, which effectively dissolved all public employee unions in the state. After the protests ended, the state passed laws stipulating that those wishing to protest at the state capitol needed to apply for a permit, and that they would be charged for any cleaning and added security costs. Again, I realize that this isn't quite the same as violence being carried out against protestors, but both work to undermine the right to free assembly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Badfinger Posted November 25, 2014 It was cool when police gassed people trying to help a woman having a heart attack. http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/11/thats-my-momma-cops-fire-tear-gas-into-crowd-as-woman-suffers-medical-emergency/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bolegium Posted November 25, 2014 Mike Huckabee name drops Medgar Evers, equating his murderer with the protesters in Ferguson. http://www.salon.com/2014/11/24/mike_huckabee_compares_ferguson_protesters_to_white_segregationists_in_grotesquely_bigoted_blog_post/ People who want to not be murdered because of the colour of their skin are the same as "lynch mobs", and are 'embracing the same injustice they're protesting'. Fuck you Mike. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twig Posted November 25, 2014 Are there any white people protesting there? Yes, I believe so. I watched Bassem's stream last night and there were a good number of white people standing alongside the black people. They were of course outnumbered, but not to any degree greater than expected, to be honest, in a city that's 70% black in the first place. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sclpls Posted November 25, 2014 The criminalization of political protest is one of the most legitimately disturbing developments of recent years (accepting of course that protestors throughout history have been beaten and killed, but in those cases it was understood as happening outside of the law to some extent). I was a part of a teacher's union in Wisconsin a couple of years ago during the protests surrounding Act 10, which effectively dissolved all public employee unions in the state. After the protests ended, the state passed laws stipulating that those wishing to protest at the state capitol needed to apply for a permit, and that they would be charged for any cleaning and added security costs. Again, I realize that this isn't quite the same as violence being carried out against protestors, but both work to undermine the right to free assembly. It's revealing that protests for left-wing causes like racial justice are met with force by the police, meanwhile Clive Bundy gets together some group with an insurrectionist ideology that are pointing guns directly at police officers and nothing happens. For that matter, it's revealing that Clive Bundy lives while Michael Brown does not. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dewar Posted November 25, 2014 Isn't that admission of at the very least not following procedure? When he's that far away, aren't they supposed to Not Fire, as a rule? I've absorbed a lot of information since this started, and I feel like I've read that somewhere, but I could be wrong. If I'm not, I would think that would be enough... Well, I guess there's already enough, but this hasn't been a fair fight from the beginning. This is terrifying: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/bassemmasri Having done some research on this when the shooting first happened, there's a frustrating gray area that basically states it's OK to shoot a fleeing suspect if it is reasonable to expect they might go on to do bodily harm to others. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dewar Posted November 25, 2014 Makes me wonder what it would be like to re-live the Rodney King and OJ Simpson trials that I was too young to really see both sides of. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
