"Ethics and Journalistic Integrity"

[Merus]

I remember TB from when he was just getting his WoW podcast going and dropping in on the SA forums. He's basically a laughingstock there because of this thread.

Apparently he was so annoying back then that I had him on ignore. Huh.

 

I could tell I was in for a wild ride when he treated his IQ as an important facet of his being.

 

There is a small part of me that's going "the Standford-Binet IV becomes unreliable over about 140 though, how is he getting 155 unless he did one calibrated towards higher intelligence that he did somewhat poorly at" but a larger part of me is going "IQ doesn't mean much other than your performance on IQ tests" and there's this bit way in the back going "I'd swear it's more than one standard deviation separating TB and I because that man does not put 2 and 2 together, but then IQ is no protector against douchebaggery"

 

Although the second reply was that he quoted fucking Illidan which frankly I should have noticed earlier

[gregbrown]

So the best thing to happen recently is GG thinking that Gawker Media is paying off either weird twitter or false-flag GG posters. They are 100% convinced and it is awesome.

 

The evidence:

https://twitter.com/Kingofpol/status/529546003436015617

 

https://twitter.com/Kingofpol/status/529842131989704704

 

 

GG pointed this out as fake, but wait... 

 

 

 

Let's pursue this Chud_fucker connection...

 

 

My god, it's all real. Gawker is manipulating weird twitter and GG at the same time!!!

[deleted user]

_

[Bjorn]

The demanding an apology stuff is just over the top considering no one was directly harmed unless it was a GamerGater attacking and threatening women. And for juxtaposition, there's this this egregious personal attack which Total Biscuit has never apologized for.

Good lord, what a gross fucking asshole. The first line of his reply is to claim that Shawn is a liar. And of course KiA or 8Chan won't call him on this bullshit, even through they've screamed about how people in their own movement have had their jobs threatened just for having an unpopular opinion. Oh right, there are actually people in the comment thread defending TB. One even going so far as to say he's the mature adult that handled everything correctly.

You're right that he's only in it for self promotion, along with virtually all the other "leaders" and prominent public speakers in gg.

[JonCole]

One of the most interesting parts of that discussion was Totilo's view on what the purpose of a review should be - namely, "persuasive". He tried to ask TB what exactly made "politics" less worthy of discussion than how the review may feel about the score/soundtrack of a game, which is another fully aesthetic and thus relative thing to benchmark. TB went on and on about how an "authoritative" stance on political issues in a review was irresponsible. He said that Bayonetta 2's review on Polygon, for instance, had about half of its content dedicated to pontification about sexism. I read that review and didn't feel like it spent all that long on the issue, but TB insisted that such treatment of a single element of a game should be sequestered to an "opinion piece" or editorial.

 

It struck me as really odd, because Totilo's point was convincing - I've read plenty of reviews that took a single element of a game to task that wasn't fully objective. For instance, plenty of "real gamers" took LoZ: Wind Waker to task for its art style, which wasn't objectively better or worse than the more realistic style of OoT/MM. What about the art style makes it more worthy of discussion in a review than a game's problematic politics?

[Problem Machine]

Basically fuck TB forever

edit: I am completely comfortable with this being the first post of the 100th page.

[Ben X]

gregbrown, in case you missed it, Denial already posted that Nick thing and we had just been discussing it above your re-post of it.

[BusbyBerkeley]

He is so infuriating. Its his own fault for being a public personality and giving a face to gamergate. I mean he was already irritating and a joke, but come on dude. You're a grown ass man. Quit being an idiot.

Also, gg bullshit finally reared its head on my fbook feed when a very political, non gaming friend made a post about how stupid and transparently shitty it was. It was overrun with the pro gg clown car and it is so goddamn embarrassing.

[Problem Machine]

Also, gg bullshit finally reared its head on my fbook feed when a very political, non gaming friend made a post about how stupid and transparently shitty it was. It was overrun with the pro gg clown car and it is so goddamn embarrassing.

One person claiming it's not a harassment movement can be ignored, but FIFTY people claiming it's not a harassment movement? There's no arguing with that!

... even if it's actually just five people posting ten times as often as is reasonable.

[BusbyBerkeley]

Its especially weird because these gf dudes are arguing with people who are VERY engaged in radical politics and the contrast between the. Is just fucking staggering. It really highlights just how dumb this whole thing is.

[Denial]

Oh, man. Rami has had some public Facebook discussions, and they just get totally monstered by, AFAICT, Gamergate Nederlaandse - which appears to be three or four game design students with a _lot_ of time on their hands - and Slade Villenas.

(I take it as a good sign that interest in Gamergate in the Netherlands appears to be sufficiently low that they have to buddy up with Belgium to have enough people for the livestreaming. Gamergate Vlaamse!)

[Gormongous]

Yeah I found out about that Something Awful thread a couple of years ago and it pretty much started the change in my opinion of some random Youtube guy who just talks about the games to noticing he's a drama causing narcissist who is more there to self promote and listen to himself talk. All the while he is a major component of the Polaris million dollar empire. I don't know how many millions he contributes, probably not much, but they do own Pewdiepie.

 

The demanding an apology stuff is just over the top considering no one was directly harmed unless it was a GamerGater attacking and threatening women. And for juxtaposition, there's this this egregious personal attack which Total Biscuit has never apologized for.

 

I looked up some people discussing this podcast on Reddit and saw some of these "ethics now" dudes saying this is a "start." Start to what? An apology? If anything I felt like this podcast was very important and there's pretty much nothing else to say here. Leigh Alexander is not going to stop writing opinion pieces because there's a chance someone on the autism spectrum may cry. Totilo has made the policies as clear as they are ever going to be, made his changes to reflect these policies, and will err on the side of transparency from now on.

 

What I was thinking about last night is, what would the ultimate point of an apology from Patricia Hernandez be? What would it accomplish if TotalBiscuit's wildest dreams in that respect are realized, and all professional journalists not only issue corrections to articles but also write apologies to accompany them, like they're politicians who've betrayed the public trust or something? Would the added humiliation of it make them less likely to make mistakes? Are people more likely to trust journalists if the latter are forced to publicize every one of those mistakes?

 

Of course not. It's not about improving journalistic standards, it's about getting a progressive feminist voice to abase itself in front of #GamerGate so they can feel gratified and claim another "win." The fact that TB insists on it even when Totilo points out how unnecessary and pointless it would be is goddamn embarrassing, but looking at the whole of the podcast and the article ProblemMachine posted, it appears as though TB doesn't have any shame.

[Nachimir]

Oh, man. Rami has had some public Facebook discussions, and they just get totally monstered by, AFAICT, Gamergate Nederlaandse - which appears to be three or four game design students with a _lot_ of time on their hands - and Slade Villenas.

 

 

I think they're students from his former school, too.

 

I'm always amazed at how patient Rami is in those discussions on Facebook, and how doggedly persistent the people trying to justify harassment/meritocracy/libertarianism/sexism/etc. are.

[Roderick]

"Gamergate Nederlaandse" is fantastic, I wish they'd call themselves this. On my Facebook page (filled with Dutch friends), there were exactly two people passionately pro-GG, and dozens outspokenly against. When I posted my critical podcast dissecting the movement/farce, they kept silent after. I think it's a pretty non-thing here. I'm so happy with Rami though, he's a cool dude.

[thefncrow]

TotalBiscuit did a response to one of the responses that pointed out how that comment from earlier is full of horseshit, and he writes in this one of the more reprehensible things I've seen come out of Gamergate, in response to being called out for saying Anita got "alleged death threats":

I'm also not going to claim they were credible because well, Anita is still breathing

He's somehow managed to find a new low after spending quite some time plumbing the depths of how low a person can sink.

[Bjorn]

Denial, I saw that. Someone in that thread said they aren't pro-gg, they're anti-anti-gg.

Wouldn't surprise me to see this become the next smokescreen, distancing oneself from gamergate while still being able to stand by all the things associated with gamergate. Then they can very naturally slip off the "actually ethics" shroud and slip into their "actually, it's about a harassment campaign targeting gamers" robe.

Reading that thread, naïve is the word that kept popping into my head. Just completely and totally naïve, about so much.

[JonCole]

TotalBiscuit did a response to one of the responses that pointed out how that comment from earlier is full of horseshit, and he writes in this one of the more reprehensible things I've seen come out of Gamergate, in response to being called out for saying Anita got "alleged death threats":

He's somehow managed to find a new low after spending quite some time plumbing the depths of how low a person can sink.

 

Source?

[thefncrow]

Source?

The quote might be off because I took it from a transcript because I can't listen to it at work, but it seems like TB posted the transcript, so...

Audio version: https://soundcloud.com/totalbiscuit/a-response-to-yts-senior-curator-re-gamergate (7:40 in, supposedly)

Transcript I saw and took the quote from:

http://blueplz.blogspot.com/2014/11/my-reply-to-earnest-petties-critique-of.html?m=1

For reference, the very slightly different quote I've seen on Twitter referencing the audio:

I’m also not going to claim they were credible, because, well, to put it bluntly, Anita is still breathing.

[sclpls]

What I was thinking about last night is, what would the ultimate point of an apology from Patricia Hernandez be? What would it accomplish if TotalBiscuit's wildest dreams in that respect are realized, and all professional journalists not only issue corrections to articles but also write apologies to accompany them, like they're politicians who've betrayed the public trust or something? Would the added humiliation of it make them less likely to make mistakes? Are people more likely to trust journalists if the latter are forced to publicize every one of those mistakes?

 

Of course not. It's not about improving journalistic standards, it's about getting a progressive feminist voice to abase itself in front of #GamerGate so they can feel gratified and claim another "win." The fact that TB insists on it even when Totilo points out how unnecessary and pointless it would be is goddamn embarrassing, but looking at the whole of the podcast and the article ProblemMachine posted, it appears as though TB doesn't have any shame.

 

Yeah the whole apology thing is weird. As you said, I get when politicians do it. But outside of that public apologies often feel unseemly to me, especially in the context of one being issued at the behest of another party. I work in trademark law, and I know when we find infringing parties in South Korea, for example, part of the settlement terms frequently involves issuing a public apology for the trademark infringement. And I guess that is just part of the legal culture there, but we would never imagine doing that in the U.S. You just stop the infringement and pay out some money and it's all water under the bridge at that point.

 

Really, I think the demand for an apology is like looking for some sort of justification that it isn't about harassment. And its always been too late for that.

[sclpls]

Also, that quote. New low indeed.

[Gnome]

And, just for fun:

 

TB: I've received numerous death threats, some of which, one would say, were credible because they contained specific personal information.

[Gormongous]

I’m also not going to claim they were credible, because, well, to put it bluntly, Anita is still breathing.

 

I know it's something said offhand in an attempt to justify a larger (and equally ignorant) point, but I am stunned by a statement like this from someone who claims to any sort of objectivity, even as a rhetorical gesture. TotalBiscuit, you don't need to invent this concept of death threats being "credible" only when they lead to the death of the person under threat. We already have a word for it, which you are welcome to use. It's "murder." In that sense, you are correct to state that Anita Sarkeesian has not yet been murdered. You are incorrect to say that she has not received "credible" death threats, because at least some of the threats she has received have been sufficient to involve law enforcement, which has been independently verified by other sources, and they're about as credible as institutions get on a day-to-day level.

 

Christ, the weasel words this guy uses just to cling to the high ground... I think you're right, Nachmir, that we should just be ignoring him now. By his logic, the class D felony of "threatening the President of the United States" is a legal impossibility because it would only be invoked if a successful assassination were made, in which case the charges would be first-degree murder and high treason instead. It would take ten seconds of self-reflection to come up with any number of contradictions like this, but TB just wants to be right, so he doesn't make the time.

[syntheticgerbil]

He's somehow managed to find a new low after spending quite some time plumbing the depths of how low a person can sink.

Quote

 

I’m also not going to claim they were credible, because, well, to put it bluntly, Anita is still breathing.

Hah okay? Do we only assess death threats only after someone is killed now? What country has a law enforcement agency that does this?

 

In some off hand thread on Neogaf, I saw one of TB's fans touting his intelligence by saying something like, "He's a lawyer or at least studied law at some point." Wikipedia does indeed say he took some classes. Guess he didn't get too far.

[sclpls]

Also it would be a mistake to think that intelligence was a necessary condition for attending, or even completing, law school.

[Bjorn]

TB once tweeted a link to that SA rant. Maybe in five or six years he'll look back and want to punch 2014 TotalBiscuit as well.



On his above longer reply of his, as bad as the Anita line is, what's more damning to me is his claim that all the misinformation early on was caused by the MASS CENSORSHIP! of sites shutting down discussions of the Zoe Post. Because a conspiracy about shutting down conversation about Kotaku's ethics is way more believable than site owners and mods being really fucking uncomfortable with people dissecting a woman's sex life and failed relationship. This is more damning to me because there is a, sadly familiar, strain of a lack of empathy and an unwillingness to think critically about a situation. Quinn, and likely Sarkeesian as well, do not feel like people when he talks about them. They are characters in a piece of entertainment to be judged. And he rants about the DMCA takedown of MundaneMatt's video, which I had kind of completely forgotten about. Fuck if I know what I would do if a bunch of fuckheads were suddenly uploading hours of videos with them talking about my personal life. I might try to instinctively kill it, even knowing it's not going to work.