Life

[Twig]

That's what everyone says, but I don't buy it. I've had a negative attitude about my entire life for the duration of my entire life, and I still manage to succeed and fail at pretty even rates!

[Nappi]

That ratio sounds pretty poor actually.

[Twig]

So you're telling me that throughout your entire life you've succeeded far more than you've failed? Pretty sure that on average people fail more than they succeed...

[Zeusthecat]

So you're telling me that throughout your entire life you've succeeded far more than you've failed? Pretty sure that on average people fail more than they succeed...

 

I look at every failure as a success because they usually succeed in preventing me from making the same mistakes in the future.

[Twig]

Sure it's all about how you react to your failures that defines you as a successful (or not) human being. But that's a different issue. My point was more that I find it incredibly unbelievable that people tend to succeed more than they fail. On the contrary, I think most extremely "successful" people will acknowledge that they fail, and they fail a lot.

[Thrik]

We're not talking about life though, we're talking about job interviews. In that context, I've never failed to get the job, and I don't believe that it's just about skills beside I've never even had to do a coding test — it's the contagious positivity and enthusiasm.

Negative thinking not only costs you many opportunities, it makes any blow feel a thousand times worse. Eliminate it and it doesn't even matter if you succeed or fail. But you'll fail less in certain scenarios (i.e. any that involve someone rejecting you).

That's my theory, anyway.

[Twig]

We are talking about life because that's where I brought the conversation and then Nappi responded.

 

But to bring it back, I disagree. I don't get jobs because I'm not experienced enough, or I forget easy answers because I'm nervous, not because I'm being negative. I'm actually pretty positive and excited once I get into the interview. It doesn't matter. They don't like me because I'm not good enough, not because of my non-existent shitty attitude.

Also, you try being positive after being jobless for almost a year and having failed dozens of interviews. Please. I challenge you. Fuck.

[Zeusthecat]

We are talking about life because that's where I brought the conversation and then Nappi responded.

 

But to bring it back, I disagree. I don't get jobs because I'm not experienced enough, or I forget easy answers because I'm nervous, not because I'm being negative. I'm actually pretty positive and excited once I get into the interview. It doesn't matter. They don't like me because I'm not good enough, not because of my non-existent shitty attitude.

Also, you try being positive after being jobless for almost a year and having failed dozens of interviews. Please. I challenge you. Fuck.

 

I think it's one thing to be positive and enthusiastic in an interview and another thing entirely to actually adopt a positive mentality as part of the way you live life. I am generally a pretty optimistic and positive person and I feel like those qualities are directly responsible for the level of confidence I have in myself and my abilities. As someone who used to have pretty low self esteem and very little confidence, I have found that my "success" rate in life has improved dramatically as I've learned to stay optimistic and think positively.

[Thrik]

It sounds difficult. Do you get feedback from them about why exactly you're not ticking the boxes? It's hard to say this without sounding like I'm trying to be an ass (I'm honestly not), but it seems like that's a lot of interviews to go through without even one offer. Even when I had literally no experience I was able to get offers because I'd done a fair amount of hobby projects I could demonstrate.

I don't know what kind of jobs you've been applying for, but with your latest interview I would imagine an employer would love to see game projects you've developed using your time out of work. If these don't exist, you're at an immediate disadvantage to the candidates that have them — and they will.

If that's covered, it could come down to interview confidence. Have you considered mock interviews with friends, so you can see how you cope with difficult questions when it's not just you by yourself or some actual interviewer? Ask them for honest opinions on how you present yourself.

[Gormongous]

I think it's one thing to be positive and enthusiastic in an interview and another thing entirely to actually adopt a positive mentality as part of the way you live life. I am generally a pretty optimistic and positive person and I feel like those qualities are directly responsible for the level of confidence I have in myself and my abilities. As someone who used to have pretty low self esteem and very little confidence, I have found that my "success" rate in life has improved dramatically as I've learned to stay optimistic and think positively.

 

Yeah, but sometimes life just fucks you. I really don't like a set of ontological principles that doesn't allow you to be bummed out about that. I've had bad streaks of luck on the job market, though nothing as torturous as with Twig, and I really think it's wrong even to imply the reason that I was passed over or that the company botched the hiring process is because I wasn't fucking positive enough in my daily outlook. This isn't The Secret.

[Twig]

The feedback is literally always "We're looking for someone more experienced". EDIT: Actually the latest one his feedback was "You just don't know enough about programming," which was a joke because he asked me three specific questions that I just plain didn't have the answers for because, as I told him before the interview started, I was very new to what he asked me about. I answered all the other questions fine. Felt pretty bullshit to me, but whatever, I guess they're looking for someone... more experienced.

 

I've had one offer, but they ended up rescinding it because a contract fell through and they couldn't hire anyone. I had two more interviews that I think I would have led to an offer except basically the same thing happened (as I heard from other people who worked there). But they didn't say so directly to me, so I'm unsure.

 

I don't have a lot of personal projects because I'm constantly fucking miserable and depressed, and as a result unmotivated. And that's not something that's going to change anytime soon. I was more motivated when I had a job, but also was just exhausted. Immediately after getting laid off is when I started working on a lot of things, but most of them went nowhere (just duds of ideas, which is fine, but hard to show off). And then over time I lost all that motivation as I went through more and more interviews that led nowhere.

 

But yeah it's all just as easy as having a more positive outlook on life. EDIT: What Gormongous said, basically.

[Professor Video Games]

I don't think a positive attitude is as important as confidence and good communication. I was technically underqualified for my current job, but my interviewers could see what I should know based on my resume, and they asked questions based on that. So assuming the answers to their questions are somewhere in your brain, explain yourself and your thinking clearly and if you need to ask questions, don't feel embarrassed to. A good interviewer will be patient if your stressing out a bit. I'm in hardware engineering, not software, but I think the point of the interview is roughly the same...they want to see how you think and solve problems and how you would be to work with. If they thought you couldn't handle the job based on qualifications, you wouldn't have gotten the call in the first place.

[Zeusthecat]

Yeah, but sometimes life just fucks you. I really don't like a set of ontological principles that doesn't allow you to be bummed out about that. I've had bad streaks of luck on the job market, though nothing as torturous as with Twig, and I really think it's wrong even to imply the reason that I was passed over or that the company botched the hiring process is because I wasn't fucking positive enough in my daily outlook. This isn't The Secret.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean for what I said to come across that way. I'm really just trying to say that I think maintaining a positive outlook on life will yield better results than maintaining a negative outlook on life. Not that it's the end all solution for all problems. Of course Twig has every right to be negative as hell at this point and I don't think he's wrong for feeling that way. Just trying to offer some dumb advice.

[undermind9]

Free cell is my at work past time. Some stupid amount of games played, unfortunately only a 60% win rate when I would close/forfeit when people walk by... Now just minimize

attached freecell stats.  only 1 game today, been busy.

 

i need to start figuring out how to transfer windows XP free cell & stats to a future windows 7/8 desktop that i'll inevitably have to upgrade to

[Twig]

Anyway uh I appreciate the advice guys but no offense I've heard it all before. I really just wanted to vent a little bit of stress and anxiety before the interview actually happened and then it all turned into this. U:

[Professor Video Games]

Here's my real advice. Every time a company interviews you and rejects you, hold a grudge against them forever.

[Nappi]

So you're telling me that throughout your entire life you've succeeded far more than you've failed? Pretty sure that on average people fail more than they succeed...

 

Heh, I guess it depends on what you count as success and failure (which, by the way, lets not try to define here). I can't remember that many big failures in my recent past (although, I assure you, I'm quite capable of disappointing myself), but in my case it might come down to lack of trying (only a few job interviews, easy courses, that kind of stuff). If you count the really small stuff, I'm a fucking success machine (I seldom miss a bus or trip over while carrying my lunch, and so on).

 

Anyway, nevermind, it was mostly a jokey comment. Good luck with the interview! I hope you'll catch a break soon.

[tegan]

you were born a winner; you were the fastest sperm

 

OuO

[Twig]

Hah, nice.

 

Well the interview went okay I think?! they are looking for a senior-level programmer, but they're interviewing everyone of any level just in case they find someone good. It was a more casual interview than I was expecting, but I think it went okay because we talked about games and game development and I love talking about games and game development. I'm not sure I expect it to go further, regardless, but I won't be upset if it doesn't.

 

Now to apply to a billion other places that some friends here in Seattle told me are hiring. Wokka wokka.

[Dewar]

I've known a couple of smart and super motivated individuals who have been unemployed for the better part of a year. The job market is just strange right now.

[Ucantalas]

you were born a winner; you were the fastest sperm

 

OuO

After that I retired from racing altogether, keeping my undefeated streak intact forever.

[miffy495]

everything hurts

edit: i also cannot get the smell of stale beer out of my hair.

 

Happy birthday?

[Golden Calf]

Man I hate positivity for positivity's sake. Obviously, if you are excessively nervous or downbeat in an interview setting so that you come off as an unappealing candidate, you can work on your affect through practice, or if you have a serious mental health condition, that should be addressed. But I absolutely disagree that forced positivity is anything close to a guarantor of eventual success.

 

I had a truly miserable upbringing, for various reasons not worth going into, but it was the hatred for my circumstances and surroundings that motivated me to leave them behind and create a better life for myself. I have never been positive about my future or expected that things will work out so long as I keep the right attitude, and that has forced me to work very hard to assemble the sort of life that I want to lead. My distaste for various world views and ideologies I grew up around has pushed me to find values that I care about and find meaningful. Positivity can go hand in hand with complacency, and several of the most assiduously positive people I grew up around are stuck back in my shitty hometown in circumstances that I would be unhappy with.

 

If positivity works for you, I am sincerely happy for you, and wish you continued success. But for others of us, being positive is just another thing we aren't doing right, or seems like an attempt to paper over things that make us unhappy.

 

Twig, I think you might like these two interviews and the books they're about (they made me happy, anyway).

[Merus]

Well the interview went okay I think?! they are looking for a senior-level programmer, but they're interviewing everyone of any level just in case they find someone good. It was a more casual interview than I was expecting, but I think it went okay because we talked about games and game development and I love talking about games and game development. I'm not sure I expect it to go further, regardless, but I won't be upset if it doesn't.

 

This sounds positive: it sounds like a) they care about more than just the problem in front of them and  you're a cultural fit. It probably won't go further with that position, but if they're keeping eyes out for good people, they might well take the next opportunity they get to bring you aboard.

 

Doesn't help the money situation, but it's nice to know that the kind of people you want to be hired by are also the kind of people who'd hire you if they could.

[Codicier]

My body seems to have gone slightly off kilter since monday

I got about 3-4 hours sleep that night & the same again tuesday. Idk why.  I'm not feeling particularly stressed atm, and its not hot enough to be uncomfortable for me I just can seem to sleep. So because of that I have spent the whole of today really tired and unfocused, almost fuzzy, like I was a little drunk