Mington

Dark Souls 2 (Dark Souls successor (Demon's Souls successor))

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I was confused because I saw a tweet from Patrick Klepek claiming that people would need to buy the new version. Digging up a little more on it, their messaging regarding the PC version has been a little confusing.

 

So yeah, it's kind of wait and see exactly what's happening at this point.

Yeah, the wording about what exactly they're doing on the PC side of things has been super confusing.

On the whole, it certainly doesn't seem that they're just updating the visuals or anything, the trailer they put out had new voice-over and footage of new fights in new areas that do not exist in either the DLC packs or the core game, and there's been some murmurs that they may be folding some of the features that have been talked about for Bloodborne back into Dark Souls 2.

Whatever it ends up being, it sounds like a fairly significant update. However, the way things are being worded makes it sound like some of it is going to be patched into existing versions and that some of it is potentially going to be exclusive to the new versions on PS4 and XBO, which leaves the PC version in a really murky place with the possibility of two similar versions of the same game appearing alongside eachother and negatively affecting the online experience for both.

(It's also worth noting that the trailer they put out does not look like a significant visual upgrade, it looks about par with the PC version. It's probably not going to be a massive visual overhaul that suddenly makes the game look like the early preview builds everybody got so up in arms about.)

 

I think you're both in agreement with me that it seems crazy not to have there be some kind of DLC "upgrade pack" for the base game in order to keep the community mostly together, but who knows what the minds at Namco-Bandai are thinking? For me, it's really the difference between buying a DLC but not buying a completely new game, but maybe they think a total relaunch as a "new" product will motivate more buyers with different feelings than me about Dark Souls 2?

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I had missed the news that some of the new content from Scholar of the First Sin has already been patched into the old versions of DS2.  The PS4/X1 versions are still coming, and the new PC version will split the player base.  That finally makes a bit of sense.  They basically claim that the upgrade to DX11, new enemy AI, upping the player count to 6 and the complete re-haul of enemy type and placement is too much to patch into the old version.  Which, eh, probably true.  If they could patch it in and charge for the update, they probably would. 

 

My two most played games from last year were DS2 and BoI: Rebirth.  With this and the Afterbirth expansion to Rebirth, that might end up being true again. 

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Ugh well that's crap for me. DS2 was my one big purchase of last year. What I have for my gaming budget this year isn't going to go into rebuying the same game despite the promise of an enjoyable experience.

 

I'll have to hope that they do discount for previous owners. It might be a shitty way to frame it but I don't want to pay for work they've already done on the project twice. Perfectly happy to pay for the new work costs though.

 

Edit: okay the article above kind of fixes that dilemma for me but it's still hard to justify the purchase with my constraints specifically.

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I had missed the news that some of the new content from Scholar of the First Sin has already been patched into the old versions of DS2.  The PS4/X1 versions are still coming, and the new PC version will split the player base.  That finally makes a bit of sense.  They basically claim that the upgrade to DX11, new enemy AI, upping the player count to 6 and the complete re-haul of enemy type and placement is too much to patch into the old version.  Which, eh, probably true.  If they could patch it in and charge for the update, they probably would. 

 

My two most played games from last year were DS2 and BoI: Rebirth.  With this and the Afterbirth expansion to Rebirth, that might end up being true again. 

 

That article more or less states outright that only the DX11 changes are exclusive to the new release, but that can't be right, can it?

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That article more or less states outright that only the DX11 changes are exclusive to the new release, but that can't be right, can it?

 

In the comments, a Polygon moderator clarifies that there are a bunch of things (specifically the ones I mentioned) that are exclusive to the re-release and not in the patched version.  I was also confused when first reading the article. 

 

The stuff that was patched in is the new First Scholar npc, another npc, and a few other things. 

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I have to admit that's kind of shitty from a consumer standpoint, especially when the game isn't even a year old (!!), but I was holding off on this to try out the supposedly excellent DLC and I don't altogether hate the idea of a player base purge to come in fresh again...

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Wow, the changes in the Feb. 5th patch are actually really extensive.

This stuff is really making me want to fire up DS2. I wonder if there is any chance of being able to import existing PC characters to the new version? I've got a half dozen themed characters I really, really like and would be super bummed to not be able to play without having to rebuild them in the new version.

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Scholar of the First Sin comes out tomorrow on PC (and a week later for the consoles)!  Man, sure am glad I'm not already obsessed with another Souls game to play right now....oh, wait.  It's probably good for From though, with all the ballyhoo about Bloodborne, X1 and PC players who want in on some fresh Souls action have something to buy. 

 

I think most of this information had been dribbled out, but there's a cohesive FAQ up now about the Scholar edition.   On PC there are special upgrade prices, $30 for existing owners with no/some DLC and $20 for existing owners with all DLC.  The biggest, and completely expected, bummer is that you can't transfer saves over.  So long Ninja Turtle and Butterfly Ali, your time was glorious, but it is at an end. 

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Oh nice, I'll be picking that up so I don't have to listen to everyone talk about Bloodborne all the time.

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I really really really thought about making a new thread:

 

Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin ((Dark Souls 2 Successor (Dark Souls successor (Demon's Souls successor))) Bloodborne Sibling)

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We could just get mington to rename this thread. :tup:

 

Edit: As much as I love DaS2, the lack of a save transfer is a real killer for me. Unless there's something that's totally worth my time, I don't see myself going back to Majula any time soon. That and bloodborne is just taking up all my time.

 

Also, it's sad that the team within From that made DaS2 are just called 'b-team' now.

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I'm divided on whether to get it. I was enjoying DS2 until I stopped caring, so I don't really know if I want to spend £X on it again to play on my preferred platform with updates.

 

But what are those gameplay updates they talk about? If they strip the stats down to something more manageable, then I might consider it. I hated that there was a stat dedicated to equip load and a stat dedicated to rolling i-frames. Fuck that. I want to feel more powerful when I level up, not feel like my character has become more normal. 

Bloodborne has ditched the whole equip load thing, I don't know if I want to go back to that unless they removed fat rolls entirely and maintained normal and fast as the only two options. 

 

The sad reason for wanting to buy it, is that I want to be able to say I beat all the Souls games.  :fart:

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My impression of this is that calling it a remaster is being charitable. There's nothing even close to a stat rebalance.

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I am very occasionally dipping back into NG+ but after 100 hours I don't think I can stomach any more for a few years. Demon's Souls is on sale on PSN too, and again I like the idea, but just don't think I'd enjoy it enough. Same with Bloodborne.

 

I really really really thought about making a new thread:

 

Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin ((Dark Souls 2 Successor (Dark Souls successor (Demon's Souls successor))) Bloodborne Sibling)

I'm waiting for the inevitable DS3 (which will obviously include a Dark Souls Trilogy Remaster pack) thread. That title's gonna take some digesting!  :hah:

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I'm divided on whether to get it. I was enjoying DS2 until I stopped caring, so I don't really know if I want to spend £X on it again to play on my preferred platform with updates.

 

But what are those gameplay updates they talk about? If they strip the stats down to something more manageable, then I might consider it. I hated that there was a stat dedicated to equip load and a stat dedicated to rolling i-frames. Fuck that. I want to feel more powerful when I level up, not feel like my character has become more normal. 

Bloodborne has ditched the whole equip load thing, I don't know if I want to go back to that unless they removed fat rolls entirely and maintained normal and fast as the only two options. 

 

The sad reason for wanting to buy it, is that I want to be able to say I beat all the Souls games.  :fart:

 

The main change I've heard is 6 player multiplayer and some minor equipment re-balancing to take out some of the cheese tactics and balance things a bit better for that many folks on screen. I don't think they're doing anything too intense.

 

I played through once and was waiting for all the DLC before a played through a second time, so it's only natural for me to get the whole pack now that it's coming out. If I had already played the DLC, it probably wouldn't be worth it.

 

Edit: The announcement at the bottom of http://darksouls2.wiki.fextralife.com/Dark+Souls+II+Scholar+of+the+First+Sin says "New Enemy Placement and Gameplay Design, Graphics and Performance Update, and More Online Players" are unique to the new package and not patched into the original DS2.

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I upgraded to this and I'm enjoying it quite a lot so far, but that may be because I never finished Dark Souls 2 in the first place. At the time I just don't think I was into more Souls right then and there, but now I seem to be ready to play this kind of game again. Possibly because of the intense envy I've felt towards those with a PS4 who can play Bloodborne.

 

What I will note is it seems like the difficulty of some areas has been changed dramatically by altering enemy spawns. There are now big, tough enemies in pretty early areas where there didn't used to be, but on the other hand some areas with big tough enemies have been switched to many small ones. It's a little bit of a headfuck if you played any of DS2 Vanilla.

 

If anyone has the new version and wants to try phantoming together a bit, feel free to hit me up on Steam. It'd be helpful if you were either in the Idle Thumbs Steam group or sent me a PM here, so that I know you're not just a spammer.

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Speaking of Bloodborne envy, I've been playing OG Dark Souls 2 the last few days to tide that over and it's nice to see it's still busy. I played the first Dark Souls way late, so it was a much more solitary experience. Strange seeing the pools of blood and messages in DS2 close to launch, but then I gave up on it after my save file got corrupted when my PC crashed during some online thing. I'm catching back up (and backing up that file every so often), and there are still plenty of people to summon or be summoned to, which is nice.

 

The design changes in how humanity is awarded plus limited enemy spawns really make this a quite different game than the first, despite the directly quoted setting and set pieces.

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Picked up the PS4 version of this the other day as I had skipped all the DLC and I fancied going for the platinum again. It's a difficult game to play in a post-Bloodborne world. I liked DS2 at the time despite its flaws and even though I think it's easily the weakest game in the series it was still my game of last year, I'm not sure how I feel about this version a few hours in.

 

The opening section is pretty brutal. I'm not bad at these titles but I just ran past most of it as there are way too many trash enemies now on the run from Majula to the Last Giant. It's so easy to get mobbed and it makes this release initially feel like it was solely designed for people who had already played it before rather than being the definitive version of Dark Souls 2 it should be. In contrast if you go the other way at the start to the Tower of Flame they've made a number of great changes of which I totally approve - a number of Heide knights, different item placement, and a new big enemy to scare you off running up to the higher of the two bosses in that area from the start of the game.

 

So it's a mixed bag three hours in then. I'll finish it and enjoy it I'm sure but playing it back to back with Bloodborne does highlight some weaknesses I was forgiving of the first time through, mainly with how predictable the enemies are. Every attack from them is a three-hit combo. Every single one. The hitboxes are still awful, projectiles still home in on you in defiance of physics and for the first time ever console players get to experience the equipment degradation bug as it's tied to framerate and is apparently so deeply ingrained in the engine they can't fix it.

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General Souls series question after seeing the interview with Miyazaki on his favourite boss (Old Monk):

 

What are your favourite bosses? After beating Bloodborne, I've been thinking back and Smog and Ornstein are probably one of the greatest boss fights in any game I've ever played. Similarly the Gargoyles in Dark Souls were fantastic because I was feeling so confident until the other joined in the fight. 

 

I really enjoyed fighting the Hunters in Bloodborne, especially the boss versions. Dark Beast Paal was interesting, but I was over leveled when I encountered it. None of the Dark Souls 2 bosses really stand out, and I barely remember Demons' Souls bosses since it was such a long time ago. 

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I think Flamelurker and Artorias are the bosses I remember enjoying the fight the most from the Souls games. Agressive foes that are fair and can be managed. Sif is one of the nicest boss designs, but the camera makes it really annoying.

O&S has been hyped so much I can't really have my opinion about it anymore. It just is.

The Royal Rat Vanguard probably surprised me the most as a boss.

I think the biggest feeling of awe I got was from Storm King.

I'm not far enough into Bloodborne to feel my opinions are secure yet. I've only really enjoyed Gascoigne so far.

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My issue with DS2 is how seemingly every enemy lives on a swivel, and how the development team took shortcuts in enemy design by just plopping more enemies down to call it 'hard'. It's missing the point of Dark Souls' innovation- that you had to learn the enemy, where here you learn a few enemies, then crowd control.

 

Despite putting hundreds of hours into DS1, DS2 I got to maybe 30 and said "Yeah, this isn't at all what I wanted." and dropped it.

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Man I forgot about Artorias. That was a great boss fight - it made me completely change my fighting style to fit his, like a dual should. 

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