"Ethics and Journalistic Integrity"

[Apple Cider]

I'm coming late to the party but the internet has a really interesting method of preserving everything a person does if they stick to a single brand. TotalBiscuit was a jerkoff when I knew him in the WoW community in 2008 and he's only gotten worse over time now that he's gotten extremely popular. He says and does nothing that's fundamentally different from a white conservative man who believes himself to be the intellectual pinnacle and moderately sides with active harassers in video games now, so I find him devoid of value. It's not like he does anything new or innovative anyways but he's still incredibly popular regardless? Pass. Okay. He doesn't even really believe I'm fully believable as a woman.

[Gaizokubanou]

Even if the majority doesn't say or do something specifically misogynistic, if they ignore or enable misogynistic behavior from others, then the majority has a misogyny problem.  His tweet was the kind of logic that people try and use to excuse the majority for having any responsibility for the culture that they dominate. 

 

This is why I would appreciate quotes in full context because for all I know he was either replying to something along the line of what you are saying here (we all have larger cultural responsibility) or something more direct (equating ignoring with actual act) and extreme.  And that would change the meaning quite a bit.

 

And it's still different from "misogyny is not a problem".

[Christopher]

This is why I would appreciate quotes in full context because for all I know he was either replying to something along the line of what you are saying here (we all have larger cultural responsibility) or something more direct (equating ignoring with actual act) and extreme.  And that would change the meaning quite a bit.

 

And it's still different from "misogyny is not a problem".

 

Here is the conversation in context. It makes TB look much worse.

 

TB is explicitly rejecting the premise that Leigh Alexander was correct to call out misogyny in gaming. The tweet screencapped above is one of his two arguments in support of the idea that misogyny is not a significant problem in gaming: (1) there are hundreds of millions of gamers, are they all misogynistic? and  (2) but men also face harassment. TB says it is "thoroughly alienating and disrespectful" for Alexander to even suggest that misogyny is a problem in the gaming industry. In context, TB is saying the above to suggest that Leigh Alexander is a bad gaming journalist for calling attention to misogyny.

 

TB is awful.

[JonCole]

This is why I would appreciate quotes in full context because for all I know he was either replying to something along the line of what you are saying here (we all have larger cultural responsibility) or something more direct (equating ignoring with actual act) and extreme.  And that would change the meaning quite a bit.

 

And it's still different from "misogyny is not a problem".

 

Here is the full discussion - https://twitter.com/chrisremo/status/517848536759562241

 

He's effectively saying that misogyny is not the problem, internet trolling is.

[Gaizokubanou]

Here is the conversation in context. It makes TB look much worse.

 

TB is explicitly rejecting the premise that Leigh Alexander was correct to call out misogyny in gaming. The tweet screencapped is one of his two argument in support of the idea that there is no misogyny in gaming: (1) "there are hundreds of millions of gamers, are they all misogynistic?" and "but men also face harassment." TB says it is "thoroughly alienating and disrespectful" for Alexander to even suggest that misogyny is a problem in the gaming industry.

 

TB is garbage.

 

 

Here is the full discussion - https://twitter.com/chrisremo/status/517848536759562241

 

He's effectively saying that misogyny is not the problem, internet trolling is.

 

Thanks, much appreciate it <3

[Vainamoinen]

John Bain's an interesting case that exemplifies what gamergate does and what it destroys. The traditional, generally accepted role of the video game journalist was one of pure joy in the medium, one of a multiplier, advocator and endorser of all things video games. Bain tried to fill exactly that role when he advertised said stream, but he is not welcome to that party any more. Because of his opinions.

 

I quite liked Bain's opinionated reviews, just as much as I always like opinionated reviews, until this August. Now we're getting a glimpse into his political and world views. From his infamous "minorities never had a problem in the UK" blog post, which essentially portrays the whole issue an invalid "American perspective", right down to his linking to MRA Karen Straughan videos very recently. The result is quite clear: I think his world views make him a mindless if not despicable person, so I am not interested in his contributions to video game journalism any more.

 

Still I feel for the guy. It seems to me he was scared into revealing his not entirely thought through inner self last August. Gamergate posed and continues to pose a dire threat to gaming journalism and indie developers, while the actual culprits – huge developers and the hughest publisher – can do anything they want, getting hardly a slap on the wrist. Bain had to take a side, and he took the side of the people he thought would feed him. He's stuck there now, and the utterly embarrassing, personal and revealing stuff from him just keeps coming. It's just sad.

[Ozzie]

Vainamoinen! It's nice to see you here. I want to belatedly welcome you to the best forum on the internet (in my very humble opinion )!!

[Vainamoinen]

Thanks! I am EVERYWHERE.

[elvaq]

Pretty funny that TB has more followers/fans than ever yet his credibility is completely nuked.

 

Also how is any of this still a thing? Jaysus.

[Dewar]

Being noisy gets you fans. It doesn't matter what BS you're spewing, as long as you are getting coverage on news sites, you're getting fans. No publicity is bad publicity and all that.

[Vainamoinen]

Quite like the "Sarkeesian Effect" makers. The theories these two have been spewing these last weeks, it boggles your mind. Aurini has detailed a "fairly obvious" theory about an eternal and universal cultural balance in the mistreatment of the sexes. If women are mistreated in any given culture in any given time, the men are absolutely equally mistreated, always – it's the law according to Aurini. Meanwhile, Owen's picking on individual sentences of Sarkeesian, ranting for an hour on his webcam. It's really not about common sense, it's the pure clamor that pays their bills.

[Akidu]

Even if the majority doesn't say or do something specifically misogynistic, if they ignore or enable misogynistic behavior from others, then the majority has a misogyny problem.  His tweet was the kind of logic that people try and use to excuse the majority for having any responsibility for the culture that they dominate. 

 

I agree, honestly it seems like he doesn't realize you can be subconsciously prejudiced, which is the kind of prejudice the majority is. 

[Gormongous]

I agree, honestly it seems like he doesn't realize you can be subconsciously prejudiced, which is the kind of prejudice the majority is. 

 

I think, for someone who prizes rationality so highly, it might be anathema to admit that the principal things influencing or even dictating your behavior are things that you do not control and are maybe not even aware exist within you.

[JonCole]

From Intel's CES Press Conference -

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA

[Vorlonesque]

From Intel's CES Press Conference -

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA

It took me a good 30 seconds to realize what it was I was looking for in the pic.  I think this demonstrates why I'm horrible at word search puzzles.

 

Edit: although I think almost all of the things on there would bother GG'ers now that I think of it.

[Argobot]

It just gets better and better: http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/01/07/technology/intel-budgets-300-million-for-diversity.html?_r=0

[BusbyBerkeley]

From a few pages back, but I wanted to chime in on the "sealioning" discussion. So uh, yeah, I don't really agree with the way that blog post addressed it (there's very little room for nuance or like, not-hyperbole on the internet) but I totally have noticed that a lot of the way people talk about gg is remarkably similar to arguments and language I've seen used to try to shut down feminist causes and concerns and it strikes me as pretty gross/weird. Even in the thread, there was a lot of talking over that blog posts points and dismissing them offhand. I know you can't honestly take every opinion and weigh it's merits, but it just seemed a bit dismissive. That said, it's a VERY silly term and making a fuss about it at all seems really strange. And the matter-of-factedness used in that blog made me giggle. It's a cartoon with a gooby little seal! Describing the other people as "privileged dudes" seemed goofy, they weren't actual characters. Just be like "Yo, the way you all are using this could easily be flipped around and it's a garbage way to talk about stuff."

 

Meme-ifying every single thing online is pretty lame if you ask me, requiring people to keep up with terms you make up is straight up dumb and annoying. Like that FullMcintosh hashtag ggers were using? It's just dumb.

 

As for TB, I'll just link his wonderful http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=2634792'>Something Awful thread again.

[Merus]

It really is delicious how Gamergate's violent opposition to Anita has done wonders for the visibility of her work and how seriously it's taken, and their first (only?) big 'win' has resulted in Intel committing $300 million to diversity. It would have been nicer if it hadn't involved vicious harassment, mind.

 

Also I see the Grace Hopper Celebration on that board, and that seems like an appropriate thing to support because Grace Hopper was a badass.

[CollegeBaby]

I think, for someone who prizes rationality so highly, it might be anathema to admit that the principal things influencing or even dictating your behavior are things that you do not control and are maybe not even aware exist within you.

 

Naturally it would require that he accept the fact that all humans are born irrational and so absorb dominant attitudes and values well before they develop the critical thinking skills to properly evaluate them. Not to mention that men are often lead to believe that their emotions don't or shouldn't effect their judgment, because if they do then they're just like those "hysterical" women. 

[Deadpan]

Describing the other people as "privileged dudes" seemed goofy, they weren't actual characters.

 

To maybe clarify that particular point a bit, I think she sees it that way, or I do at least, because the ability to not have a particular conversation and carry on with your own life unimpeded is a form of privilege in itself. Not everybody gets to take comfortable breaks like that. Say, I can drop out of conversations about sexism and then not have to worry about a thing in that regard, women go back to facing all sorts of shitty behavior when those conversations are without result. That wouldn't change instantly even if an agreement was reached, but that kind of time-out is still, on a very minimal level, a way of delaying change and tying it to my own comfy schedule (especially since "I don't want to talk about this now" often means "I don't want to talk about this ever."), in which I implicitly benefit from facing less shit.

 

 

John Bain's an interesting case that exemplifies what gamergate does and what it destroys. The traditional, generally accepted role of the video game journalist was one of pure joy in the medium, one of a multiplier, advocator and endorser of all things video games. Bain tried to fill exactly that role when he advertised said stream, but he is not welcome to that party any more. Because of his opinions.

 

I can't say to share your view of history. Maybe way back when games journalism was entirely about unmitigated enthusiasm and love, but TB strikes me as emblematic of its angry phase, the indignant huffing and puffing, yelling and cursing (see also Yahtzee and any variation of reviews as rants). Then again I never followed him too closely, so the only times I really saw his videos when he got in trouble with developers for things he said previously, and those were clearly never particularly kind. Joyful advocacy doesn't tend to go hand in hand with tantrums about the lack of demonstrated gratitude at least.

 

Either way, saying he was unwelcome because of his opinions makes me a little uncomfortable. Makes it sound as if he was trying to leave it all behind and the organizers were simply unwilling to look past his views on certain things, when it was more a case of them being understandably worried about what kind of people he'd drag to their party, and his following statements and actions entirely justifying any such doubts. I mean, it ultimately all circles back to his opinions, because those inspire his actions and determine his fanbase, but it's definitely also those two things that make him unwelcome.

[Pepyri]

I just find TB to be hilariously hypocritical. He was fairly well known back when DotA 2 was in beta for calling the entire community horrible trashy individuals and in general taking the piss out of them for how hostile some were ingame. Now he crusades for gamers because "only some of us are harassing women".

 

Then you combine that with how he tries to act like one of the "upper tier of intelligence" folks in the industry, while embracing every anti-intellectual stance he possibly can in regards to characterization and storytelling. The guy is a joke, a stain upon an industry covered in ketchup. The one credit I can give the man is his WTF videos aren't awful, and tend to cover exactly what I'm looking for when it comes from gameplay videos and explanations. He's also one of the few journalists who understand the future of the critical industry is personality, which is a sad thing to say(that he's one of the few, that is).

[Vainamoinen]

I can't say to share your view of history. Maybe way back when games journalism was entirely about unmitigated enthusiasm and love, but TB strikes me as emblematic of its angry phase, the indignant huffing and puffing, yelling and cursing (see also Yahtzee and any variation of reviews as rants). Then again I never followed him too closely, so the only times I really saw his videos when he got in trouble with developers for things he said previously, and those were clearly never particularly kind. Joyful advocacy doesn't tend to go hand in hand with tantrums about the lack of demonstrated gratitude at least.

 

Either way, saying he was unwelcome because of his opinions makes me a little uncomfortable. Makes it sound as if he was trying to leave it all behind and the organizers were simply unwilling to look past his views on certain things, when it was more a case of them being understandably worried about what kind of people he'd drag to their party, and his following statements and actions entirely justifying any such doubts. I mean, it ultimately all circles back to his opinions, because those inspire his actions and determine his fanbase, but it's definitely also those two things that make him unwelcome.

 

I'm not sure there was a "yelling and cursing" phase – what I saw was the attempt to grow up, to move video game journalism in the critical, opinionated, more informed and meta level direction. In that respect, gamergate might have set set us back a decade quite opposed to their self proclaimed goals. I was of course referring to the late 80s and early 90s, the coverage as found in my Amiga Joker magazines, which was the purest enthusiasm and shameless advertising (granted, there was one review that gave one and a half percent, but let's not get into that ). I see that as the actual origin of VG journalism. The fledgling new medium needed the support, the acceptance. That has changed, naturally video gaming changed, and Bain was certainly never part of the initial phase. Ugh, maybe I'm just too darn old.

What I meant up there was that Bain was trying to fill a now possibly even antiquated role with his tweet, and he has blocked that path for himself these last months.

Just as you say, the endorsement was unwelcome because of the crowd he drags along, which ultimately harkens back to his repeatedly stated opinions about all the issues gamergate supposedly isn't about.

[Denial]

It really is delicious how Gamergate's violent opposition to Anita has done wonders for the visibility of her work and how seriously it's taken, and their first (only?) big 'win' has resulted in Intel committing $300 million to diversity

 

Gamergate has now raised $300,074,000 for good causes. That's some Gates Foundation level fundraising right there.

[osmosisch]

Vainamoinen, on 07 Jan 2015 - 01:18, said:

Thanks! I am EVERYWHERE.

Perkele!

[Vainamoinen]

Gamergate has now raised $300,074,000 for good causes. That's some Gates Foundation level fundraising right there.

That is... one way to look at it, I guess.

 

 

Perkele!

And, no, I'm not Finnish.