Bloodborne (Dark Souls 2 successor (Dark Souls successor (Demon's Souls successor)))

[Bjorn]

I'm not sure you aimed to go to Cainhurst, as the item description reads "bafflingly it is addressed to you" which suggests that you had no prior knowledge of the invitation or that you'd be expected there.

I do agree that the player was not a hunter to begin with. The hunter's dream seems to be where all the previous hunters in the world have come from.

The doll States that many hunters have been through there and it's implied they all died at Gerhman's hands hence all the grave stones. Plus if you let Gerhman kill you, you awaken back in Yarnham. After seeing that ending I assumed that it's the reasons why all the hunters are hostile. They have all seen that Gerhman manipulated them and now are trying to stop his new hunter. I believe there's something that Eileen says about how the player is still dreaming, which I guess means she previously submitted to Gerhman.

I find it interesting that some hunters attack on sight, while others will cooperate with you or at least let you help them in some way.

 

Did you end up killing Djura, or talking to him (the gatling gun guy in Old Yharnam)?  If you don't attack him, and come in the back way via the door in Darkbeast Paarl's arena, you can just climb his ladder and have a chat.  He tells you something like, "If you haven't figured it out, those aren't beasts you're killing, they're people."  It honestly makes me wonder whether seeing people as werewolves and shit is just a hallucination, and you're actually out in the streets just murdering people. 

[Griddlelol]

no, I killed him, in what is one of my favourite fights. I initially played super defensively and he kept annihilating me, but once I went aggressive I was able to just push him off the edge with a constant barrage of attacks.

I have read that he says that on the wiki. Yours is an interesting interpretation, since I had come to the more standard conclusion before I knew about that dialogue from interacting with the beggar who turns into a crazy beast (well also Gazza, but the other guy shows he's not a one-of)f.

That made me assume that all the beasts were human at one point, but have gone so far down the transformation, that they can't go back and are lost to their base animal instincts. I think the fact one of the old ones the blood is drawn from or for is called Amygdala which from my very basic neurology knowledge is part of the brain where a lot of emotional and instinctual processes occur adds to the idea that the beasts, who are that way from blood infusion/ingestion are no longer cognisant of their condition, instead just irrational beasts.

The idea that they're a hallucination isn't wrong from what we know. The villagers will shout "it's all your fault" at you when they attack you. The insight is called mad man's knowledge and let's you see even more things suggesting that you're developing some kind of psychotic outlook the more bosses you fight and the more bosses you kill gaining insight. So it does make sense. It also makes me wonder whether that is why the hunters only ever seem to attack you, and not the monsters in the area. I know..game play reasons etc, but i thought it odd that the hunters never hunted, except Eileen, who identifies as a hunter hunter.

Is there any explanation as to why Djura is no longer hostile after you have been to the unseen village?

[Bjorn]

no, I killed him, in what is one of my favourite fights. I initially played super defensively and he kept annihilating me, but once I went aggressive I was able to just push him off the edge with a constant barrage of attacks.

I have read that he says that on the wiki. Yours is an interesting interpretation, since I had come to the more standard conclusion before I knew about that dialogue from interacting with the beggar who turns into a crazy beast (well also Gazza, but the other guy shows he's not a one-of)f.

That made me assume that all the beasts were human at one point, but have gone so far down the transformation, that they can't go back and are lost to their base animal instincts. I think the fact one of the old ones the blood is drawn from or for is called Amygdala which from my very basic neurology knowledge is part of the brain where a lot of emotional and instinctual processes occur adds to the idea that the beasts, who are that way from blood infusion/ingestion are no longer cognisant of their condition, instead just irrational beasts.

The idea that they're a hallucination isn't wrong from what we know. The villagers will shout "it's all your fault" at you when they attack you. The insight is called mad man's knowledge and let's you see even more things suggesting that you're developing some kind of psychotic outlook the more bosses you fight and the more bosses you kill gaining insight. So it does make sense. It also makes me wonder whether that is why the hunters only ever seem to attack you, and not the monsters in the area. I know..game play reasons etc, but i thought it odd that the hunters never hunted, except Eileen, who identifies as a hunter hunter.

Is there any explanation as to why Djura is no longer hostile after you have been to the unseen village?

 

With Djura, it basically comes down to whether or not he perceives you as threatening the people he has decided to protect. If you approach him from behind, he doesn't witness you kill any of the creatures down in Old Yharnam (which, realistically you could run through the place, but almost no one will do that the first time).  If you're not threatening them, then he isn't your enemy.  He asks you if you will kill them, basically inviting you to duel him if you want.  And I don't know if it's that the player is mad, and this is all a hallucination.  Or maybe the people are transformed, but can transform back when the sun finally rises.  Or maybe Djura just thinks that they are worth protecting even if they have become monsters.  He's right, the ones in Old Yharnam aren't hurting anyone.  If you hunt them, you do so for sport or profit only.  The Chalice you get at the end isn't even necessary to complete the game, it's purely optional. 

 

Yeah, I've been trying to fit in some of the body language use, like Amygdala, and haven't been able to come up with anything.  Another example of that is the Tonsil Stone.  That's an actual thing, it's a calcium buildup in the back of the throat.  I doubt that it was a coincidence that it's named that, but for the life of me I can't figure out what kind of meaning that might have. 

[eot]

Did you guys see this? Regarding the Doll

Also, there's apparently an item you can give to the Doll, I had no idea.

[Twig]

While running around in the Unseen Village

I keep hearing babies crying

and it's weird. Apparently that's supposed to start happening at 60 insight according to the wiki I checked, but I only have 41! (I did have over 60 before I got to the Unseen Village, but then I bought all the armor sets.)

 

I'm just gonna assume it's something that happens once they sky turns red and isn't actually related to insight. EDIT: And of course the obvious just occurred to me that it's all linked up to that

newborn under the red sky

stuff. So, well, duh.

[Griddlelol]

With Djura, it basically comes down to whether or not he perceives you as threatening the people he has decided to protect. If you approach him from behind, he doesn't witness you kill any of the creatures down in Old Yharnam (which, realistically you could run through the place, but almost no one will do that the first time).  If you're not threatening them, then he isn't your enemy.  He asks you if you will kill them, basically inviting you to duel him if you want.  And I don't know if it's that the player is mad, and this is all a hallucination.  Or maybe the people are transformed, but can transform back when the sun finally rises.  Or maybe Djura just thinks that they are worth protecting even if they have become monsters.  He's right, the ones in Old Yharnam aren't hurting anyone.  If you hunt them, you do so for sport or profit only.  The Chalice you get at the end isn't even necessary to complete the game, it's purely optional. 

 

Yeah, I've been trying to fit in some of the body language use, like Amygdala, and haven't been able to come up with anything.  Another example of that is the Tonsil Stone.  That's an actual thing, it's a calcium buildup in the back of the throat.  I doubt that it was a coincidence that it's named that, but for the life of me I can't figure out what kind of meaning that might have. 

interestingly, the amygdala is circadian regulated, with a much higher activity during the night than during the day linking the moon presence to the activity of the beasts.

I'm not sure it's fair to say you kill the enemies on old yharnham as only sport or personal gain, they do attack first. I would have been very happy to leave them alone, but they started it! Why is he protecting these hostile entities...unless it's the hunters madness that sees them as attAcking first.

As someone who suffers from tonsilloliths, I'm well aware of what they are, but apparently amygdala is also Latin for tonsil. As the shape of the amygdala and tonsil is I guess similar to the subjective vision of a mere anatomist. So I'm more inclined to believe that the tonsil stone has something specifically do to with amygdala, a small version of themself hence why you're spared either holding it, rather than trying to link it to a tonsillolith.

[Gormongous]

chop some wet old men in trash london, throw rocks at a big dog. if you get scared or lonely talk to pioneer graveyard doll

[Korax]

Got in a fight against the Witch today:

 

 

She is indeed covered in eyes, and some sloppy play meant she got in a couple grab attacks, which line up a bit with the eye stuff. Her grab involves jamming some sort of pick into your face (at 3:33 & 4:01). She also drops 4 Bloodshot Eyeballs when you defeat her.

 

Oh, and more Insight stuff. If you have at least 15 Insight in Hemwick, those creatures she spawns during the fight will also spawn at different points along the way.

[Mangela Lansbury]

I beat the witch on my second try and immediately had no idea how I couldn't figure her out the first time around.

Still terrible at timing the gunshot parries, though. Is there some trick I'm missing or do I just have bad reflexes?

[Griddlelol]

Which gun are you using?

[Mangela Lansbury]

I'm still using the starter pistol.

[Korax]

It can take a while to get used to it, especially if you didn't do much parrying in previous Souls games. As a rule, try to hit them just before their attack connects. The window is also timed such that sometimes they might actually do damage just before getting stunned, but as long as you dash forward and get the visceral attack in, you should be able to regain any HP lost.

[Mangela Lansbury]

I usually just dodged in other Souls games, so my problem has been taking damage and making them vulnerable, but dodging backwards and being unable to get back to them in time to run them through. Guess I just need to practice it, then!

[Griddlelol]

I'm in Ng+ and I'm still using the blunderbuss. I think it has a slightly more forgiving parry timing than the pistol.

Are you finding you're doing it too early or too late? I initially found I was waiting too long and just getting hit, so to fix that I just shot as soon as I saw the opponent move, which was too early, but at least I wasn't getting hit! Since bullets are effectively unlimited (it takes ten minutes or so to farm up enough souls for a ton of bullets) you can just practice a lot on different enemies, and you'll figure out the timing...which is basically what I did, and now I find it pretty easy to pull off viscerals.

I don't think they're necessary to actually do gun parries though. It just makes things a lot easier if you can.

[Bjorn]

As someone who suffers from tonsilloliths, I'm well aware of what they are, but apparently amygdala is also Latin for tonsil. As the shape of the amygdala and tonsil is I guess similar to the subjective vision of a mere anatomist. So I'm more inclined to believe that the tonsil stone has something specifically do to with amygdala, a small version of themself hence why you're spared either holding it, rather than trying to link it to a tonsillolith.

 

I didn't know that! That makes a bunch more sense for the name of the stone.

 

 

 

I don't think they're necessary to actually do gun parries though. It just makes things a lot easier if you can.

 

Yeah, you could get through the whole game without them, but they sure are fun!  And there are a few bosses that are way easier with them.

 

One thing about Viscerals, they apparently scale from a combination of your level, Skill and the gems in your weapon, but that's it.  None of your other stats and your actual weapon don't affect it.  Attacking an enemy ready for a Visceral does extra damage, and for some non-skill builds (those with high single hit damage) might actually do more damage with a regular attack rather than a Visceral.  There are some pretty amusing PvP videos of people getting annihilated by the Cannon because of that.

Did you guys see this? Regarding the Doll

Also, there's apparently an item you can give to the Doll, I had no idea.

Yeah, I saw that, and it is certainly possible. But I think it's also possible that's just some other set of clothes that is so tattered that it could look like a bunch of outfits. I can't quite see the brain things fingers well. The Doll's fingers are clearly segmented. If that's a Doll body, the hands should be a dead giveaway.

[Griddlelol]

im not convinced by the doll/singing eye demon comparison. Seems like generic Victorian clothing compared to the doll who is also in fairly generic clothing.

The parries disappoint me in one small way, I wish they had different animations for each weapon rather than the same for all (I.e. The weapon completely disappears).

[Twig]

I beat Ebrietas!

 

She was moderately difficult, but only because she would sometimes do the laser attack even if I was standing right next to her, which I wouldn't have expected. But whatever.

 

I revived the queen but... is that really all you can do there?

 

Then I helped a few people beat her and that was fun. I also used all my insight items and got up to 93 insight. And then spent 18 on fire/bolt paper. Shrug!

[Bjorn]

im not convinced by the doll/singing eye demon comparison. Seems like generic Victorian clothing compared to the doll who is also in fairly generic clothing.

The parries disappoint me in one small way, I wish they had different animations for each weapon rather than the same for all (I.e. The weapon completely disappears).

Apparently if you look very closely at your hand when you visceral some enemies, it turns beastly during the attack. I saw one video of it, but the close up was just blurred enough I couldn't tell.

[Twig]

I fought The One Reborn twice and almost beat him both times.

Too bad he has a giant ass aoe attack that murdered me both times when he was like five hits from dead, probably less. I mean, my fault, I just need to be more careful.

 

Also I think I finished a chalice dungeon? There are only three layers each, right? Guess I can make another one, now? Still not sure I really get what they're for. They're not that exciting. At least the exploring part is always relatively short so the fact that it's boring isn't so bad.

[Professor Video Games]

I started this today and put in a few hours. Total Souls newbie. I managed to get to those two big wolves on a bridge three or four times, but every time they wrecked me completely. I was never able to pull away just one and as soon as the second got in the mix I was done. I haven't tried going back and spending echoes instead (I didn't even realize there was gear for sale yet until I skimmed this thread). Is that helpful/necessary to get past them? Or do I just need to get good?

 

At the start I didn't realize how to actually equip the starting weapons (I kept trying to select them from the inventory screen), so I tried several times to take on the few first enemies bare handed. Not advisable.

[Griddlelol]

You can totally ignore them. Try turning left!

[Bjorn]

I started this today and put in a few hours. Total Souls newbie. I managed to get to those two big wolves on a bridge three or four times, but every time they wrecked me completely. I was never able to pull away just one and as soon as the second got in the mix I was done. I haven't tried going back and spending echoes instead (I didn't even realize there was gear for sale yet until I skimmed this thread). Is that helpful/necessary to get past them? Or do I just need to get good?

 

At the start I didn't realize how to actually equip the starting weapons (I kept trying to select them from the inventory screen), so I tried several times to take on the few first enemies bare handed. Not advisable.

 

Newbie, woo!  The wolves are the short path to the first boss, there's also a long path.  The long path is much easier than they are, plus you'll find some other good stuff on it. 

 

 

Also I think I finished a chalice dungeon? There are only three layers each, right? Guess I can make another one, now? Still not sure I really get what they're for. They're not that exciting. At least the exploring part is always relatively short so the fact that it's boring isn't so bad.

 

They're there for people to grind/explore if that's what they really dig, and the lower depths are pretty tough if people want a challenge.  You get the best gems, additional Blood Rocks (for +10 upgrade), the alternate weapon types (uncanny and lost, have different gem slots), one unique weapon and a few of the highest tier runes.  But none of that stuff is necessary for the main game, not even through a NG+ cycle or two.  The first couple of depths have 3 layers, some of the lower ones have 4 layers.  Plus there are unique bosses down there. 

[Professor Video Games]

Ok yeah I had found that other path, but it seemed like it was leading into a new area so I went back to face the wolves/die. Should have realized I was being told something there.

[JonCole]

I started this today and put in a few hours. Total Souls newbie. I managed to get to those two big wolves on a bridge three or four times, but every time they wrecked me completely. I was never able to pull away just one and as soon as the second got in the mix I was done. I haven't tried going back and spending echoes instead (I didn't even realize there was gear for sale yet until I skimmed this thread). Is that helpful/necessary to get past them? Or do I just need to get good?

 

At the start I didn't realize how to actually equip the starting weapons (I kept trying to select them from the inventory screen), so I tried several times to take on the few first enemies bare handed. Not advisable.

 

The starting gear is pretty bad, so any outfit change you can make will probably help. That being said, buying new clothes isn't the only way to get more so I'd recommend just tooling around a little more if you're having problems with specific enemies.

[Twig]

They're there for people to grind/explore if that's what they really dig, and the lower depths are pretty tough if people want a challenge.  You get the best gems, additional Blood Rocks (for +10 upgrade), the alternate weapon types (uncanny and lost, have different gem slots), one unique weapon and a few of the highest tier runes.  But none of that stuff is necessary for the main game, not even through a NG+ cycle or two.  The first couple of depths have 3 layers, some of the lower ones have 4 layers.  Plus there are unique bosses down there. 

Yeah I mean I know all that. What I meant was: "This is really boring, and it shouldn't exist. Why does it exist?!" I want it to be fun because it seems like a good way to do co-op without making the main game too easy. Except even doing co-op there is still complicated and annoying.

 

Besides the loading screens, this is my only real complaint. But at least it's, like you say, completely optional. It just sucks that there's a significant amount of junk here that I want no part of.