Dual audio in Games (The Weaboo's Lament)

[N1njaSquirrel]

A couple of nights ago, I purchased Tales of Xillia. On loading it up, I was saddened by the fact that there was no option to choose Japanese voices. After the opening cut scene, me and my girlfriend were openly moaning and complaining about the English dub. After 10 minuets or so of play, how we despaired at the battle animation depicting the main heroine, Maxwell, shouting passionately in the heat of battle, yet the English audio sounding lifeless and dull, like she was bored of it all.

 

This was enough for me to turn it off. At least for that day.

 

But it got me thinking. Why am I so annoyed that I can't listen to it in Japanese? Why do publishers decide to only having English audio? It seems like such a small ask to include Japanese audio, and it feels like arrogance on the developer's side not to include it.

 

But then again, I don't complain when other Japanese games don't have a Japanese audio option. It doesn't bother me in Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil or Bayonetta.

 

I have come to the conclusion that it's because the games mentioned are not so heavily anime influenced like 'Tales of' series and other JRPG's are.

 

Anyways. What are your thoughts? Does it bother you at all? Or am I just a baby weaboo, like the rest of the internet says when people breach this subject?

 

(Incidentally, Tales of Xillia is pretty good, and I got used to the English dub after an hour or 2. It still grates from time to time, but usually only when there's some bit character who's there for 2 or 3 lines)

[Tanukitsune]

As a fan of voice acting, it's a tough choice, I follow a few voice actors on Twitter and I should never say anything bad about a game or show's dubbing because there is usually at least one person I like in the cast...

 

In this case Teepo is voiced by Erin Fitzgerald, which happened to be my favorite character in the game.

 

I don't really know any Japanese "seiyuu", but I do like watching shows in Japanese sometimes, but I couldn't really say why.

 

Frankly, I can't remember the last time a show or game had THAT bad voice acting that wasn't made cheaply and quickly.

[Sno]

Regarding not offering multiple languages, it most often just seems to be an issue of disc/cartridge capacity, but i've also seen it blamed on technical limitations with the codebase of the game, licensing agreements with the actors, and other such things.

Bravely Default was something i played recently where i found the english localization just intolerably awful, but that did have the option in there, so i was able to switch it over.

The weeaboo answer might be something about wanting to hear the language track that was closest to the development of the game, and there probably is actually something to that, but the more honest answer is that bad voice acting in a language i don't understand isn't as offensive to my ears as bad english voice acting is.

As a practical concern, it generally makes the most sense for games to be dubbed into a person's native language, especially if it's a game that doesn't partition narrative out into non-interactive story events like a JRPG does. Subtitles can be pretty much impossible to follow when you're splitting focus between subtitles, hud elements, and whatever onscreen action there is.

[kaputt]

Yeah, that's a relevant concern, specially if you're not from an English speaking country. Actually, my problem is no related with dual audio, but with the inability to have the original audio with the translated subtitles.

Here the problem is when they don't offer an option in which you can have the audio in English and the subtitles in Portuguese, it's just full English or full Portuguese. Fortunately, I haven't had a lot of problems with that, I usually can understand the original subtitles quite well, but there's a lot of people that can't understand English very well but prefer the original voice acting. If I had the option, I would probably chose the translated subtitles, sometimes the translators do a very nice job localizing some slangs and expressions, I prefer this way.

As for the dual audio in Japanese games, I must say that I'd prefer the original Japanese voice acting, but localization was nice, so I can't really complain. But yeah, I'd choose the original audio anytime, always preferred that way.

[Merus]

I suspect the problem with Bravely Default isn't that the localisation process was bad but they didn't have the raw materials available.

[N1njaSquirrel]

Bravely Default was something i played recently where i found the english localization just intolerably awful, but that did have the option in there, so i was able to switch it over.

 

 

Yeah, the english was pretty awful in Bravely Default. I changed it ASAP too.

 

 

the more honest answer is that bad voice acting in a language i don't understand isn't as offensive to my ears as bad english voice acting is.

 

I would also agree with you there too. There's also certain character tropes and roles (like moe and tsundere) that never work in english, and just make me cringe when I hear it.

 

Also, English voice actors change all the time. Teddy from persona 4 is totally different from the Teddy in P4A.

[Twig]

There's also certain character tropes and roles (like moe and tsundere) that never work in english

This implies that they work in Japanese.

 

SKIDOOOOOO~~

[TheLastBaron]

This implies that they work in Japanese.

SKIDOOOOOO~~

Nice

[N1njaSquirrel]

This implies that they work in Japanese.

 

SKIDOOOOOO~~

[Ucantalas]

The only time I've really been disappointed with language selections in a game was Megaman Network Transmission on the Gamecube. All voice acting was exclusively Japanese with English subtitles.

I play a lot of my games on very old TVs, so I sometimes can't read subtitles, despite wanting to, so even when the voice acting is terrible, I'll endure it readily so that I can actually tell whats going on. (It has also really shaped my preference for handheld RPGs so I can actually read the text...)

[SecretAsianMan]

In general I prefer hearing things in their original language, whatever the thing is.  Not to say that there aren't good English versions, but it tends to feel very artificial trying to cram English speech into scenes that were clearly not animated with English in mind, resulting in many awkward pauses, phrases, and speech patterns.  Although on occasion the localization proves more entertaining than the original.

[Gormongous]

In general I prefer hearing things in their original language, whatever the thing is.  Not to say that there aren't good English versions, but it tends to feel very artificial trying to cram English speech into scenes that were clearly not animated with English in mind, resulting in many awkward pauses, phrases, and speech patterns.  Although on occasion the localization proves more entertaining than the original.

 

Yeah, those are my thoughts, too. Despite being a huge weeaboo myself, I don't play barely any Japanese games, but when I played The Witcher 2, I had to switch it to Polish after a couple hours, because the timing just felt off with every scene, even though the voice actors were clearly talented and captured their characters well. I just don't think any already good work can be improved by a second director coming in and directing a group of actors to imitate the performances of a preexisting group of actors, you know? There are a couple of dubs that are better than their subs in anime (Ghost in the Shell: SAC and Fullmetal Alchemist), but it's a very special set of circumstances and generally I'd just rather play Metro 2033 and STALKER with goofy Russian voice acting than either goofy or serious English voice acting.

[BobbyBesar]

In general I prefer hearing things in their original language, whatever the thing is.  Not to say that there aren't good English versions, but it tends to feel very artificial trying to cram English speech into scenes that were clearly not animated with English in mind, resulting in many awkward pauses, phrases, and speech patterns.  Although on occasion the localization proves more entertaining than the original.

 

The preference is perfectly reasonable, and doesn't really apply to the amount of anime influence in the work per se, for the reason listed above.

 

It's not just a matter of animation, it's a matter of the structure of the language in general. Japanese in particular has a wealth of interjections that don't have any direct analogs in English. A barely audible "kore wa..." does not mean the same this as "this is...", let alone the fact that it would never be used in the same way. "Itadakimasu!" doesn't have a direct translation, but it requires very little context to understand what the meaning and usage is. Japanese also has levels of formality, which are difficult to translate into English is any form, but they're subtler, so you generally don't miss much except when standard usage is being deliberately flouted.

 

Also, in many cases, even if the actors aren't any better in the original language than the localization actors are, your lack of ability to understand the nuance of the performance means that they _seem_ better.

 

I find subtitles almost exclusively superior to dubbing, but when I was growing up, subtitles were ubiquitous on TV and movies, so I'm pretty used to them.

[TheLastBaron]

I usually will do what's mentioned above and play games in their native language, which is partly because of the pacing and also just a matter of setting when that's relevant.  Russian just felt so much better in Metro since the other option was a hearing Steve Blum trying to do a Russian accent.  That's another negative for English, there are so many voice actors that are just in everything, like Jennifer Hale, and when I hear them it's distracting because it just makes think of the actor and not the character.  I'm assuming it's like this in Japanese games too, but I don't play very many Japanese games and very few with Japanese audio.  If the game has a lot of action I would probably just play it in English so I wouldn't have to read subtitles, though usually narrative moments with talking are separate from the parts of the game where I'm going to be busy looking somewhere else on the screen.  The one situation where I wouldn't need subtitles would be German, but that's basically only adventure games so there's going to be subtitles anyways (I guess there's also the Gothic games, though I haven't played any of them despite owning Gothic 3, Risen, and Risen 2).

 

Jumping back to the setting thing, the reverse is also true as I would never want to play Professor Layton where he is Japanese instead of English.  I also tried watching Baccano! on Hulu or something and it was in Japanese and I just stopped and waited until I found the dub somewhere (I think Netflix, but it's not on Netflix anymore) and it was so much better having people speak English even if some of the New York accents weren't the best.

[sclpls]

I love having multiple audio options in games because if the English voice acting is bad then I switch to a foreign language that sounds cool to me, yet I'm unable to observe any flaws. Makes gaming way more pleasant! I've played a lot of games in Italian.

[TheLastBaron]

I love having multiple audio options in games because if the English voice acting is bad then I switch to a foreign language that sounds cool to me, yet I'm unable to observe any flaws. Makes gaming way more pleasant! I've played a lot of games in Italian.

Yeah, I'm probably more likely to buy a game on Steam if I scroll down and see that it has multiple supported languages listed under full audio.

[SecretAsianMan]

I love having multiple audio options in games because if the English voice acting is bad then I switch to a foreign language that sounds cool to me, yet I'm unable to observe any flaws. Makes gaming way more pleasant! I've played a lot of games in Italian.

 

I agree.  Hearing the native language also helps me greatly with immersion.  Hearing a bad accent or acting job in English will completely pull me out of the moment and is very jarring.  On the other hand, when I don't understand the actual words or have a clear idea of what "bad" acting is, then it's much easier for me to lose myself in it and just enjoy the thing without getting hung up on little details like the nuances of the actor's performance.  Sometimes this also works for games where English is the native language.

[Ben X]

Russian just felt so much better in Metro since the other option was a hearing Steve Blum trying to do a Russian accent. 

 

Is it possible to have Russian voices but English subtitles? That one Thumbs ep convinced me that Russian is the way forward when I get round to playing it, but I don't want to get stuck because I missed an instruction.

[Gormongous]

Is it possible to have Russian voices but English subtitles? That one Thumbs ep convinced me that Russian is the way forward when I get round to playing it, but I don't want to get stuck because I missed an instruction.

 

If I remember, there are subtitles for all the plot-critical dialogue, but you lose the incidental and background chatter. It's a shame, but what can you do?

[syntheticgerbil]

The thing is, even if you have a game that has like 4 different spoken languages inside, often it doesn't matter because switching to that language means that all subtitles and UI will change too. I realy can't think of any game I've played from an international developers that allowed original language and subtitles.

 

I remembered I wanted to play Whispered World with the original German language on since the voice actors were so bad, but no luck as they were not on the disc. The last game I remember being able to do any of this on was Sonic Adventure 2, which I also did because how horrible the voice actors are. But Sonic is mostly horrible anyway and I shouldn't have wasted my time playing that game.

 

I sometimes wonder if I would like Professor Layton in the original Japanese, but I like the U.S. voice actors so much that it doesn't matter to me. I can tell however when they are stretching or cramming lines in certain parts of the cutscenes.

[BobbyBesar]

The thing is, even if you have a game that has like 4 different spoken languages inside, often it doesn't matter because switching to that language means that all subtitles and UI will change too. I realy can't think of any game I've played from an international developers that allowed original language and subtitles.

I'm pretty sure I played Assassin's Creed 2 with Italian audio and English subtitles.

[Twig]

I sometimes wonder if I would Professor Layton in the original Japanese, but I like the U.S. voice actors so much that it doesn't matter to me. I can tell however when they are stretching or cramming lines in certain parts of the cutscenes.

I think this is the number one problem for me. Even if the voice acting is brilliant and the translation is fantastic, it's very rare for a developer to put in the effort (through lack of funds or lack of desire, I don't know, probably a little of both?) to actually alter the cutscenes' visuals to match audio. So the writers have to fill in empty space or the voice actors have to talk really fast. It's often pretty obvious when shit goes awry, at least to me. I'd love it it everything was perfect in my native language, but I'd much rather hear the original audio because localizations are rarely even close to perfect.

[N1njaSquirrel]

I also tried watching Baccano! on Hulu or something and it was in Japanese and I just stopped and waited until I found the dub somewhere (I think Netflix, but it's not on Netflix anymore) and it was so much better having people speak English even if some of the New York accents weren't the best.

 

Weird. I love Baccano! in Japanese more than English. I appreciate that the voice actors would fit better in English, as it's set in the states, but they completely murdered Isaac and Miria. The joy and pizazz that was in the Japanese dub was not there, which ruined the characters, and more importantly, the comedy.

 

 

That's another negative for English, there are so many voice actors that are just in everything, like Jennifer Hale, and when I hear them it's distracting because it just makes think of the actor and not the character.  I'm assuming it's like this in Japanese games too, but I don't play very many Japanese games and very few with Japanese audio.

 

I can pick out a couple of Japanese voice actors in anime (albeit only a few), and I'm usually always surprised as to how well their voices fit the character. Admittingly, they usually play the same type of tropes, although sometimes they are chosen just because they are popular, or they are good friends with another VA in the anime, which is annoying. I think the main difference between English and Japanese dubs is that there is a much larger choice of actors, and the casting feels like it's chosen more seriously. Amongst other things.

[syntheticgerbil]

Funimation seems like they have four obnoxious voice actors to choose from and I absolutely hate them for it.

[Merus]

I'm pretty sure I played Assassin's Creed 2 with Italian audio and English subtitles.

 

The 'English' audio for Assassin's Creed games usually involves a lot of foreign language, which the game translates in the subtitles. 

 

Funimation seems like they have four obnoxious voice actors to choose from and I absolutely hate them for it.

 

Funimation's business model involves translating and dubbing anime as cheap as possible. They operate in a cheap city, and they hire non-union voice actors and there's only a few who'll put up with their shit.