An article for your perusal

[Chris]

Sorry to pimp an article for another site, but I have an article up about gaming retail and you might want to read it, maybe? The choice is yours!

[Marek]

That was a really good read. (It's fun reading polished final articles by you and not having the experience spoiled by having seen earlier drafts.)

I think the "audience already being there" bit is extremely true. I long for the day the whole game industry system realizes just that.

[schepton]

Great article Remo. (Sigh) I know the kind of people you talk about, that just purchase the newest FPS every other week.

[Salka]

1. EXTREME!!!

2. Psychonauts!

3. Grim Fandango!

I was so happy to read/see those things.

[Savage Cabbage]

I used to be a buyer for his masters dog. In the old days, the 'Ico' game would shift units because I bought 1000 copies and filled the front shelf with it for six feet by four. The combination of such a huge display of product, the game running on every console point and me hyping it till I bled internally got people to see a fresh innovative groundbreaking title.

Today the publisher owns the shop window -literally. Ask any shop guy. You may know that a certain game in your area is/about to start shifting units, and you want to let the high street know your store has copies, but you can't TOUCH anything in the window because EA or whoever 'own that window for two more weeks with promo posters and standees for the shitest game ever that isn't even selling that well. And that's normally because there are just too many stores in direct competition selling it for less or with a better add-on item, or, the worst, some huge store breaks street date release because some tiny independant store sold all three copies they had on Thursday instead of Friday.

When Resident Evil came out, I had jumped on it well in advance and created huge sales through deals I made with Capcom for units and promo freebies and stuff. You just can't do that anymore. Nowadays stock is replenished through the EPOS system and often you are left for days without stock for the BIG GAME THEY WANT YOU TO PUSH. So what do you do with the huge gap on the wall where 'FIFA 69 - The road to my anus and yours' used to be? Maybe you fill it with Katamari and get people to see a great title they would have normally never had seen because it was covered over in the A-Z section. No. You. Can't. Because it has dummy boxes of the FIFA game with 'Back in stock soon' stickered on them! Why? Because the publisher has bought a section of your instore wall too! No really!

Today, I can only image the case is worse. HOw any self respecting gamer can work in a store baffles me - you should be saluted.

Remo, you offer some genuinely interesting options. I can see no way for titles like BG&E, REZ etc ever making an impact in current store programs with the mentallity we face.

[toblix]

Maybe this is off-topic or something, but reading the stuff about BG&E made me think of something: For me, loving computer games is like loving some weird unknown band who're suddenly "discovered" and go all mainstream and lose all their "cred". Just like if I say I like Some Formerly Unknown Band Who's Now on MTV people think "oh, he's just "going with the flow"", if I say I play computer games, I feel like I'm saying "I love GTA and Gran Turismo or whatever". I feel childish saying I play games, because almost all the popular/known games are these action-fests. So, if I say I like games, I have to go into this whole tirade about how I prefer the games of yore, and I'm not one of the millions of Playstation kiddies. I long for the day when people will ask "played any good games recently?" in the same way people talk about books and movies today. It's like the industry has gotten its capitalist suit pant leg caught in the prongs and cogs of a money press, and have forgotten their past and their soul, like an old hippie working overtime at some accounting firm downtown or a wrinkled old jazz singer paying a crack whore to urinate on him in some dingy motel room.

Also, I know I just overflowed the stack of useless posts complaining that the game industry sucks and that all gamers except me are shallow idiots who ruin it for the elite connoisseurs like myself by only buying the latest EA crap, but it's true!

[brkl]

I nominate Chris to become the King of the World.

[miffy495]

Crap, I'm one of those people who's trying to dig up a copy of Rez at the moment. It's not that I didn't know of it when it came out. I read a review of it on day one and have wanted a copy ever since. I just didn't have the hardware until a month ago. Damn everything...

[Jake]

Maybe this is off-topic or something, but reading the stuff about BG&E made me think of something: For me, loving computer games is like loving some weird unknown band who're suddenly "discovered" and go all mainstream and lose all their "cred". Just like if I say I like Some Formerly Unknown Band Who's Now on MTV people think "oh, he's just "going with the flow"", if I say I play computer games, I feel like I'm saying "I love GTA and Gran Turismo or whatever". I feel childish saying I play games, because almost all the popular/known games are these action-fests. So, if I say I like games, I have to go into this whole tirade about how I prefer the games of yore, and I'm not one of the millions of Playstation kiddies. I long for the day when people will ask "played any good games recently?" in the same way people talk about books and movies today. It's like the industry has gotten its capitalist suit pant leg caught in the prongs and cogs of a money press, and have forgotten their past and their soul, like an old hippie working overtime at some accounting firm downtown or a wrinkled old jazz singer paying a crack whore to urinate on him in some dingy motel room.

Also, I know I just overflowed the stack of useless posts complaining that the game industry sucks and that all gamers except me are shallow idiots who ruin it for the elite connoisseurs like myself by only buying the latest EA crap, but it's true!

Yikes. In these situations, instead of trying to re-define yourself better so you'll get a little boost knowing these people will think better of you, why don't you instead try to educate them about the problems you see currently in games. "No no no, I'm still cool!!!" is not nearly as awesome as "well the industry is fucked up but here's why" ... or something like that... in my opinion.

From a very real standpoint, yeah lots of gaming has "sold out" but going out of your way to try and bust out some sort of "whoa no way I'm still indie" cred makes me sad.

I long for the day when people will ask "played any good games recently?" in the same way people talk about books and movies today.

That is an awesome thought, and will probably happen soon.

[toblix]

Yikes. In these situations, instead of trying to re-define yourself better so you'll get a little boost knowing these people will think better of you, why don't you instead try to educate them about the problems you see currently in games. "No no no, I'm still cool!!!" is not nearly as awesome as "well the industry is fucked up but here's why" ... or something like that... in my opinion.

From a very real standpoint, yeah lots of gaming has "sold out" but going out of your way to try and bust out some sort of "whoa no way I'm still indie" cred makes me sad.

Yeah, I guess it's pretty sad. I'd love to make someone try these great games, though, but it's like when I try, I can't even sell it properly.

"So, you play computer games, eh?"

"Yeah, so much I should do it less, really."

"Yeah, I love games too. Quake really rocks my socks, and GTA is better than this sweater."

"Yeah, that sure is a sweet sweater. So, have you played Beyond Good & Evil?"

"Uhh, no."

"Oh, you should. It's maybe the best game of 2003!"

"What? I've never even heard of it!"

"No, it's great. You should try it. It's so perfectly good!"

"What is it?"

"Well, you control the young reporter/photographer Jade, with her companions Pey'j and Double H. After experiencing first-hand a DomZ attack, she is contacted by IRIS, who recruit her as an action reporter. Jade is now tasked with infiltrating the Alpha Section, exposing the government conspiracy, and ultimately finding the... hey, are you listening to me?"

"Not really, I stopped listening when it took you like a fucking hour to explain the game, and even then you didn't even mention the gameplay!"

"I'm sorry, I--"

"Forget it."

Usually the conversation doesn't even get that far. It's like the great games can't have their excellentness conveyed orally. There should be some kind of "test or demonstration versions" of games freely available on some sort of global computer network. That way people could try the games instead of having me try to explain them to them.

[Dingo Chavez]

Back when I went to buy the Wind Waker In the importing store that I go to, there was this customer there who started a conversation with me for some unknown reason. We we're obviously talking about games, he asked me what I'm here to buy, I said the new Zelda and he replyed by saying that it's garbage because it's childish. I asked him what he's buying, and he told some new Star Wars game (the first person shooter one on GameCube) and some shit Xbox fighting game that had nice graphics and he was buying it just because it had nice graphics (one of Microsoft's games, don't know which). I wanted to punch the guy in the throat for encouraging developers and publishers to make these type of dreadful games.

The guy actually knew about games like ICO, he just didn't care about them. Maybe it was his personal taste or whatnot. I wouldn't even care if it didn't mean fine game makers who actually want to make something good aren't going to be appreciated.

And even the store owner who knows much about good games never heard of Grim Fandango until I mentioned it to him.

I still get pissed off when someone tells me this game is good because of its graphics. Many of my friends are like that, they see some ultra realistic tough guy holding a shotgun and they're sold, they don't even need to know much about it, as long as the blood is more real it's good. Then they see me playing something different like the Wind Waker, Katamari, or even Mario and ask me why I play these ugly kiddie games, "what are you six?". Even my cousin who's taste in games I trust sometimes acts the same way, I keep telling him to buy Psychonauts when it comes out on PAL because it's great, and he still gives me a look and a probable no because he doesn't like the character design (the character designs in Psychonauts are some of the absolute best in games, but of course that's my opinion), and my cousin loves Grim Fandango and Monkey Island, which makes this Psychonauts thing with him even more frustrating.

Something needs to change, good developers are struggling because of this. I still think it might be a matter of personal taste, but that doesn't mean I need to see a developing house that I love go bankrupt. Why won't some people at least give lesser-known games that they're told are good a shoot?

Very good article, Chris.

[jokemaster]

'Bout the whole conversations about when people ask you 'played any good games lately?' I'd mention Grim Fandango, Day of the Tentacle, Beyond good and evil, Psychonauts or some other good, not well-known game, and if they ask me what it's about, I'll just smile and say 'try it.'

EDIT: BTW, reading that I think everyone here fits into the hard-core hardcore gaming category. Y'know, we enjoy Doom, half life, and all those, but we also know and want more of stuff like Grim fandango, Sam and max, etc.

I definately agree with your idea of a seperate store or something like that for those kinds of games. I mean movies get to be cult movies because, they're in theaters, and those people that are interested in those types of films go see them, and if it's really good, they'll go out and tell everyone about it, and by the time it comes out on DVD, they buy their friends a copy, etc.

Games meanwhile, are released on shelves, and nowadays later released on some sort of pay-to-d/l.

Maybe if we all bought a copy of one of our favorite games as presents for our gamer friends we'd get sales up enough....Then again, games, most people finish it once, and if it's not a huge-selling game, they'll lend it to their friend, and thus sales don't go up.

PS. My mom got addicted on my NES classics Super Mario Bros game. She wouldn't let me use my gameboy simply because she was playing it. I was so suprised that she was playing that I even encouraged her and bought her SMB 3.

[Chris]

PS. My mom got addicted on my NES classics Super Mario Bros game. She wouldn't let me use my gameboy simply because she was playing it. I was so suprised that she was playing that I even encouraged her and bought her SMB 3.

SEE!? I'm telling you!

[Jayel]

White text on black background is murder on my sensitive retinas. Thank goodness for copy & paste.

This isn't really related to the article, but...

It's mostly self proclaimed non-gamers I see who go for those shelf-grabbing games. I've heard so many say "no i don't play games, just cs and battlefield." And variations of that.

[netmonkey]

You actually get paid to write text in 12pt. Arial on a black background?! Good lord!

[manny_c44]

Yeah, I had to highlight the text just to get through the article, white on black is a bad idea.

[miffy495]

I think one of the best solutions was given in a comment someone made on your article in the Shack forums. The game chains need to have a shelf somewhere at the back devoted to staff favorites. Sure, a lot of the clerks don't know too much about shit, but there's always that one (I lucked in and got several) who actually know what the hell they're talking about. Give 'em some shelf space to get the good games out.

The clerks are surrounded by the shit games enough to know the good. Yesterday when I went to preorder We Love Katamari, the guy working cash was just punching in his own preorder for the same when I walked in. Give the man some shelf space and let gaming goodness reign!

[vimes]

I really don't get the concept of preordering...I mean, it's not like a beta test or having your game before every body... it's just having your game at the ime every body else have... and I can't seem to find a studio in which I have so muc confidence that I would buy their products blindfolded. Even now I'm hesitant over preordering Fahrenheit.

One thing that also suprises me a lot is that lots of you guys are still buying in retail store; I've been through too much shit and too much overhigh price to continue buying brand new titles in those stores, so i'm buying games on the net. What kind of stores do you have in your country ?

On a not-so-related note, i must say I'm not quite famliar with the term ' hardcore gamer' .. I mean, what is this all about ? Is this about the amount of game your playing ? Is it about the time you're spending on a single game ? Is it related to your gaming skill?

I mean, watching movies there's, like, two distinct categories of people : cinephile and cinevore. The first one as a very good knwoledge of cinema and movies in general and tend to analyse what he likes, dislikes and consciously choose what he watches.

The cinevore is someone who literaly feeds on movies : he will be glad to watch any garbage or masterpiece he can put his hand on, just for the sake of watching a movie he doesn't know.

What I'm trying to say is that I can't seem to find my place in the current description of the gaming market : I wouldn't call myself a hardcore gamer, but I'm not quite a casual gamer because my preference goes to games that don't appeal to the big market.

Also, I think that the hardcore gamer and the mainstream audience are, right now, two names for the same kind of customer : when you listen to producer talking about UT2007 targetting the hardcore gamers, they probably mean to flatter the mainstream audience by saying they view them as 'hardcore gamer'.

.. or I'm not getting this 'hardcore gamer' thing at all.

[Duncan]

Haha oh man. I just noticed your sneaky alternate Psychonauts cover. Nice.

[brkl]

I think the hardcore gamer thing goes something like this:

If you think you are a hardcore gamer, you are. If you don't, you aren't.

[Aussie Ben]

Great read, Chris. I also like the idea that was suggested, about having shelf space dedicated to "staff favourites" that wouldn't get noticed much otherwise. I really feel myself shudder whenever I go to EB - it's just so...white. And the staffers are so fake! I picked up Scaler, SCALER (low budget kids game), and it was the last copy on the shelf. The guy bullshitted to me and said "Oh yeah, that one's been really popular!" No it hasn't. This same EB was piping out horrid XTREEM advertising constantly throughout the speakers every five minutes, and it just brought memories of Invader Zim with their shop store parodies of hearing "BUY STUFF - YOU WANT TO BUY THINGS, OKAY?".

As a result, I always go to the comfortably dingy and cramped Game Rush. Sure, it's also been taken over by an American franchise, but it still feels like a game shop. And they have Saturn games in glass cases! SATURN GAMES!

By the way, is that the US box art for BG&E? Looks like PAL lucked out again.

[Jake]

I really don't get the concept of preordering...I mean, it's not like a beta test or having your game before every body... it's just having your game at the ime every body else have... and I can't seem to find a studio in which I have so muc confidence that I would buy their products blindfolded.

Preordering exists because game retailers basically admit that they are shit and won't carry any copies of these games unless you specifically ask them to - basically what they're saying to you is "we don't like selling games," because they don't. They make next to no money on a new game sale, so the last thing they want is to have to stock their store with new games that aren't already sold, or to waste marketing money to try and convince someone that they want a game they didn't know they wanted. If they can admit to you "yeah you all know we don't carry new games, but you can make us carry it by paying $10 up front" they don't have to worry about that anymore.

When you preorder, the store gets many things that it's kind of out of control. They get your money up front, which they immediately invest to try and make some extra cash off of, they get a guarantee that they will be able to keep one more new game in the back room instead of on the shelf, leaving space on the shelves for one more used game or strategy guide which nets them more money than a new title, and they get a guaranteed second visit to the store from you, where they can try to merciliessly upsell you on the aforementioned strategy guide, protection plan, used game club membership, magazine subscription, etc.

Yet one more reason game stores are an utter failure if what you're interested in doing is coming in and finding, you know, a good game you haven't seen before

By the way, is that the US box art for BG&E? Looks like PAL lucked out again.

I prefer the US box art by quite a lot to that version there.

[SoccerDude28]

SEE!? I'm telling you!

My girlfriend loves the original Mario on the NES as well. She bought a DS just to play Mario, and she got the 2D GBA version. She hates the 3D Mario 64 though.

And low and behold, Psychonauts is one of her favorite games ever. If it wasn't for me, she would never in her lifetime hear about or play Psychonauts.

[SoccerDude28]

I

On a not-so-related note, i must say I'm not quite famliar with the term ' hardcore gamer' .. I mean, what is this all about ? Is this about the amount of game your playing ? Is it about the time you're spending on a single game ? Is it related to your gaming skill?

Different people have different notions of the word hardcore gamer. On other forums, beating God of war in god mode, or beating Ninja Gaiden is for the "hardcore gamer". On other sites like this one, being open to many kinds of games like Nintendo games or Psychonauts is hardcore. But the other sites than diss people who play Nintendo games as not being hardcore because Nintendo games are "kiddy" games and thus casual. On other sites, only playing FPS is hardcore, although I've heard people say that Halo is not hardcore because it sold a gazillion copies. So like you, I have no clue what hardcore means. It just seems that people use the word hardcore to imply something like "I am hardcore. I know my shit".

[Chris]

I pretty much just mean "People who buy lots of games and who actually follow the industry" which despite what the internet may make you think is actually a very small percentage of gamers.