chumm Posted July 10, 2017 It does feel weird how on the nose all the exposition is, obviously particularly compared to Part 8. If you looked at Bill Hastings last appearance and this one you'd have expected him to have 4-5 scenes between the two to develop from unwitting victim to exposition machine (who already knows Ruth is dead and does a very convincing job pretending that he doesn't and is not at all bothered that the woman he loved was killed by Zone creatures). It's ALMOST as if they filmed two versions of this plotline where they tried both of these states, then "found it in the editing room." That said jeez Matthew Lillard is putting in an amazing performance which is a sentence I never thought I'd write. I wonder if The Zone is a reference to the Tarkovsky film Stalker. In the film The Zone is (from wiki): "an area in which the normal laws of reality do not apply. The Zone contains a place called the "Room", said to grant the wishes of anyone who steps inside. The area containing the Zone is sealed off by the government and great hazards exist within it." Of course we could take that Bill and Ruth would use this name because they are into sci-fi, and Bill notes he reads a lot (Stalker is loosely based on the book Roadside Picnic). Still it may be a nod from Frost or Lynch to an inspiration for the lodge. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phlogiston4lyfe Posted July 10, 2017 (edited) I thought that Lucy and Andy's big scene was painful right up until the very end when she switched back to the red chair and had a very similar devilish grin to Albert's later on. That was very cute, though not as cute as everything to do with Bobby and his mom. I'm glad that she came back, I was not expecting that at all. I loved the little callback to Audrey's red shoes walk from episode 1, too. Also, Diane's outfit is wild. Edit: on a less cute note, I'd totally forgotten about the bad batch of drugs going around Twin Peaks until the last scene. Edited July 10, 2017 by Phlogiston4lyfe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vellan Posted July 10, 2017 Overall, I was glad that there was so much more music than previously. After Episode 8 / Gotta Light, this episode was so normal and comfortable that I felt a bit let down. I could have used more surrealism to ease me back into online furniture shopping, etc. Embarrassingly obvious questions and so on underneath the cut. Spoiler (Missed on first viewing) Tim Roth('s character) says that The Farm belongs to some farmers and they are 'sleeping out back'. A couple of scenes later cleaned-up DoppelCoop and Chantal walk past two corpses. Hutch looks at the sabotaged gun and says 'Well fuck that. I'll get you some real nice puppies and biscuits'. Are these yet more euphemisms for 'friend' and 'gun'? When the Fuscos are interviewing Dougie's boss (is it odd that they call him 'Bushnell' instead of 'Mr Mullins'?), they basically dismiss him and Mullins stands there for a moment making a fist. I read that as 'these clowns are doing bugger all and I'd love to lay them out'. Maybe that's reinforced by him then going to Cooper and saying (paraphrased) 'we'll investigate on our own tomorrow'. Then the exposition fairy then delivers the news that Dougie did not exist before 1997 - so I guess it took DoppelCoop six years to get around to 'creating' him. The explanation that Dougie had 'been in a car accident' explains why no one is surprised that he's acting like a lobotomy patient, but what would have happened if Cooper had travelled through the electrical grid with his faculties intact? It's encouraging that Cooper's blank affect seems to be a result of internal...something rather that internal nothing. Like when it seems that he's staring into space, he's actually watching the flag and listening to the anthem/patriotic song. It says that Cooper is in there somewhere rather than being a case of the lights are on but nobody's home. Ike the Spike leaves a message for JT - is JT the office dude who regrets getting involved with dangerous people? The one who has to 'get it done' before DoppelCoop calls again? It's adorable that - after viewing Briggs' body - Cole and Albert go five steps away for a 'private' conversation AT HIGH VOLUME. Jerry Horne, still (lost?) in the forest, presumably still tripping balls...that his foot spoke to him and said that it was not his foot reminded me of Mike and his/the Arm. I mean, what if it is not Jerry's foot? What would that even mean? Very possibly reading in too much into that though. If Chad ever does a good or nice thing, I will feel very conflicted. He's such a consistent jerk that I feel like I'm being set up. Still, I did enjoy that Truman/Hawk/Bobby kick Chad out and then immediately leave the conference room themselves. The first page of Major Briggs' message includes an image of the Mother symbol, and the time listed is 2:53 same as the car accident / Coop-Dougie exchange, but aside from that I don't know what to make of it. Zebras? Penguins? Ideas, anyone? Blonde girl asks "How can you fuck up serving burgers?" and I think 'maybe by infecting customers with your hideous skin condition'? Pretty sure that scratching your rash while engaging in food preparation violates HACCP or whatever the local food hygiene ordinances are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Danger Posted July 10, 2017 The interesting thing about the Briggs message to me is that it has the Mother/Experiment symbol over one of the two Twin Peaks and the other one (I think, I'm a little colorblind) has a golden orb - for Laura/the Giant? Zebras have alternating black-and-white stripes like the Red Room floor. Penguins are also black and white. I have no idea if those girls are actually aware of that stuff, but it was the first place my brain went to. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chumm Posted July 10, 2017 53 minutes ago, Vellan said: Hide contents Ike the Spike leaves a message for JT - is JT the office dude who regrets getting involved with dangerous people? The one who has to 'get it done' before DoppelCoop calls again? His name is Duncan Todd and his assistant is Roger, so that's a loose one. It seemed obvious at first that Duncan hired Ike but that does throw it off a bit maybe. Been thinking a bit about Garland and his perfectly accurate prediction of when and how the fellas would come to Mrs Briggs for information. The only plausible explanation is the running idea that the lodge/other place exists out of time such that one could observe parts of our world in different times, and he saw an opportunity to make a change by planting the info for the sheriffs. He then relies on Bobby to remember exactly where the Jackrabbit's Palace is, which did feel in character for Garland but was pretty impractical. Normally I'm inclined to not overanalyze something if it is narratively interesting, but this is exactly the opposite, they are just given the answers through a deus ex machina rather than any sort of interesting detective work. It's right up there with Hawk following his magical heritage coin and having a crazy hunch to rip a door apart or Dougie's coincidentally ducking a sniper rifle. The more I think about it the more I realize I liked getting fed bits to move the story along but most of it was maybe pretty bad? Ah but then the marble exchange was so good! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ash_NR Posted July 10, 2017 @Phlogiston4lyfe, I'm trying to remember what was said about the bad drugs, did Red(?) cut something into it? I punched the air as soon as Gordon Cole said Cooper's flown the coop. I wanted that to be said so bad! Also really liked Albert and Constance back and forth. The only thing I gleaned from the recordings on Bill Hastings glorious, Notepad coded website was a "help" found in the vortex.wav at 19 seconds. Sounded a little like Coop, but can't remember when he did that. Unless that hasn't happened yet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
purps Posted July 10, 2017 I half expected the thing Briggs wanted the Sheriff and Bobby to have was the dossier from Secret History. I thought for sure that dossier would actually be a plot point in the show, the way the Secret Diary of Laura Palmer ended up being a major plot point in season 2. Also, I'm sorry but I just don't like the actress playing Tammy. She is just bad. It's a shame because I was looking forward to that character after reading the book. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LostInTheMovies Posted July 10, 2017 9 minutes ago, purps said: Also, I'm sorry but I just don't like the actress playing Tammy. She is just bad. It's a shame because I was looking forward to that character after reading the book. She's totally ridiculous but I think this was the episode where I finally decided I liked her. Maybe it's the fact that Diane is now around, so it feels like at least this isn't some "women in the FBI" stereotype, maybe it's just how consciously over-the-top her last few appearances have been, but I now feel like her absurd vamping and posing is just an individual eccentric TP character trait and it just makes me laugh because it's so bizarre and out of place. Still really hard to reconcile with the book though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Digger Posted July 10, 2017 How odd, especially after episode 8, that episode 9 felt like such a crime procedural. It seemed uncharacteristically obvious in how pieces were coming together and would meet up. I don't trust it. In contrast to this- did Andy ever go back to the truck-owner's place after the suspect skipped the meeting. We got the eerie music and shot of his door ajar in episode 7 and now we see Andy picking a chair? I can't tell how time is passing on this show. How long has Jerry been in the woods? Each time we see a band at the Bang Bang is that another day gone by? Is Twin Peaks time synced with the rest of the action we've been seeing? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
purps Posted July 10, 2017 Regarding that website, people are saying it was registered back in 2015. But do we know when it actually went live? Has it just been sitting there for two years? I wonder if it was supposed to be part of an ARG in the lead up to the show that just no one ever found. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Danger Posted July 10, 2017 22 minutes ago, purps said: I half expected the thing Briggs wanted the Sheriff and Bobby to have was the dossier from Secret History. I thought for sure that dossier would actually be a plot point in the show, the way the Secret Diary of Laura Palmer ended up being a major plot point in season 2. Also, I'm sorry but I just don't like the actress playing Tammy. She is just bad. It's a shame because I was looking forward to that character after reading the book. Yeah, I one hundred precent expected her to take out a gigantic manila envelope labelled THE SECRET HISTORY OF TWIN PEAKS Getting a kinda-sorta throwback to Cooper's Zen rock throwing was okay though! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gamebeast23456 Posted July 10, 2017 I feel like Episodes 7-9 have created this trilogy of high highs and then just the lowest lows. I thought Episode 7 was really fun. All the threads were moving forward, and they were tied together by interesting scenes and good acting. Episode Eight was this cosmic detour that advanced the lore of the Twin Peaks universe in a direction I totally wasn't expecting, but it was made up of really amazing filmmaking, visual effects, music, and some great acting. This episode, while I'm sure is doing something for fans of the story both of this season and the series as a whole, was such a let down. Stuff happens, lore is dispersed, and except for a few really standout scenes I was bored the entire time. The highlight of the episode, for me, was Cooper's little awakening when he sees the flag. That was fun and an interesting way to keep feeding Cooper elements of his old personality. As someone who just isn't willing to keep up with all the threads of this mystery, this might be my least enjoyed episode of the season. Also, the whole interrogation of Bill Hastings was just not good. I do not understand why all the dynamic actors were put on the other side of the glass and we were forced to watch Matthew Lillard bounce off of Chrysta Bell. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cleinhun Posted July 10, 2017 The actor playing Bobby kind of stole the show this episode, didn't he? I would not have expected Bobby Briggs to become one of my favorite characters in Twin Peaks but here we are. That dumb grin he makes when he realizes he's the only one who know how to open that capsule was perfect and I loved it. I don't really know what to say about the rest of the episode? It felt the most like a normal episode of TV of anything this season, which is especially odd coming after episode 8. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jake Posted July 10, 2017 48 minutes ago, Gamebeast23456 said: Also, the whole interrogation of Bill Hastings was just not good. I do not understand why all the dynamic actors were put on the other side of the glass and we were forced to watch Matthew Lillard bounce off of Chrysta Bell. I thought Matthew Lilard did a great job in that scene. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Octasco Posted July 10, 2017 I also thought Tammy's slightly cold demeanor worked well in that scene. She was very calm and business-like while she was asking about crazy stuff like other dimensions and getting him to identify the Major. He clearly thinks she will think he's crazy but she immediately puts him more at ease because she is treating what he says with the utmost seriousness. Still don't think she's a great actress though, but she worked well in that scene. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gamebeast23456 Posted July 10, 2017 20 minutes ago, Jake said: I thought Matthew Lilard did a great job in that scene. I thought he was good, and I think more of the scene the more I think about it. I just think the whole construction of the scene was off-putting in a way that made me not as able to connect with it. Maybe I was just a little too distracted this whole episode though. I think I should put most of my reaction to this particular episode on myself, not necessarily the quality of the episode. I was pretty distracted throughout, and I've never been invested enough in the lore of the series to be immediately grabbed by new information. I've seen some discussion of the lack of breathing room any of these new characters are getting, and I really sympathize with that frustration. I would've appreciated some more time with Bill Hastings before we got to this emotional peak. It just fell flat for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Danger Posted July 10, 2017 45 minutes ago, Cleinhun said: The actor playing Bobby kind of stole the show this episode, didn't he? I would not have expected Bobby Briggs to become one of my favorite characters in Twin Peaks but here we are. That dumb grin he makes when he realizes he's the only one who know how to open that capsule was perfect and I loved it. I don't really know what to say about the rest of the episode? It felt the most like a normal episode of TV of anything this season, which is especially odd coming after episode 8. Every scene of his has been so good. I love that Bobby is in a place in his life where he can go to his mom's house and she's happy to see him, and he thinks of Truman and Hawk as "the guys". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pokysharpy Posted July 10, 2017 I loved this episode. Albert and Connie's banter; Bobby's reaction to... well, everything; kicking Chad out of the conference room; the Detectives Fusco; Tim Roth's character slinging lingo; Matthew Lillard's amazing broken performance; Jerry Horne's duel with his not-foot. But the thing that brought a literal cheer to my lips was Ben Horne resisting temptation with Beverly. He's a Good Man now, that Ben. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Persistence of 3 Posted July 10, 2017 So, the colors are changing from yellow to red. The Lucy / Andy scene underscores that. Janey-E has gone from yellow to pink twinsets. Dougie drinks from a red mug and then is distracted by a passing pair of red high heels. Major Brigg's chair is upholstered in red. If the traffic signal at Sparkwood and 21 is any indicator of the tonal range of moods in the story it's only a matter of time before the color emphasis shifts from red to green. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Filmigirl Posted July 10, 2017 2 hours ago, LostInTheMovies said: She's totally ridiculous but I think this was the episode where I finally decided I liked her. Maybe it's the fact that Diane is now around, so it feels like at least this isn't some "women in the FBI" stereotype, maybe it's just how consciously over-the-top her last few appearances have been, but I now feel like her absurd vamping and posing is just an individual eccentric TP character trait and it just makes me laugh because it's so bizarre and out of place. Still really hard to reconcile with the book though. I agree and I definitely think it's because Diane is around. The cigarette break scene really nails how effortlessly cool Diane is and poor Tammy's vampiness just can't compare, no matter what pose she tries. The Andy and Lucy scene aside, there were some excellent "character" moments in this episode. The conference room lunch scene with Chad was hilarious and the stuff with the three cops in Vegas when their three different colored paunches kind of just fill the screen in a very Lynchian way. I also really liked the conversation with the two women at the end of the episode even though we really have no context for it at the moment (outside of the bad drags going around). I kept waiting for something to emerge from the skin under her armpit... One thing not really related to this episode but kind of related to the discussion on the midseason review episode about the literalness of film as a medium-- A lot of how I watch media now is tied up in the many years I've spent watching Indian, and especially South Indian, movies. Traditionally the storytelling and filmmaking (although this is no longer true for mainstream "Bollywood") relied a lot on allegory and metaphor and on getting the audience to feel certain moods without necessarily conveying the idea that what is being filmed is literally supposed to be taking place. i.e. a filmmaker is able transmit the idea of a young couple having sex by having them sing a romantic song in field full of very suggestive flowers. The jokes about "Bollywood" in American media often rely on a deliberate misreading or misunderstanding of this non-literal style of filmmaking and I wonder if some of the trouble people are having "getting" certain aspects of Season 3 of Twin Peaks ties into this inability or unwillingness to not see a filmed scene as literal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikemariano Posted July 10, 2017 3 hours ago, Digger said: It seemed uncharacteristically obvious in how pieces were coming together and would meet up. I don't trust it. This is the correct reaction to have. I am looking forward to the next curveball that gets thrown at us. 3 hours ago, Digger said: Is Twin Peaks time synced with the rest of the action we've been seeing? As far as I can tell, it is. I've been trying to identify scenes that are shown out of chronological sequence but I can't think of anything not identified that way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Argobot Posted July 10, 2017 2 hours ago, Jake said: I thought Matthew Lilard did a great job in that scene. Matthew Lillard is a really good gross crier (see: Scream) and I enjoyed how those two actors played off one another. It's increasingly feeling like Audrey is the one who will bring back real Coop. His fascination with the women in red pumps and the really, really noticeable absence of Audrey solidified that for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eric Proton Posted July 10, 2017 I never would guessed we'd see Johnny Horne before we saw Audrey. According to the hit counter, Hastings' site has been (fictionally) around since 1997, the same year Dougie shows up. Can't imagine how they'd be related, but it was interesting to have that year referenced twice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tirranek Posted July 10, 2017 I just had a horrible thought: What if Janey-E is there when Dougie becomes Cooper again, and it's like that damn squirrel scene from Sword in the Stone? My heart's not ready for that again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chumm Posted July 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Filmigirl said: I agree and I definitely think it's because Diane is around. The cigarette break scene really nails how effortlessly cool Diane is and poor Tammy's vampiness just can't compare, no matter what pose she tries. Agreed, that scene was when I think I started to appreciate Tammy so much more. She's an awkward dork who uses this persona to cover that up, which I think helps to reconcile her onscreen performance with her role as the Secret History compiler. It also really helped make her feel like a Twin Peaks character, she's cool in the way Johnny is cool. It reminds me of Audrey doing something similar to try to distract from her youth whenever she was around Cooper. It was nice to see her get some agency in the scene questioning Hastings, particularly since she was basically just answering the phone for Gordon the rest of the ep. It was notable too, I think, that Gordon was able to get a positive response from Diane by taking a drag from her cigarette and noting that they used to smoke together a lot. He sort of set up a "Fuck you, Gordon" response from her but she defied that expectation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites