Dark Souls 2 (Dark Souls successor (Demon's Souls successor))

[Bjorn]

I may Ascetic to get a second spotted whip then.  Where does the Old whip come from?  Dual whips also looks BAD ASS, so there's that...

 

Dual whips are the coolest moveset, no question.  The Old Whip is a random item you can get from the crows for stones.  Petrified Somethings have about a 1-in-7 chance (there are 7 items Petrified Somethings will get you), Smooth have about a 5-10 percent chance of getting you one of the Petrified items and Small Stones have a very small chance to get you one of the 7 Petrified items. 

 

I have farmed the hell out of Smooth Stones with the small summon sign on this character to get dual Channeler's Tridents and dual Old Whips, like turned in several hundred stones to get them.  I just picked areas to farm where it's very fast to complete a small summon session so I can crank out a bunch in a row.  Heide Tower early is good, the long hallway in the Undead Crypt is another good one.  From the start of Iron Keep to the Smelter door isn't bad. 

[Winnipeg Fats]

That run from Iron Keep to Smelter was where I realized (finally) that DS2 didn't have to feel so finite with its souls and items.  That was a major turning point for me; realizing that the co-op stuff was a really fun and integral part of the game.  Once I feel really familiar with the layout of the game I will try and run in that early covenant that makes everything harder and lonely, but I've got crazy with the white soapstone in the meantime, and it's make the game a lot more fun.

 

I fear that I've overlevelled now though as a result.  I'm done drangleic castle. And headed... wherever is next, but I've hit SL150 now, and not finding most of the standard enemies take more than 2-3 R1 hits to dispatch.  NG+ will likely remedy that.

[Latrine]

Yeah, my first playthrough I've done a lot of co-op and it's been fun. Some of the bosses are easy enough that the co-op really trivializes them, but for some like Smelter Demon it felt just right. I definitely want to go through again in the Champions Covenant and do all the bosses solo, but being able to get through the game once without hammering your head against the same boss is an interesting experience. I also like that you get massively rewarded for helping other people by having your humanity restored and everything repaired. Jolly cooperation!

[Bjorn]

I spent some time in the BoB dueling in their arena tonight.  That's an interesting experience.  I was actually surprised at the diversity of builds, from the Internet, I had been led to believe it would be nothing but hex spam, Monastery Scimitars, Avelyns and Santier's Spears.  I did see all those things, but only once every 5 or 6 matches.  The rest were filled with a diverse and interesting set of builds.  And most of them were pretty good.  And even the OP stuff wasn't that bad to deal with.  Santier's is a whirlwind of death the first few times you run into it, but once you have a feel for it, you can manage that fight.  I took a +10 Rebel's Greatshield with me, which nicely counters pretty much all magic in one shield.  Once I was on a mage, I could go back to power stancing, and dodge everything short range.  The Monastery Scimitar was by far the most frustrating thing, I had never fought someone using one of those.  Other than using non-parryable weapons, I'm still not sure what to do about it. 

 

It was fun even though I probably got my ass handed to me as many times as I won.  Certainly a different vibe than the Dragonbros. 

[Trip Hazard]

I'm also not a massive fan of the cursed pots thing. It's just irritating, not interesting. 

 

Yeah, I didn't mind that area but for those accursed pots! Hang on lion-o, I just gotta roll over here real quick. Okay, now we can fight. My least favourite area so far is The Black Gulch, where you have to oh so carefully dispose of all of the poison spitting fetishes before you can make any headway. Yawn.

[Roderick]

Ironically, the area right before that, the Gutter, is the best in the game.

[Sno]

I'm also not a massive fan of the cursed pots thing. It's just irritating, not interesting.

If you think those are annoying, just wait until you get to the Gutter with its poison spitting statuary. (I'm with Rodi on it being one of the best areas in the game, but those statues are still a huge pain in the ass.)

 

That run from Iron Keep to Smelter was where I realized (finally) that DS2 didn't have to feel so finite with its souls and items.  That was a major turning point for me; realizing that the co-op stuff was a really fun and integral part of the game.  Once I feel really familiar with the layout of the game I will try and run in that early covenant that makes everything harder and lonely, but I've got crazy with the white soapstone in the meantime, and it's make the game a lot more fun.

I had kind of the opposite experience. I still did NG mostly solo, but called upon co-op phantoms in a few spots and ended up feeling like i was kind of robbed of the chance to learn the bosses myself. I wasn't having any fun having somebody just stroll through my game world and stomp the bosses for me, so fighting the bosses in NG+ purely solo has been much more entertaining for me. (Incidentally, the Smelter Demon is probably one of my favorite fights now.)

The exception i've had to make is the Looking Glass Knight, you can't really solo it on NG+ since hostile player phantoms are all but guaranteed.

 

 

I spent some time in the BoB dueling in their arena tonight.  That's an interesting experience.  I was actually surprised at the diversity of builds, from the Internet, I had been led to believe it would be nothing but hex spam, Monastery Scimitars, Avelyns and Santier's Spears.  I did see all those things, but only once every 5 or 6 matches.  The rest were filled with a diverse and interesting set of builds.  And most of them were pretty good.  And even the OP stuff wasn't that bad to deal with.  Santier's is a whirlwind of death the first few times you run into it, but once you have a feel for it, you can manage that fight.  I took a +10 Rebel's Greatshield with me, which nicely counters pretty much all magic in one shield.  Once I was on a mage, I could go back to power stancing, and dodge everything short range.  The Monastery Scimitar was by far the most frustrating thing, I had never fought someone using one of those.  Other than using non-parryable weapons, I'm still not sure what to do about it. 

 

It was fun even though I probably got my ass handed to me as many times as I won.  Certainly a different vibe than the Dragonbros. 

I've been seeing that scimitar just constantly in my soul memory range. The general rule i've had to follow against people who are baiting for parries is to never initiate. Just dodge and punish, hit them in their recovery frames and then pull back and wait to repeat. Don't over-commit, combos are unreliable in Dark Souls, people mash the parry button and sometimes sneak it in between your swings. I've ended up having quite a bit of success against parry-baiters. (Also, if you keep dodging to their side, you're eventually going end up in position to land a backstab.)

 

That said, it gets a little tougher if their primary weapon is something with fast recovery. I generally always have something like the estoc on hand so i can keep even ground, but if i'm outclassed, i'll often just hang back and spam the crossbow and pyromancies. (Which always makes me feel really lame.) Incredibly, some of the most difficult fights i've had are against people just using a damn dagger in their main hand.

People also seem to have a ton of trouble parrying the halbred moveset, perhaps because of its versatility and broad range of unusual attacks? Still, strategies that rely on the other guy making a mistake are bad strategies, so i definitely wouldn't advise that against parry-baiters.

What would you advise against Santier's? I've pretty consistently been just wrecked by that shit, I hate that damn thing.

[Trip Hazard]

Finally beat the Smelter demon today, woohoo! I'm with Sno in thinking that he's a great boss. I couldn't pull out any tricks against him, just keep my cool, dodge precisely and attack when I can. I actually turned human so I could summon someone to help, but then no signs appeared (I was right by his fog door, and I think they're all back at the first bridge), so I decided to solo him. 

 

Kinda wished somebody had dropped a message telling me to try lightning, though, because that did help.

 

I then went on to completely trounce the Old Iron King. What a pussycat that guy turned out to be.

[eot]

Finished off

Twin Dragonriders and Looking Glass Knight. I feel like I kind of cheesed the dragonriders by using Red Tearstone + resins, it let me kill the archer in four hits and once it's 1vs1 the fight is usually over. Can't get hit, but still. LKG was surprisingly easy too, just strafe left instead of right! I'm dreading some of the final bosses though, Veldstat, Darklurker, Throne Watcher and I've also put off doing RRA.

 

People also seem to have a ton of trouble parrying the halbred moveset, perhaps because of its versatility and broad range of unusual attacks? Still, strategies that rely on the other guy making a mistake are bad strategies, so i definitely wouldn't advise that against parry-baiters.

Halberds have some unparriable attacks. Well, I know at least one of them does, but I think it applies to the whole weapon class.

 

I then went on to completely trounce the Old Iron King. What a pussycat that guy turned out to be.

He should probably have more HP, but I kinda like that fight. Sometimes it's fun to dodge stuff without too much trouble.

[Bjorn]

Yeah, I didn't mind that area but for those accursed pots! Hang on lion-o, I just gotta roll over here real quick. Okay, now we can fight. My least favourite area so far is The Black Gulch, where you have to oh so carefully dispose of all of the poison spitting fetishes before you can make any headway. Yawn.

 

I did that the very first time through, but having gone through it with multiple characters now, I realized that lifegems exist for a reason and don't need to be hoarded.  I would only break a few pots, usually near enemies or ledges I needed to drop off of.  When I get poisoned, pop two lifegems and carry on.  It makes the area much faster and less drudgerous.

 

 

What would you advise against Santier's? I've pretty consistently been just wrecked by that shit, I hate that damn thing.

 

Thanks for the tips on the Monastery Scimitar.  I was trying to either do direct damage with my whips, or use a whip to bait a roll, then try to catch them with another weapon as they came out of the roll animation.  The timing wasn't working out the best though.

 

I'm almost certainly spoiled right now with my build against certain classes.  I was using combinations of Heide Lance, Great Lance, Helix Halberd, Channeler's Trident, Mastadon Halberd and my whips.  I stopped using some of these combinations in DragonBro fights, it just didn't feel fair on NG (probably different on NG+).  But in the BoB, probably 80 percent of the fights are against other people who can wreck you in a matter of seconds if you aren't careful.  So I don't feel bad about using them there.  The dual Spear moveset just seems to do a great job against Santier's, they are long enough to poke them and break their combo.  I take a hit, but only one or two.  And then my recovery to hit again is faster than the Santier's recovery.  Once most of their health is gone, they inevitably panic and pull out the Avelyn.  EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM DID THIS.  Which is laughable against an opponent with most of his health intact.  I've also used my pair of Spotted Whips on Santier's before.  Again, I'm liable to get hit doing it, but once poison is stacked on them and their combo is broken, they either foolishly press the attack until they are out of stamina, or try to run away to heal.  Either way results in me being able to kill them. 

 

Running dual Lances is my new favorite thing. That shit is hilarious and awesome.  Slightly slower and more stamina use than the Spear moveset, but otherwise similar.  That 160 counter damage with the Old Leo Ring on is godly.  If the L1 poke hits, then immediately do an R2, which does the "charge" move but with no warmup animation.  Even if the person rolls backwards, the charge length is long enough to tag them again at the end of the roll.  That combo 2-shot quite a few people. 

 

But other than whips and spear movesets, I'm not sure what a good counter to Santier's is.  You're still using Halberds right?  If you see an opponent with Santier's on, you could just quickly change your loadout to include the Helix for that fight.  If you try it, I suggest infusing the Helix Raw.  It's scaling is total shite, you pick up an extra 15 or so points of damage with it raw versus normal.  Not a lot, but no reason not to.

 

It's taken my weight higher than I would have liked, but I'm loving running with the Rebel Greatshield as well.  A +10 Dark Rebel blocks 100 Dark, about 90 all other elements with a 73 stability.  Watching Hexers panic as you rush them is ridiculously satisfying.  I've had to trade down to slightly lighter armor to make it work, but totally worth it. 

 

Oh man, speaking of great shields.  I actually fought a guy wielding power stanced shields last night (there is one pair in the game that allows this).  Met the same guy twice.  It's pretty amazing to watch someone work that combination.  I beat him both times, but the first time he rolled off a bridge.  Second time it came down to which of us got the last hit in. 

 

 

I then went on to completely trounce the Old Iron King. What a pussycat that guy turned out to be.

 

You didn't notice the real boss of that fight?

 

That little fucking hole just to the right of the fog door. That hole killed me twice as I was learning how to fight him.

[N1njaSquirrel]

Finally beat the Smelter demon today, woohoo! I'm with Sno in thinking that he's a great boss. I couldn't pull out any tricks against him, just keep my cool, dodge precisely and attack when I can. I actually turned human so I could summon someone to help, but then no signs appeared (I was right by his fog door, and I think they're all back at the first bridge), so I decided to solo him. 

 

Strange, there should be an NPC summon near the Smelter demon door. Specifically Lucatiel of Mirrah.

 

I summoned her on that boss fight, in order to finish her quest line.

 

Talking about Lucatiel, I found her in Black Gultch. Oh man. Tears imminent. I missed her on my first playthrough. I'm not looking forward to what's going to happen when I meet her again.

[coaxmetal]

Well, I have to say. Caestus build is super fun. Not nearly as good/easy as my previous hex/faith build, but super fun. I think i'll farm for awestones once I get enough ascetics so I can get the vanquisher's seal and bare fist it. 

 

So anyway, if you haven't' tried it, make a pugilist. It's a lot of fun. Also easy to make, caestus powerstance only requires 15/10 stats, and costs 1000 souls from melentia.

[Dewar]

I know everyone has been just dying to hear about my recent adventures, they're way more exciting than Bjorn's 1 vs 20 high end PVP experiences, and I'm sorry for the radio silence but I was going through a rough patch. I used my Stinky Twig of Yesterday on the statue lady this time through which led me to the Shaded Woods area, and boy does that place suck a load of butts. It's a very, very different area to the rest of the game and those rasta lion men hit like a train filled with buses. I'm also not a massive fan of the cursed pots thing. It's just irritating, not interesting. 

 

Thankfully while I was cleaning my bathroom I was listening to The Crate and Crowbar and they said that the game gets back on track after that area. It's a shame because I really like the aesthetic and atmosphere of the place just not the game experience.

I took a couple of weeks off after beating that area. Everything in there is lightning resistant, which just made the whole thing a slog for me. Not hard, just annoying. I need to get back on the horse here soon though, or else what little skill I have might atrophy.

[Bjorn]

Well, I have to say. Caestus build is super fun. Not nearly as good/easy as my previous hex/faith build, but super fun. I think i'll farm for awestones once I get enough ascetics so I can get the vanquisher's seal and bare fist it. 

 

So anyway, if you haven't' tried it, make a pugilist. It's a lot of fun. Also easy to make, caestus powerstance only requires 15/10 stats, and costs 1000 souls from melentia.

 

It's the absolute most fun build for me.  I highly recommend getting the Vanquisher's Seal.  The limitation is that you can only carry 2 other items, one in each hand.  In order to access your bare fists, you have to have 2 open slots.  Sometimes I run bare hand right and Caestus left hand so I can have a couple of extra tools. 

 

You only need 4 Ascetics to get all your Awestones.  There are 2 phantoms who respawn 12 times each per cycle starting on NG+.  They are

 

both in the Rat Covenant locations. I'd suggest the Grave of the Saints. If you spend an Pharos Stone to drop the lower bridge, once the Phantom starts spawning, you can run across the bridge. None of the rats will cross it, and as long as you stay in the upper part of that room, none of the rats below will aggro you. This makes it tons faster and easier when you can just ignore the rats. In order to get the phantom to spawn, you have to go to the top of the ladder to the upper story, and he spawns on the lower floor.

It is worth wearing the Covetous Gold ring and maybe the Merchant Helm. The rats have a low chance to drop Rat Tails. I managed to pick up a few just killing the rats between me and the bonfire after killing the phantom each time.

The Phantom gets mean starting on NG++. It's pretty easy to cheese him and knock him off the bridge if you have problems with him. Just use a fast striking weapon and stagger him backwards 2 or 3 times. The downside here is that he actually has a chance to drop an Awestone as well as giving you one for beating him, so just beating him normally might make the whole job quicker.

 

 

What would you advise against Santier's? I've pretty consistently been just wrecked by that shit, I hate that damn thing.

 

I had another thought in addition to my above recommendation.  If you just want to have one halberd on you, have you picked up a Syan's Halberd?  It drops from the knight guys in Drangleic.  It also gets part of the spear moveset, the 1H and 2H light attacks.  I fought a guy with one of these last night a couple times, and he gave me a ton of problems, as he was one of the only people I fought who could match my reach.  Maybe worth upgrading as a backup to swap in if you see a Santier's.

[Trip Hazard]

Strange, there should be an NPC summon near the Smelter demon door. Specifically Lucatiel of Mirrah.

 

I summoned her on that boss fight, in order to finish her quest line.

 

Talking about Lucatiel, I found her in Black Gultch. Oh man. Tears imminent. I missed her on my first playthrough. I'm not looking forward to what's going to happen when I meet her again.

 

I haven't summoned her at all yet, probably just because I'm usually hollow. I did know she was there 'cos I'd seen other players summon her, but didn't notice that sign myself. Do you have to do certain things in a certain order to make her appear? I've probably completely missed out on an important questline by now...

 

Can anyone explain what power stancing is? I've not done any dual wielding yet, but I think I might as I think I'm getting better at dodging now. Also, made it to Drangleic castle, yay. 

[N1njaSquirrel]

I haven't summoned her at all yet, probably just because I'm usually hollow. I did know she was there 'cos I'd seen other players summon her, but didn't notice that sign myself. Do you have to do certain things in a certain order to make her appear? I've probably completely missed out on an important questline by now...

 

Can anyone explain what power stancing is? I've not done any dual wielding yet, but I think I might as I think I'm getting better at dodging now. Also, made it to Drangleic castle, yay. 

 

You have to talk to her at either No Man's Wharf or The Lost Bastille, and finish her conversation lines (Ideally both)

 

She then appears at the Earthen Peak next to the first bonfire. She then also gives you the Ring of Steel Protection +1.

 

If you don't speak to her then, you don't get the summon sign in front of the Smelter Demon.  In order to finish her quest line,

you have to coop with her 3 times and then talk to her in Aldia's keep. The 4 coop locations are: The Smelter Demon, The Rotten, The Lost Sinner and the Flexile Sentry. You can burn a bonfire aesthetic to re-do bosses to get the coop count up to 3.

[coaxmetal]

I haven't summoned her at all yet, probably just because I'm usually hollow. I did know she was there 'cos I'd seen other players summon her, but didn't notice that sign myself. Do you have to do certain things in a certain order to make her appear? I've probably completely missed out on an important questline by now...

 

Can anyone explain what power stancing is? I've not done any dual wielding yet, but I think I might as I think I'm getting better at dodging now. Also, made it to Drangleic castle, yay. 

 

 

Lucatiel is summonable for 4 bosses, but she will appear in other areas even if you don't summon her -- as long as you talked to her in the previous areas. If you don't summon her and have her survive 3/4 of the bosses she is summonable for, she won't show up for the last encounter in Aldia's Keep though.

 

Power stancing is something you can do when dual-weilding, if you have at least 150% of the required stats for both weapons. You activate it by holding down the 2h button, same as if you wanted to 2h your offhand weapon, and then you get a different moveset that attacks with both weapons at once, and does more damage. It's pretty fun, and different weapons have vastly different movesets (the moveset seems to be governed by the mainhand weapon)

[Dewar]

What moveset you get isn't entirely dependant on your primary weapon. There's a list of different weapon priorities out there on the internet somewhere that describes which move sets have presidence over other. Also, your two weapons have to be somewhat similar for the power stance to work.

[Trip Hazard]

Cheers for that. I'll defo be calling upon Lucatiel for help when I hit NG+, and will try out powerstancing soon too. I've got some sweet maces that aren't yet glutted with brainmatter

[Dewar]

I've had a ton of fun powerstancing myself, but it drains stamina really quick and I'm not sure if it's really worth it. Thankfully, I'm not in a position where I have to be super careful about otimizing my weapon choices. I also co-op a lot to try out new weapon combinations.

[Bjorn]

Cheers for that. I'll defo be calling upon Lucatiel for help when I hit NG+, and will try out powerstancing soon too. I've got some sweet maces that aren't yet glutted with brainmatter

 

Power stanced maces are godly in PvE.  If you have help in a fight, you can stunlock some bosses, particularly with the Stone Ring on.  Much harder to use in PvP as they end up being really easy to dodge.

 

 

I've had a ton of fun powerstancing myself, but it drains stamina really quick and I'm not sure if it's really worth it. Thankfully, I'm not in a position where I have to be super careful about otimizing my weapon choices. I also co-op a lot to try out new weapon combinations.

 

The stamina drain can be crippling.  Whether or not it's worth it tends to come down to whether or not you can kill or at least stagger enemies in a single hit/combo when power stanced.  It's an option that is clearly better for some weapons vs others.  Some weapons you can actually get more hits off with just R1 than you can a power stanced L1. 

 

A lot of the power stanced movesets are some of the coolest looking ones in the game.  Whips, clubs, curved swords and fist weapons are all just super cool. 

 

Oh, and the 150 percent rule only applies to Str/Dex, not Fth/Int requirements.  It's also not entirely accurate.  It's true for weapons that have even numbers for their requirements.  But a few weapons have odd numbers.  So for a weapon that requires a 17 Str, you only need 25 Str to power stance it, not a 26.  It will round down in your favor when figuring the requirement.  Can be helpful as you're building a character and want to make every point count. 

 

Your new moveset is now tied to your L1 and L2 buttons.  Your R1/R2 will attack with your right hand weapon as normal, but your L1/L2 will perform the new dual moveset.  For rolling/sprinting attacks, the L1/L2 will still perform the normal weapon attacks of your left hand.  For PvP, this can matter as it can give you a big variety of moves to draw on to catch someone by surprise. 

 

Sometimes using 2 weapons can be useful even if you aren't power stancing.  For some weapon combinations, alternating L1/R1 results in a faster series of attacks than just repeating R1 multiple times.  Chaining an L1 into an R2 for a right hand weapon that typically has a very slow R2 can actually result in a much faster attack, like the warmup "charging" animation for a lance.  For other combinations, IF you have the stats to power stance them, then new moves may become available even when you aren't power stanced.  Only a few have been discovered, but some of them are pretty neat.  Like with the Spider Fang in the left hand and another curved (maybe any normal sized sword) in the right.  If you R1 the right sword, then immediately L2 the Spider Fang, it performs the Ricard's Rapier super fast multi-hit combo, but without any of the delay that normally accompanies the attack. 

 

Interesting little thing you can pull off with rolling/sprinting attacks.  With a low enough equip burden (probably related to roll distance), you can actually perform your sprinting attack out of a roll.  Roll, then rapidly release and hold down the button again as if you were sprinting.  Attack before the roll is finished, and you will perform your sprinting attack rather than your rolling attack.  Its use is limited to those weapons which have super valuable sprinting attacks (like Halberds and whips), but damn can it catch someone off guard. 

[coaxmetal]

Yeah, for the most part, I have found (with some exceptions, like the caestus) that powerstancing isn't worth the stamina hit (vs just using a single weapon in 1 or 2 hands), but it is often fun anyway. It is also good to try, because if forces you to play without a shield, which makes the game a lot more fun, or at least teaches you more about dodging.

[Dewar]

I'm playing this entire run without a shield Most of the time I have my tailsman in the other hand though.

Edit: Had to break this rule for the bone chariot though. It was simply too valuable to be able to block the skeletons while waiting for the chariot to swing by.

Edit 2: In particular, I've enjoyed the power stance attack with the Warped Sword. Unfortuantely, it's a bit week for me as a primary weapon compared to a +10 lightning infused Heide's Sword. I really need to get some more Dragon Bone.

[Bjorn]

Edit: Had to break this rule for the bone chariot though. It was simply too valuable to be able to block the skeletons while waiting for the chariot to swing by.

 

I'm sure there is some lord out there who can do the chariot shieldless.  And that guy is insane. 

 

Apparently it's possible to jump over the spikes that stick out of the wheels with a well timed jump.  I saw one phantom I summoned doing it.  That's the only way I can imagine it working.  That phantom made the jump twice.  But not the third time. 

[Sno]

Well, i carry a shield, but i have done that fight mostly without blocking. I find that trying to turtle up in the recesses of the wall is actually the worst thing you can do for that boss fight. (Hell, the skeletons were even guard breaking me on NG+.)

Get out in the open, kill the skeletons, dodge into the recess of the wall when the chariot swings by. Get out, run up as far as you can until the skeletons catch up, repeat step one. You should be able to get far enough to kill the necromancer after the chariot's next lap, and then repeat the whole cycle for the second necromancer.

After that, the actual fight with the two-headed horse is a piece of cake.