L.A. Noire

[mikemariano]

Frankly, I would rather not have Lucas Arts remake this.

Instead they should make a Glottis Kart Racer!

If we're going off topic for L.A. Noire, we might as well go way off topic.

[RoutineMachine]

A GTA style game from the point of view of a lawman sounds compelling to me. I'm personally tired of storytelling from the point of view of criminal sociopaths. I also don't think that Noir themes have been really tapped in video games. And the facial animation looks great. So that's three things from the trailer that are good.

[brkl]

Progress: sociopathic detectives as player characters.

Well, maybe, maybe not, but Rockstar's thing is games where you kill a bunch of guys.

[MrHoatzin]

I wonder if it would be possible to make an open world game where there isn't any collateral damage. You have a car and you have a city: I would imagine some missions would be impossible without at least a few people getting run over. Maybe if it is more RPGy than actiony?

[RoutineMachine]

I think of Rockstar's thing as being big open worlds. You kill lots of guys in most video games nowadays.

[MrHoatzin]

True, but as an exercise, I wonder what an open world game where you don't mow down millions, even in your car, would be like. I guess Bully came close, but you don't really get to drive much in that game. That game didn't really click with me.

[juv3nal]

I don't know how they'd handle people getting mown down in a car, but I'm totally ok with that thing some games do where you simply won't fire/attack if your gun/fist/whatever is pointed at a friendly. Especially if they have a particular type of story they're trying to tell (i.e. one in which the protagonist can't be a homicidal maniac).

IMO, it's better than some of the alternatives I can think of...for example either:

1) a game over because, realistically you'd be hunted down and/or thrown in jail

or 2) some kind of totally unrealistic slap on the wrist in-game penalty like when you get caught by the cops in the GTA games. This is fine, I guess, if your character is supposed to be a criminal, because getting caught is something that's probably going to happen somewhat often if you're not very good at the game, but it doesn't sit so well with me if you're supposed to be a good guy.

[Garple]

detracted from how awesome the game was—a prime example of awful trailer-making, etc.

I don't think you can say the trailer actually detracted from the game's quality.

[Garple]

I wonder if it would be possible to make an open world game where there isn't any collateral damage. You have a car and you have a city: I would imagine some missions would be impossible without at least a few people getting run over. Maybe if it is more RPGy than actiony?

This is a good point. It's hard to roleplay the GTA games because most of the missions are pretty difficult to complete without fucking up some "civilians", which I think organized criminals in real life try not to do for obvious reasons.

[brkl]

It's easy enough to make everybody just jump away from the car, though not very realistic. People in GTA games don't really work as hard as you'd think on not getting run over. An out of control speeding car makes a very particular kind of racket I would notice and watch out for.

[Roderick]

That already exists, Kingz. It was called 'Midtown Madness', made by Microsoft a decade ago. It was a rendition of Chicago (I believe?), you drove around in a vehicle like in GTA (although you couldn't exit it), cops would chase you if you went overboard speeding etc, but you couldn't kill anyone. People would hilariously all jump away at the last moment.

[toblix]

Midtown Madness 2, which took place in London and San Francisco, was a great game. It was funny though, how, even if you were going only moderately fast, the jumping animations would be too slow, so nobody ever really managed to dodge your car, and you just drove through them mid-leap. I also remember it not bothering me that much.

[Patters]

Midtown Madness 2, which took place in London and San Francisco, was a great game. It was funny though, how, even if you were going only moderately fast, the jumping animations would be too slow, so nobody ever really managed to dodge your car, and you just drove through them mid-leap. I also remember it not bothering me that much.

They managed to dodge better in 3, but they often dropped the boxes containing their new Xboxes though...

[ThunderPeel2001]

I was really let down by Midtown Madness 2... After playing the first one so much, and hearing about how accurately it represented Chicago, I finally got to play London only to realise that it looked NOTHING like London. Making me wonder if I'd been lied to about Chicago. Still, Midtown Madness was a fun game.

Edited November 17, 2010 by ThunderPeel2001

[Thrik]

Well I have to say the trailer was fairly poor. The only thing I really found appealing in the entire thing was the (slightly creepy) facial animation, which was admittedly excellent — although it could definitely do with being integrated with higher-quality models that're lit better. Very possibly just a case of a great game with a bad trailer, though.

It might be worth pointing out that Rockstar hasn't developed this game — it's merely publishing it. I think it'll still be to an extent open world because the director is the guy behind The Getaway, but don't get too carried away with the GTA/RDD comparisons.

Midtown Madness 1 was a superb game incidentally.

[Garple]

They managed to dodge better in 3, but they often dropped the boxes containing their new Xboxes though...

I'm picturing that on the back of the box...

"-Improved Dodging!"

[Hermie]

The 1UP preview has made me switch from "doubt" to "careful hope":

They tell me, "It's an open world, and you can go around and go anywhere, but you're not going to be going out to play pool or cause mayhem by blowing stuff up with a rocket launcher." There's less action and more character interaction -- it's safe to say that a lot of the footage from the trailer below is actual gameplay footage.

Sure, there will be car chases, fist fights, and shootouts, but the demo I see definitely tilts more in the talking-and-investigating gameplay direction than action -- L.A. Noire looks more like a graphic adventure than an action game (Rockstar prefers the term, "detective thriller"). Cole and his partner (who changes depending on which LAPD desk he's working in) will drive to crime scenes, search for evidence, and interrogate suspects while utilizing clues and observations.

GTA meets Noir meets Phoenix Wright?!

There's a bit more than simply picking up items -- oftentimes, you'll have Cole pick something up and check it over from all angles for clues such as a company logo, or whether or not the film canister actually has anything inside. These items, plus certain spoken details, get collected into Cole's notebook, which drives most interrogations.

...Meets that rabbi game the thumbs talked about?

Thoughts?

[ThunderPeel2001]

Sounds more promising! If they can steer away from story and character cliches, I'll be sold.

[Roderick]

Oh yeah, that rabbi game. What episode of thumbs was that from, gotta relisten?

[Noyb]

Episode 45: http://www.idlethumbs.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6818

The rabbi game's called The Shivah.

I am quietly laughing to myself because (major spoilers for The Shivah)

even that game has absurd action scenes between investigations. The rabbi player character beats up a trained killer in a subway station. And takes down the final villain after being shot twice. Seriously. I am not joking. That actually happens in the game

.

True, but as an exercise, I wonder what an open world game where you don't mow down millions, even in your car, would be like. I guess Bully came close, but you don't really get to drive much in that game. That game didn't really click with me.

In the first Driver game for the PS1 the pedestrians were so adept at dodging your car that they'd sooner clip through buildings and walls than be run over.

[CaptainFish]

Episode 45: http://www.idlethumbs.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6818

The rabbi game's called The Shivah.

I am quietly laughing to myself because (major spoilers for The Shivah)

even that game has absurd action scenes between investigations. The rabbi player character beats up a trained killer in a subway station. And takes down the final villain after being shot twice. Seriously. I am not joking. That actually happens in the game

.

I had the exact same reaction. Since it's so short they couldn't have been that far away from the first confrontation. I wonder how different their overview would have been if they had just made it that far.

[syntheticgerbil]

See above Grim Fandango trailer. It has cliches, but uses them playfully and has tons of originality, too. It's not just about originality, though, it has to be compelling... Something LA Noire is not (at least in the trailer), IMHO.

If the LA Noire was a film... would you be in the least bit interested in watching it? Would you be eagerly awaiting its cinema release? Would you go and rent it on DVD? I certainly wouldn't.

Late to this conversation, but wanted to add a major point to the differences.

Grim Fandango's trailer goes to lengths to say something about the world it's in and what kind of atmosphere or characters might be in it. Of course the world of Grim Fandango is bizarre and needs explaining, but there is no setting at all established in L.A. Noire's trailer. Part of this helps get the intrigue going. Also since the dialogue is broken up to explain character traits, the plot, and how things operate in Grim Fandango through the characters and the throwback titles inbetween, the trailer comes off very well rounded for also not showing gameplay (since Cliffy B.'s complaining about that).

The thing about video game trailers with little gameplay shown means to me they are marketing a story. Whatever was going on with L.A. Noire had me burst out laughing the more it went on because I get the feeling they are serious (?) about whatever their story is and are really trying to up the "bad ass" factor.

What I saw was a trailer of a bunch of ugly looking guys shouting every cop movie catchphrase ever at eachother in rapid fire while some bangs, explosions, and screams were inserted inbetween. I really hope this is just brilliant parody!

Edited November 24, 2010 by syntheticgerbil

[ThunderPeel2001]

The thing about video game trailers with little gameplay shown means to me they are marketing a story. Whatever was going on with L.A. Noire had me burst out laughing the more it went on because I get the feeling they are serious (?) about whatever their story is and are really trying to up the "bad ass" factor.

What I saw was a trailer of a bunch of ugly looking guys shouting every cop movie catchphrase every at eachother in rapid fire and while some bangs, explosions, and screams were inserted inbetween. I really hope this is just brilliant parody!

Ha! Exactly Well, that or the trailer isn't representative of the level of storytelling.

[pabosher]

I actually /loved/ The Shivah. Looking back on it, you're right, it was ridiculous, but it still was an absolutely brilliant video game that I thoroughly enjoyed.

[ThunderPeel2001]

I actually /loved/ The Shivah. Looking back on it, you're right, it was ridiculous, but it still was an absolutely brilliant video game that I thoroughly enjoyed.

Totally agree with this