Battlestar Galactica season2 - anyone watching?

[Marek]

If Ron Moore's work on Deep Space Nine is anything to go by, we can expect all those storylines to further intertwine and get a lot more complex as the series goes on.

BSG also seems to take the same approach as DS9 to recurring characters / guest stars. I really really like that these characters keep making appearances, like Hotdog, Cally, Zarek, that female brunette pilot (erm, Racetrack?), the third guy in command below Tigh, the priest, the cigarette smoking doctor, Tigh's wife, etc. etc.

That doctor guy got only like 10 lines so far but he's already such a great character, holy crap. And when I saw that third guy in command when Tigh had to take over I was like "wait who is this guy?", but I was extremely pleased to find out he's actually all over the miniseries if you pay attention.

[Knar]

If Ron Moore's work on Deep Space Nine is anything to go by, we can expect all those storylines to further intertwine and get a lot more complex as the series goes on.

BSG also seems to take the same approach as DS9 to recurring characters / guest stars. I really really like that these characters keep making appearances, like Hotdog, Cally, Zarek, that female brunette pilot (erm, Racetrack?), the third guy in command below Tigh, the priest, the cigarette smoking doctor, Tigh's wife, etc. etc.

That doctor guy got only like 10 lines so far but he's already such a great character, holy crap. And when I saw that third guy in command when Tigh had to take over I was like "wait who is this guy?", but I was extremely pleased to find out he's actually all over the miniseries if you pay attention.

Actually, DS9 copied Babylon 5, the original Sci Fi / Fantasy series that had a multi-season long storyline.

I'm sorry, I'm not following the Hot Dog callsign - did I miss something in the series?

I know Ron Moore worked originally for Star Trek and one of his biggest qualms about the series is that their supplies are unlimited because of their "replicators". I like his more realistic approach where everything is limited. Including water. I mean, hell! We have an episode on their search for supplies , showing how tenuous of a hold they have on survival.

And he has no qualms about killing off characters which makes things edgy.

[Marek]

I never closely followed Babylon 5 (simply because it wasn't aired at convenient/consistent times over here) but from what I saw I would agree that DS9 shared elements with it. Not sure if it can be called a copy, though, as DS9 was developed a year before Babylon 5. I think "Babylon 5 vs. DS9" is more something that took place in usenet threads than something that was ever a real issue.

Hot Dog is one of the new pilots trained by Starbuck. He's now sort of the third guy after Apollo and Starbuck I think. He doesn't get many lines, but I like how he's consistently been there for a while.

[Knar]

I never closely followed Babylon 5 (simply because it wasn't aired at convenient/consistent times over here) but from what I saw I would agree that DS9 shared elements with it. Not sure if it can be called a copy, though, as DS9 was developed a year before Babylon 5. I think "Babylon 5 vs. DS9" is more something that took place in usenet threads than something that was ever a real issue.

Hot Dog is one of the new pilots trained by Starbuck. He's now sort of the third guy after Apollo and Starbuck I think. He doesn't get many lines, but I like how he's consistently been there for a while.

DS9 may have been developed a year before Babylon 5, but when it first started, it was very episodic. Later on, the Dominion Party story arc started, but that was well into the series. Babylon 5 started immediately with its main story arc, influencing DS9 to do the same. I heard somewhere that either one of the actors or even the creator nodded to B5 for allowing for a several season story arc and actually being able to keep viewers watching the show.

[lailoken]

I never really cared for the acting in B5 and the special effects to me always felt a little on the cheap side...

[Knar]

I never really cared for the acting in B5 and the special effects to me always felt a little on the cheap side...

Oh, a lot of the acting is on the subpar side, but it's really the story. As for the special effects, they were very good for their time.

And the story, it seriously takes a good 4 or 5 seasons to come into fruition.

[Duncan]

I just got round to seeing Resistance, and yeah, it was definitely an 'on' episode. The sports team stuff was a little and the ending was a bit suspicious... but everything else was good. I guess the uneventfulness of the first two episodes was a necessary evil to get to this point, though I wish it'd been handled a little better.

Also, do you guys only watch the space shows or something? ¬

[n0wak]

DS9 may have been developed a year before Babylon 5, but when it first started, it was very episodic. Later on, the Dominion Party story arc started, but that was well into the series. Babylon 5 started immediately with its main story arc, influencing DS9 to do the same. I heard somewhere that either one of the actors or even the creator nodded to B5 for allowing for a several season story arc and actually being able to keep viewers watching the show.

JMS actually pitched the "Space Station with story" concept to Paramount and they rejected it. So he went off and somehow managed to get a pilot done with the help of Warner Bros. By the time that was ready, SURPRISE SURPRISE, here comes a Star Trek branded space station show. He contemplated suing, but figured it would be a waste of time and resources and just went on with B5.

Good thing too, cause DS9 was just the standard Trek formula but on a station. WOW. When B5 was winding down, that's when DS9 started doing the long storylines and the EPIC battles, something that was completely alien to Star Trek before. (also, Species 841whatever in Voyager was very much inspired by certain B5 creature and ship designs, and was similarly highly CGI).

I guess it's obvious where my allegiances lie.

And yes, it was cheesy at times and really melodramatic, but it really was a TV Space Opera of the scale that really has never been equalled. However, if you are not convinced, I suggest trying to find a copy of the Season 2 episode "The Coming of Shadows." (warning, spoilers, if you care) That single episode won a Hugo award (more details about how B5 actually dominated the Hugos at the above link, search "Hugo" a couple of times).

Ahem

So, yeah, Cylons! Sharon is hot.

Edit: addition

http://jmsnews.com/msg.aspx?id=1-3367&query=paramount

[Knar]

So what you're saying is, the first two seasons of Star Trek: The Next Generation were the best sci-fi ever, second only to SeaQuest DSV, which is tied with TekWar?

Hey! No making of SeaQuest, even though I partially watched it because I had the biggest crush on Jonathan Brandis. I loved Lucas Wolenczak.

And yes, I know about Jonathan's untimely death. When all the other girls my time had crushes on boy bands and popstars, I had a crush on a cute, sci fi genius. Figures.

Not all you guys have to have your "hot cylons", us girls can have our dashing geniuses.

[Marek]

Something makes me think B5's influence on DS9 has been way exaggerated by sci-fi fans over the years. Maybe it proved the viability of non-episodic sci-fi to conservative execs, but I doubt B5 originally inspired DS9's non-episodic direction. (Or inspired the idea of having a space station, which isn't quite the kind of genius avant garde idea you have to steal from anyone.)

If you actually go back and watch the season 1 DS9 finale, or the season 2 opening trilogy, you can already tell where the series was moving towards. Very political, very continuous, etc. But I guess the Star Trek heritage held them back. I think the major contributing factor to DS9 going totally non-episodic was Voyager starting up, which sucked Rick Berman's attention away and allowed Ira Steven Behr to gradually take the show where it was supposed to go.

Anyway, hurray for geeky discussions.

[Knar]

Something makes me think B5's influence on DS9 has been way exaggerated by sci-fi fans over the years. Maybe it proved the viability of non-episodic sci-fi to conservative execs, but I doubt B5 originally inspired DS9's non-episodic direction. (Or inspired the idea of having a space station, which isn't quite the kind of genius avant garde idea you have to steal from anyone.)

If you actually go back and watch the season 1 DS9 finale, or the season 2 opening trilogy, you can already tell where the series was moving towards. Very political, very continuous, etc. But I guess the Star Trek heritage held them back. I think the major contributing factor to DS9 going totally non-episodic was Voyager starting up, which sucked Rick Berman's attention away and allowed Ira Steven Behr to gradually take the show where it was supposed to go.

Anyway, hurray for geeky discussions.

Anyhow, I was at a panel that had Walter Koenig and J M S, and JMS told us that someone from DS9 nodded to B5 for allowing for a series long story arc.

(Long story short, I do not usually go to these conventions - this one I got roped into helping out a group I'm associated with do a SciFi Fantasy Tsunami Fundraiser. Hence I saw JMS )

Back in the day, TV execs were not convinced that a space opera would hold continue to attract viewers to the show. A lot of these shows are bound by Hollywood and what they think people will watch.

B5 was campy at times, and the acting, and monologues were over the top, but no one could deny the complexity of the characters.

[Erwin_Br]

Hmm... B5's monologues aside, their sets were awfully campy as well. They must've thought a lot of coloured lights would hide the poor quality of their set piece designs.

--Erwin

[n0wak]

So what you're saying is, the first two seasons of Star Trek: The Next Generation were the best sci-fi ever, second only to SeaQuest DSV, which is tied with TekWar?

TekWar was awesome. I especially loved how local Toronto theme-park-ish Ontario Place was some super secret hidden laboratory, and BCE place was the home of the futuristic police.

Actually, no.

Now, Earth 2 and Earth: Final Conflict...

NERRRRDS

(One cool note about Babylon 5. The diplomatic attache Vir was played by Animal House's Flounder (fat guy in above photo), and Lennier was played by the kid from Lost In Space who was also half of "Barnes and Barnes" -- you know, the band that did the "Fish Heads" song. Fish Heads, Fish Heads, roly poly fish heads, fish heads, fish heads, eat them up... yum. Yes)

[n0wak]

Hmm... B5's monologues aside, their sets were awfully campy as well. They must've thought a lot of coloured lights would hide the poor quality of their set piece designs.

--Erwin

They didn't have one third the budget that Star Trek: DS9 had. In fact, probably considerably less than that. As dated as some of their early CGI looks, it *was* used predominantly for being the cheapest option; far cheaper than the miniature route that ST took. Especially for some of the larger battles that they wound up doing (Imagine doing some of the season three/four battles, with literally dozens of capital ships and hundreds of fighters, the "old fashioned way")

[Bc9b]

Any one been reading these?

http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show.cgi?show=145

[Redwall]

Those are great. My favorite line so far (from the season finale):

Tigh reminds us, "There's also a Cylon baseship out there to deal with." Adama says, "Leave that to me." And for a second I think he's just gonna go glare the Basestar into submission. Which I believe he could do. Y'know, just fly out there in a Raptor and say, "Listen, I am having a really. Bad. Day. You don't want to mess with me right now." And then the Basestar would say, "Oh, dude, sorry," and jump away.

[Trithemius]

I wish I could participate in this thread, but the networks are not showing it here yet. They were pretty quick with the last series (although it did migrate to a later timeslot pretty quickly) so I'm happy to wait. Well... mostly happy...