Metal Gear Solid 4 - Guns of the Saucer Men From Mars

[Wrestlevania]

There is one [cutscene] that is almost that long and another that's about an hour, but most of the cutscenes are "normal" by MGS standards (i.e. around 15 minutes long on average).

I am now flacid with anticipation at the thought of ever playing MGS4. Can't stomach that much non-interactivity in front of a console - it just seems... "wrong" to me.

[Nachimir]

On the whole they're not. There is one that is almost that long and another that's about an hour, but most of the cutscenes are "normal" by MGS standards (i.e. around 15 minutes long on average).

Ah right. Even at that length though, it seems like Sony are missing a trick.

[Thrik]

Good job you can pause them. More like watch half the next day.

[ThunderPeel2001]

On the whole they're not. There is one that is almost that long and another that's about an hour, but most of the cutscenes are "normal" by MGS standards (i.e. around 15 minutes long on average).

?!?! An hour long?!

You can't be serious? Which game? When (is it the end sequence?). Even 15 mins is annoying.

[Thrik]

I'm fairly sure he means MGS4. I don't recall any such long scenes in the previous games.

From the sounds of it they did go a bit overboard with MGS4 and it's total fan service (ie: satisfying every question everyone's ever had), but then I do find myself thoroughly entertained by MGS cutscenes so I'm guessing I won't mind. They've gotten increasingly better with each game, and they've gotten good at minimising potential boredom too.

[Ben]

I am now flacid with anticipation at the thought of ever playing MGS4. Can't stomach that much non-interactivity in front of a console - it just seems... "wrong" to me.

Fair enough, the two longer cutscenes pushed my patience and were frustrating, but I feel it was ultimately worth it for experiencing what the actual game play had to offer - which is really something; so you'd be missing out on that as well.

Also, this being MGS the cutscenes are always "interactive" in some way, even if it's not actual playing. Very small non-spolier example: you can control the Mk.II to go around an area during the cutscene and discover hidden bonuses that help you in game play such as a spare battery that increases the amount of time you can use the Solid Eye.

[vimes]

What does everybody mean by the MGS series being cinematic?

The only MGS I've played is MGS2 and I've never been good enough to see the balance between cutscene and gameplay, so if somebody could give me a clue...

[Thrik]

I don't understand your question at all.

[vimes]

Well, sorry about that, I'm going to try to make this clearer.

I'm not sure I understand the adjective 'cinematic' when it's used to qualify a game as a whole (vs applying the term to the narration of a game) and thus, I don't understand what people mean when they tag MGS as being the most cinematic game/series ever : does that mean that there are a lot of good cutscenes or does it also means something in terms of gameplay, scenario or writing ?

(edit - if it can help you : I'm currently playing GTA4; would people say it's cinematic or not ? And why ?)

[Thrik]

I don't know about other people, but I'd be inclined to use the term to describe MGS because the overall experience gives me an emotional response more like a deeply involving movie rather than something like reading a book, or hearing a radio play, or GTA4 which feels more like arcade-like fun.

I'd say no particular part of MGS is primarily responsible for this, and it's more a combination of characters that're very fleshed out, an extremely immersive world (particularly MGS1 and MGS3), a storyline full of twists, and — particularly in the cases of MGS1 and MGS2 — a very film-like approach to camera angles. MGS pretty much has its own unique feel that's complimented by all sorts of things, not least the Harry Gregson-Williams soundtrack.

It is difficult to quantify concisely though, I'd agree. I'd be very reluctant to credit even a majority portion of the 'cinematic' feel to the cutscenes though, despite that being a logical first assumption.

I wouldn't normally use the term to describe MGS anyway, though. MGS is just a game and it has a great atmosphere in my opinion. It's its own thing, which doesn't work for everyone.

[ThunderPeel2001]

This is the way I see it:

It's cinematic (adjective): The entire game looks like a movie

A cinematic/cut-scene (noun): An in-game video

So surely you can see why people think GTA IV is cinematic? It looks quite a lot like a movie at times (helped by the cut-scenes, but also when you're on missions).

It's a pretty vague term, really. If it reminds you of a movie, it's "cinematic", I guess.

[vimes]

OK, thanks Thunderpeel and Thrik : now that I know it's not there, I don't need to search for a precise meaning anymore

[Cigol]

Just completed Act 3, and started Act 4. I laughed so hard, great fan service. I thought my PS3 had crashed (not such a great feeling, whoa) and then we get treated to that little gem (not to mention all the goody items we got beforehand). Brilliant

[Scrobbs]

I loved the bit when that geezer gets caught in the oil drum in Act 1. Fart gags translate across cultures!

[miffy495]

Just completed Act 3, and started Act 4. I laughed so hard, great fan service. I thought my PS3 had crashed (not such a great feeling, whoa) and then we get treated to that little gem (not to mention all the goody items we got beforehand). Brilliant

Me too. Holy hell Act 3 was brilliant though. From the hardcore stealth and film noir vibe of the early goings, to the balls-out action, to the (admittedly very long) amazing cutscene to top the whole thing off. That entire act is now, in my mind, the high point of the series. If I didn't have to be at work in 7 hours, I'd still be playing now. As it is, I wanted to check the thread and go to sleep, so that's what I'll do. Definitely be playing more when I get home tomorrow though. Just... damn. That is some amazing stuff I just witnessed.

Also, Lee Merriweather as the voice of Old Eva? Awesome! I couldn't remember where I knew her from, so I had to imdb her name. The second I saw that she was the 60s Catwoman, I couldn't stop grinning. I wonder if Kojima wanted her specifically, or if it just turned out amazing.

[Wrestlevania]

For the record, I certainly wouldn't describe GTA IV as cinematic; it's far more like a TV series than a film, because it has lots of little side stories and doesn't rely on carefully set camera angles in each scene.

MGS4 on the other hand appears much more tightly focussed in its narrative, events and 'photography'. Which I would describe as cinematic.

[miffy495]

So, I'm almost at the final boss. It's 11:40, and I need to be in bed by 2:00. As such, I'm working on the assumption that the game will not be over by then and saving the fight for tomorrow night. I'll probably hear back from those of you who may have finished the game too late, but this is a good call, right? I'm not going to spend all tomorrow regretting not finishing the game tonight?

As for Act 4 and what I played of 5, wow. Still like 3 the best, but the climax of Act 4 was bloody ridiculous and so cool. The BB fight from 5 was awesome too. Both 4 and 5's BBs were very reminiscent of MGS1's equivalent bosses. I really liked that. Particularly all the in-jokes in the Act 5 one. ("Your hardware has obviously improved!")

Anyway, off to bed. I'll resume and then finish the fight when I get home tomorrow at 8. Cheers, all.

[miffy495]

And done. Goddamn, that was one hell of a final cutscene. The false start to the credits didn't help, either. A couple of things were a little hard to swallow, even given Metal Gear's standard for weird story twists, but overall it was worth sitting through. Somehow I feel that by just seeing the series through I witnessed a very important part of gaming's evolution. Not necessarily in MGS4 itself, but the entire saga. At the very least, it's cool to be finishing a game and not wonder what they're going to do with the sequel.

[ThunderPeel2001]

At the very least, it's cool to be finishing a game and not wonder what they're going to do with the sequel.

What do you mean? Is the last MGS?

[miffy495]

At the very least, it'd be hard to bring in Snake for another go 'round. As I've alluded to, Raiden is now awesome. From the looks of it, he's done now too though. I'd say if they do make another MGS, it'd need a significantly different cast, and so the only relation would be the title. Not that Kojima hasn't done it before (Zone of the Enders 2 and GBA shared a universe with the first, but only cameos by its cast) but I can't see any kind of follow up on this storyline at any rate. Maybe another spin-off alternate universe like Ac!d, but I think Solid may be done.

[Cigol]

Just a couple of pictures I took with the camera in probably my favourite part of the game. I particularly loved all the flashbacks.

Check out these threads when you've completed the game for the usual dosage of 'extras' that await your curiosity;

AVForums Easter Eggs

Playstation Community things that amuse you

[Nappi]

This was partially discussed earlier on this topic but since some of you have finished the game now, I'd like to know whether you can enjoy MGS4 even if you haven't played any of the previous Metal Gear games? Well, I played the MGS1 demo (and somewhat liked the gameplay) as well as watched a friend of mine play the ending of MGS2 (which I thought was absolutely hilarious), but that's about it. I mean, is there a strong enough plot limited to just the fourth game that you can play it even if you don't know the overall story?

I'm asking this since I'm finally thinking of buying a PS3 and I hoped I would be able to enjoy this game like I enjoyed HL2, that is to say without touching the previous game(s). I understand that it might be more difficult with this series though. I don't own a PS2 and, to be honest, I'm not very keen on playing the first game simply because of the outdated technology.

[Cigol]

This was partially discussed earlier on this topic but since some of you have finished the game now, I'd like to know whether you can enjoy MGS4 even if you haven't played any of the previous Metal Gear games? Well, I played the MGS1 demo (and somewhat liked the gameplay) as well as watched a friend of mine play the ending of MGS2 (which I thought was absolutely hilarious), but that's about it. I mean, is there a strong enough plot limited to just the fourth game that you can play it even if you don't know the overall story?

I'm asking this since I'm finally thinking of buying a PS3 and I hoped I would be able to enjoy this game like I enjoyed HL2, that is to say without touching the previous game(s). I understand that it might be more difficult with this series though. I don't own a PS2 and, to be honest, I'm not very keen on playing the first game simply because of the outdated technology.

My gut feeling says 'no', slash, 'maybe a little'.

After playing the game to completion I'm getting the impression more and more that you really need to have experienced the originals to fully appreciate all its quirks and nuances. You could conceivably play it as an action game, ignore much of the corny dialogue & plot exposition and still have a game worth playing - but it would be a different experience to mine.

It's not going to evoke the same emotional and nostalgic responses for one. These characters don't mean anything to you and I don't think there's enough exposition (and certainly no effective backstory) to supplement a newbie - I'm not even sure the narrative or its execution will be compelling enough when it's offset by the ridiculousness that is a part of the series. There are going to be scenes (etc) which for you will zip by unnoticed but on the flip-side trigger responses in its target audience.

That's not to say you can't enjoy the game - I've got no idea what it'd be like to go in cold, I can only imagine - but I do think it's safe to say your depth of appreciation will be less then that of an existing fan. Whether that impacts on your decision or not I don't know. I think if you've got the itch to play it'd be difficult to shake - in which case the question needs to be rephrased as whether or not getting a PS3 is worth it for you.

[Nappi]

Thanks for the response!

I guess I might still pick it up though. There aren't too many great games for Playstation 3 yet. And it might be interesting to investigate it as an outsider to the series. Maybe I'll even start a blog*.

*I won't though.

[miffy495]

I'd recommend it, if only because now I'm curious as to what you'll say when you're playing it. I think a good chunk of why the game was so good came from my investment in the characters. Raiden in particular, as I felt like one of the very few people who actually enjoyed playing as him in MGS2. Most of the backstory is explained enough, I hope, though not knowing it right away could give the entire game a very different spin. I'm interested to know what you'll think now.

Also, if you're getting a PS3, get Uncharted. Just saying.