Tanukitsune

They don't even fight back in Epic Yarn! He's just a pyscho!

I didn't use that game as an example, and I think that I said it before, if we're going down that route, then there is no such thing as a cheerful game because even Tetris is terrible when you think of it as block genocide. Games need a conflict or obstacle to resolve, so yes, there is likely to be "bad stuff happening" or else the hero wouldn't need to intervene, the difference is how you portray the conflict and it's resolution. Let's take Red Dead Redemption, it's a beautiful game and well written, but the world is definitely not "happy" and the game does want you to feel happy... If you rescued a puppy in Red Dead Redemption, you'd find out the owner is training it to be a fighter and is likely to torture for fun and profit... It all depends on how you approach the subject, does the game approach the subject and shove it down your throat and yell "A TERRIBLE THING HAPPENED! YOU WILL NEVER GET OVER IT!" or does it say "A terrible thing happened, but thanks to you, the hero, I am somewhat at peace now". I'm not sure if a game that features genocide or slavery can be considered cheerful, but most games have genocide and/or slavery when you think about it.... Pokémon is ALL about slavery, they encourage you to enslave and capture wild animals for your amusement, if you put it that way, it's a messed up game, but the average consensus about that game is that's it's pretty saccharine. Of course, how positive or negative you see a game is is subjective, and maybe people see Red Dead Redemption as a cheerful game and maybe they think Kirby's games are dark and depressing. The thing is, this all about general views, it seems that some people in Japan thing, in general that Western games are bleak and gory, the question is are they right? From I've read so far, everybody here seems to disagree, since everybody is jumping to the defense of the Western game. I personally think you guys are right, Western games aren't as bleak as that, but I also say that I can't blame them, they see games like Gear of War making millions, so they assume that's what the West wants. Where did I make a sweeping generalization? Did I ever say ALL Japanese are puppies and rainbows? I'm pretty sure I mentioned that some of the most serious and bleak games I know of actually come from Japan too. I just beat Demon's Souls, I could never say that game is cheerful, it would definitely be on my top list of bleak games.

I'm not sure we should count indie games, we are talking if we can blame Japan for viewing Western games like I mentioned, Japan is as unaware of western indie games as we are of their indie games, we are talking about the general view. When Japan makes a game for the West, they make it "American", or North American, has Japan made a game that feels or looks European? If you can find a game from Japan that's made for the West and has a European flavor then it counts, if not it doesn't. Sure, cheerful Western games exist, but the real question is if they are in general dark, gritty and gory? A spoonful of cheeriness in a barrel of grim still makes a barrel of grim.

Well, it's mostly the obscure stuff nobody cares or hears about. Most shmups from have cute humanoid girls fighting monsters in a beautiful world, they tend to have paper thin plot, but it's not that bleak. The average JRPG is colorful, non-gory and not that bleak, they got over the phase of having an emo whiny baby for hero, I've only just started to play Japanese RPGs again, but I've yet to see one that's bleak and serious, unless you count the Persona series, the rest are cute characters fighting cute monsters. Tokobot, Gurumin, Brave Story, Adventures to Go, Hexyz Force, Half Minute Hero, Gensan...

Well, Quantum Theory is Gear of War if they were dressed by a Japanese RPG designer and Legends of Troy is from the Dynasty Warriors people and it's Dynasty Warriors with less charm and more guts and gore and misery. I can really think of other cases of games from Japan made with America in mind though, does Dead Rising count?

I guess it's my fault, I shouldn't have called it "blue sky games", I though we have more UK Resistance fans who would have caught the reference and know what I'm talking about. When Japans makes a game for the West, like Quantum Theory or Legends of Troy, the game is dark, bleak and gory, people are saying that it's kinda offensive that Japan sees this when they play American games and I'm saying that maybe they have a point since I can't really think of that many games from the U.S. that don't fall in at least one of the categories if not all of them. Sure, America can make pretty games, but they still decapitate and eviscerate and the world will look beautiful, but it's still a miserable place. I can think of a few games from smaller companies like Costume Quest, but I don't think we can blame them for thinking that America likes gritty games with gore, the U.S. might actually make a game or two that's has a beautiful world where you can kill the monsters without ripping out their intestines and while the world might be in trouble, it doesn't feel miserable but the rest are dark, gritty and gory. And that's what this is what I was hoping this thread would be about, are American games in general that dark and gritty? I really REALLY regret using that title now.

If you're going to be that way, then there is no such thing as a "happy" game, even Tetris is a monstrous game from the block perspective! When Japan makes a game for the West, they make the hero and the world dark, gritty and bleak and they are as gory as God of War, so I'm asking if America, specially the bigger corporations, have made games that don't have a bleak world or hero and no gore. I'm not talking about non-violent games I'm talking of games with no exploding heads and similar. I don't think the campaign is about anti-violent games either, I think it's about more cheerful games, you still punch people in the face, you just don't eat their heart after punching them. One of the ads clearly says "Happy games only", I doubt it's about uncreative games, since when have Megaman and Sonic have been creative?

Did you guys check the site? "Blue sky" games aren't just pretty games, they are "happy" games too. Damn, I though everybody here knew the old "blue sky in games" thing. It doesn't have to be "happy" happy, just not dark n' gritty. A game where not only the sky is blue, the game is a "blue sky" too. It can't be gory, that's for sure, but it doesn't have be a kiddy game, you can punch and shoot people, you just can rip their heads off or blow them up. Red Dead Redepmtion may have actual blue skies, but it's a Rockstar game, it's dark n' gritty. Enslaved was developed in the UK. As hilarious and pretty as Deathspank is, can it be called a "happy" game? It has gore in it. Does Team Fortress 2 have gore in it? If it doesn't then it counts.

Now that's a blue sky!

I couldn't even get the demo working, so there is no way I'm buying it, I might get Neverwinter Nights 2 though.

From what I've head Arcania isn't worth the 12€ they're asking for, and I think I'll wait for Neverwinter 2 to drop price more, it's Steam, it will be at 75% off eventually, right?

I barely remember my C64, it died on it's first game of Rainbow Islands but after that I had an Amstrad CPC 464, the one with a disquette drive, although I did have one or two tape games... I remember loading the game, leaving to have a snack while I waited for it to load.

Steam has both Neverwinter Nights 2 and the whole Gothic pack (including 4) at 50%-75% off! I bought Neverwinter Nights 2 back in the day and I'm positive the DRM killed my PC since it died the very next day after installing it, so I'm very wary of buying this... And Gothic 4 has Securom!

You made it load in REAL TIME? A CASSETTE GAME? ARE YOU MAD? Just to be sure... What exactly is the difference between nostalgia gaming and retro gaming? It's nostalgia gaming when it's something you played when you were younger and loved? Does replaying the old Lucasarts games count?

I had completely forgotten other people can invade your game... Someone invaded mine, but I was lucky enough to defeat them! Is it me or do have you be as cheap as the bosses to defeat them?

The people behind the game are saying they are going to make the game even harder.... Seriously? That game is practically broken and unfair! I only beat bosses by being as cheap as them! Most bosses can kill you with one hit and armor is useless... How are they going to make this harder and still playable? I won't blame any gamer who isn't willing to put up with the "abusive relationship" you'll have with Demon's Souls, but making the sequel even harder seems like a terrible idea.

I just hope it won't be another Stalin Vs Martians, the game so bad they took it off Steam!

Since we have a thread to talk about game we've beaten, how about games that have beaten us? Or bored us to death? For the same reason we have the beaten games thread, this is for when it's doesn't feel right to simply start or resurrect a thread... I kinda got carried away and bought a bunch of old RPGs at the GOG sale last year, but when I finally got to them... I disliked most of them.. I specially can't into any of the DOS cRPGs. It felt strange that I enjoyed Neverwinter Nights so much but I was utterly unable to play any of the older games like Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale... How am supposed to play as a wizard and live if I don't even have a familiar? Another games I just quit a few moments ago was "The Ball"... It's rather strange, it's an original concept but it felt unoriginal to me... It's about a man who falls into a Mayan temple and finds a magic gun that can push and attract a ball, but it felt like a generic physics puzzle... all you do is get the ball to red switches and you to blue ones. After barely beating the first chapter (because it was so boring), I get the next level, which is the same but with water now... The game started to hint there would monsters that could kill me, but... I actually fell asleep out of sheer boredom... I just had no reason to continue, sure there was a story, but it was too obvious to make me continue and I didn't feel clever for solving such simple puzzles nor threatened by the traps that were starting to appear..

WoW was the only game I was "dangerously addicted" to, I was almost like the South Park episode people, I'm so glad I quit that game and MMOs in general. I've quit Cho Aniki Zero, I played to original game, but this game is just broken I can't really explain it to non-shmup fans, but it's clear this game was made by people who don't know that much about shmups, it's broken hard in a very bad way and they didn't even capture the feel of the original series, the original game was insane and creative, this is just recycling characters, boring and frustrating and this is from a guy who plays shmups and bullets hells regularly!

I beat Silhouette Mirage, a game "treasured" by many and... once again AFTER I beat I find out it's supposed to be ridiculously hard! Although I did only have one continue left when I reached the final boss, so it definitely wasn't an easy game! If don't know what I'm talking about it's a game from the people who made Ikaruga and Gunstar Heroes and it's basically Gunstar Heroes only weirder and more complex?

Are you man enough for.. TEAAA?!!? sxtRGEVsSOc

People have been throwing the term "accessible games" a lot lately and while I'm pretty sure it's a very clear term, but what exactly makes a game accessible? Is it something subjective? I think we can pretty much agree than most of the retro bad and hard games are not accessible, they don't you what to do, you don't know where to do, you're left in the dark. Some games actually still do leave you in the dark, but that's part of the gameplay, but you still learn about the game as you play along, while the other games... it seems like just don't care or have have the mentality of making things easy for you is making you weak. Is a game accessible when it explains how it works through narrative and gameplay effectively? You know what to do, you know when you did something wrong and you know when you did something right? All of the "tough but fair games" seem to enter in this category. But does difficulty make a game less accessible? Even when it's the "good" kind? But what makes a game unaccessible? And I find Street Fighter IV very unaccessible... Why? You have to memorize many different and complex moves for each character and then they have counters, cancels... Most of the more modern fighters have either added an "easy mode" which makes special moves easier or they simply made the moves easier. Is really as simple as that? Is accessibility making a game easier to understand and play without making it easier? Can a game be somewhat difficulty AND accessible?

Frankly, I don't get the "moe" thing either, it's probably for people who like cute girls? The game is innocent enough, except for ONE ending, which is the obligatory bath scene.... SOME OF THESE KIDS ARE NOT EVEN TWELVE! BAD JAPAN! NO COOKIE FOR YOU! At least the last time I played a Japanese game the "kids" were the "I'm 16 but I look like an adult!" kind. I don't think Japan can make a game without at least one beach/bath scene with underage girls in it... Even Valkyria Chronicles has one! Many of the older cRPGs (DOS old) are like that, it's even worse when some of them are still unclear when you're using a guide!

So I should called the thread usability instead? Deathsmiles is a bullet hell and it's VERY accessible, I'm pretty new to this genre and I can reach the final level with one credit, something I could never do with other games of this genre on easy. Although it only has a small "arcade tutorial" which I think is enough to explain an arcade game?

I think I might have chosen the wrong word then? I'm talking about making games accessible to the general public, not only people who can beat a bullet hell game blindfolded? What word should I use then? Should I just say "Making games accessible to the general public and difficulty?"? I have SYNSO and I like that it has a version for the color blind.