Mentalgongfu

Didn't know that about the Hollywood Streets. So the movie clip that set Cooper off was from Sunset Blvd? Did Steven kill Becky? There's an ominous shot of their trailer, with ominous sound, after the scene in the woods where he (presumably) kills himself. Gretchen: Why? Steven: There is no why. I did do it. Gersten: No. No. She did it, she did it. Steven: I can't. No. I did it Gersten: No, no, Steven, Steven, you didn't do anything. You're fucking stoned. What the fuck did she give you? Give me the gun. Steven: Are you gonna come up with me? Gersten: No, and you're not going either. Steven: Look at me. I'm a high school graduate. I''m a high school graduate …..

Aside from this wonderful podcast, I also enjoy the take from "Almost Cancelled" guys on Mild Fuzz youtube channel. They pointed out that Twin Peaks has a better Iron Fist than the Iron Fist series.

I missed that. Did anyone else see a face in the rocks beneath the waterfall during the dissolve to Steven (after the convenience store scene)? I can't tell if it's just a rock that looks like a face to me due to pareidolia, (the top half of Cooper's face, in fact), or if something was superimposed and intended.

Second thought: Hulk-hand Freddy, as a result of accidentally possible killing two people in defense of James, has landed in a jail cell across from Naido, who must be protected. No doubt Freddy could break out of this cell anytime he wants with his magical hand. I see chess pieces being put strategically in place, to make a poor WIndom Earl reference. Naido as the Queen, and Freddy as the Bishop, or perhaps more appropriately as the Knight, given the King Arthur connections. He now has a chance to really do good if someone should come to harm her, and it also explains why Andy would place her in such a seemingly vulnerable position as a jail cell.

So much to dissect in this one... I'll just start with this: Since dreams and dreamers were a seemingly important thing in Part 14, I have been keeping track of any dialogue clearly related to dreams as I rewatch the first few episodes. . In this one, as Dougie eats his cake, still mimicking, and Janey-E remains enamored of him, and before he sees the Gordon Cole reference in an old movie on TV and goes for the electrical outlet, she says, "Oh Dougie, it's like all our dreams are coming true!" I would consider it an irrelevant line if it weren't for the fact the dream world seems to be taking on a greater meaning. And given she calls him "dreamweaver" back in part 4, and Mike has told him to "Wake up," I'm beginning to think they snuck in a lot of clues about where this might be headed.

@BonusWavePilot Yeah, you should never loan a book you will be upset to not get back. I learned that, eventually. I've lost a few since then, but I accepted the risk mentally beforehand. The two I mentioned -- they still hurt to think about, almost as bad as when my Seagull acoustic guitar got run over by a car. But I agree, books do not follow normal ownership rules. I like to imagine they have a life of their own, as they spread their knowledge, and have perhaps made it into hands that value them as much as I did. Still, I was unprepared at the time. As for lighters, having long hair, I started keeping a hair tie on my lighters to ensure I always have one when I need it. And that little trick has, inadvertently, cut down on lighter theft by 95 percent. Speaking of which, "Got a light?"

Thanks @Chris!

@BonusWavePilot I haven't read the Upanishads, other than random snippets online. But I still regret loaning out my only copy of the Ramayana to someone who ate my book. Jim Morrison once said "Some of my biggest regrets have been haircuts." I would add to that list, loaning valued books to the wrong person. I also lost a book of scrolls/prophecies from a cult-like preacher from Arizona, whom my cousins' family followed. Lost that book in the same way but to a different person- Brother Frisby was his name (the preacher, not the book-eater). Crazy as he seemed, I wish I still had it. It was intriguing, and the discourse on aliens as demons would potentially fit within the Twin Peaks lore. I'm not a religious scholar either, but if you have an interest in religious mythology, especially the rich history of "Eastern" religion, such as Hinduism, and later Buddhism, then I would recommend following that instinct to dive deeper. BTW @Jake Part 15 thread please?

Fair enough. maybe "retcon" isn't the right word. I just don't think it fits in with my headcanon.

True, but Cooper took Dougie's place. Maddy didn't have a place to take. Unless the idea is there was a real Maddy, who Leland and Sarah Palmer knew about, and some tulpa slid into her spot. Don't get me wrong, I think it's an interesting thought, but I have trouble imagining how it would work, and it seems like a horrible retcon if Maddy was not Laura's real cousin but was a manufactured thought-form instead.

I've seen people float the idea elsewhere, but I'm not on board. I always took Maddy at face value, as Laura's Patty-Duke-style look-alike cousin. I mean, she seemed to have a family of her own, which she was ostensibly heading back to when Leland/Bob killed her. And if she was made out now to be a tulpa, I think that would pretty well kill that part of the storyline.

Regarding the ancient phrase, "We are like the dreamer who dreams, and then lives inside the dream... But, who is the dreamer?" In a seeming throwaway comedy scene in Part 4, immediately after DougieCoop has a vision of the Red Room, wherein Mike/the One-armed Man tells him he was tricked and "Now one of you must die," Janey-E enters the bedroom and chastises him. “Dougie! You're not even dressed! Is something wrong? Oh, for God's sake, what is with you?" Dougie holds his crotch and does the pee-pee dance, and Janey-E guides him toward the bathroom. "Listen Mr. Dreamweaver, you go potty and let's get you dressed fast. You're worse than Sonny Jim."

The time phenomenon might make more sense of Bobby's diner comment last episode about things that happened "today." It would still seem the night-time scene with the shooting and horn-honking/zombie girl took place prior to Bobby's dinner with Big Ed, or on a different night at least, but perhaps time is not moving in Twin Peaks the same way it is everywhere else. Not just at a different speed, but in a different order. I'm not sure about that, but it's damn fine interesting to contemplate. And thanks for the Upanishads clarification. I figured it had to be an ancient phrase somewhere, and that makes sense with Lynch. The Ramayana reference must be next.

Thanks. I'm glad to know I'm not just speaking (typing) into the void. @UnpopularTrousers So there's someone in Lucha Underground with a Hulk-hand? I know nothing about the show, but as a Twin Peaks fan who also has an unhealthy obsession with old-school professional wrestling, I might have to check it out.

I expected Cooper to come back in Part 5 after the scene above at the end of Part 4. Clearly, that was not destined. Two particularly funny scenes for me in this part. In the sheriff's office conference room, Hawk explains to Truman his hunt for "something missing" based on the message from Log Lady Margaret Lanterman, and I think our first sign that Chad is an asshole. Chad: I thought that log woman was 10-96 and not even allowed in this building? Lucy: That's on account of a kind of gum. Chad: Wow. I'll chew on that. Truman: That's enough, Chad. Andy (angry and serious, to Chad): She gets messages from her log. Chad: Pinocchio's friend Truman: Goodnight, Chad. Chad: [sigh, walks out] : I'll go have a word with my pine cone. The gum bit must be a reference to a scene in Season 2 when Log Lady talks to Maj. Briggs about a message from her log ( she comments, "You wear shiny objects on your chest") , and Norma chastises her to use an ashtray if she's going to spit out her "sticky pitch-gum" instead of putting on the booth or counter, "like you did last time." Perhaps also a reference to "That gum you like is going to come back in style." Doubtful it means anything significant, but fun regardless. ___ I know Wally Brando gets mixed reactions - Personally, I didn't recognize Michael Cera at the time so it didn't take me out at all. And his monologue was one of my high points. I'm not sure if it was quoted here, but the following was my biggest laugh-out-loud moment to date, recited as a beatnik poem, like all his lines: "My shadow is always with me; Sometimes ahead, sometimes behind; Sometimes to the left; sometimes to the right; Except on cloudy days; or at night." The complete lack of irony in the delivery is what gets me... ___ More seriously, I noted this just prior to the Wally Brando scene, when Bobby enters the conference room and sees the picture of Laura Palmer. Bobby: What's all this about? Truman: A message from Margaret Lanterman to Hawk, concerning Cooper. Bobby: Cooper? Truman: Special agent Dale Cooper. Bobby: Yeah, I know. Cooper was the last person to see my father alive. Hawk: What's that? Bobby: Yeah, a few days after my Dad died, my Mom told me that Cooper had come by the house and talked to my Dad, and I guess Cooper left town pretty soon after that, I don't …. [trails off] Hawk: And nobody's has seen or heard from him since? Bobby: My Dad died in the fire a few days after that. Truman: Do you know what they talked about? Bobby: No, I have no idea. This visit must occur after Good Coop has entered the Red Room and Evil Coop has emerged, given that the fire took place outside of the events of the original two seasons. So Evil Coop met with Briggs at the beginning of his 25+ year adventure, and Briggs' body and its connection to Hastings is what brings Gordon Cole and the rest of the Blue Rose task force back into the picture. We seem to know from Hastings that Briggs was hiding from something in :The Zone", and that he wanted coordinates, like Evil Coop does. I presumed he was hiding from The Experiment/Mother, but maybe not.

I agree on hoping Sarah Palmer isn't retconned, and I think it makes more sense story-wise that it is something new. Surely something would have happened in the interceding 25 years worth noting by other main character residents of Twin Peaks if she had exhibited other signs of possession and throat biting prior to now. (I know, assuming such logic doesn't always fit into the TP world). But I, too, will be disappointed if it is developed as something she always had. As I continue my own Return re-watch up to episode 14, I hope no one minds if I keep dropping random observations, even though they have garnered little comment so far. Perhaps I am only amusing myself, so I'll try to keep it to a minimum. But if it is bothersome, feel free to send me off with a kind but firm word. @Jake @Chris I'll try to plop them in the proper threads for each Part, but no doubt there will be some crossover as things relate to where we are in the story now.

Random observations as we approach the final episodes: This moment's observation is just a humorous one I missed before, or forgot, at the end of part 3: Cole gets the call reference Cooper (Dark Coop) in South Dakota. Gordon (to Albert): Albert, we're headed for the Black Hills of South Dakota. Albert: The Black Hills - seriously? Gordon: As happy as this news makes us Albert, we can't put this on the radio. Albert: Perfect, I've been dying to see Mt. Rushmore. Gordon: It's good you want to hurry. We fly at dawn, and Tammy, you're coming with us. Albert (to Tammy): The absurd mystery of the strange forces of existence. Tammy: [exasperated look] Albert: How about a truckload of Valium? Love, love, love the deadpan combination of Albert and Cole. And the song at the end of this one is the first and my favorite up to Part 14. Lynch loves the mellow stuff, and not all of it is to my taste except on rainy days, but I could listen to this one many times (The Cactus Blossoms: Mississippi).

I am still on the fence about the Audrey coma theory. It is plausible, but I don't want it to be true. I would prefer something more imaginative, or at least different. That said, there were definitely some oddities with that Roadhouse scene. I noticed the same sorts of things you did that give it an uneasy vibe. I didn't take any of it as super straight forward. But since I like to contradict myself and play devil's advocate, I just started re-watching the first couple hours last night, and there are definitely some scenes there that play very oddly and seem to hint at something deeper but have never been mentioned again - Hard to tell what they mean, if anything. At face value, some of them seem hard to tie in. But I'm starting to doubt much of the footage included is incidental, and I think any scene with electrical hums in the sound must be intended as clues of some sort. Maybe that's what the Giant/Fireman means when he tells Cooper (and us) to "Listen to the sounds." I might have to buy a better set of headphones to see if that enhances the experience, as Lynch has suggested. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if there is deeper meaning to the notorious sweeping scene aside from just being "Lynchian." For example, the maintenance guy (Hank) at the apartment complex where Ruth Davenport's body is found in Part One/Two, about 40 minutes in. The cops are merely trying to gain entry to Ruth's apartment by getting a key, but Hank's dialogue indicates he somewhat expected the police to be coming for him due to whatever he was up to with some guy named Harvey. (Did Harvey send you? ... Well who told you I was going to see Chip? ... I was just on my way, but how did you know? ... Chip? Chip ain't got no phone. ) There's a slow pan when the cops enter Ruth's apartment where the camera moves to show some things plugged into an electrical outlet and lingers on a clock, though we can't see the time (2:53, or 4:30?), and electrical noises in the background. Later we see Hank on a phone call with Harvey, where he asks Harvey if he sent the cops after him, "to my place of business?," then says "No, I got it. I got all of it. But it's all mine. Mine and Chip's. No. You opted out of this one, remember? Don't threaten me Harvey. Harvey? Harvey ? (sounding worried)" [end scene] What does Hank have that he and Chip got while Harvey opted out - stolen money? garmonbozia? magic beans? Many questions, few obvious answers. It's one big reason I am loving The Return - there's always more to think about. It is not as easily digestible and predictable as most TV, even when I have some qualms like Jake and Chris mention about things like Truman failing to mention the key to Cooper's hotel room when he talks to Gordon, or Gordon not telling the Las Vegas FBI about Dougie's wife's name.

Just a few random questions about what might come in the last few hours. So, back at the beginning, the Giant/Fireman told Cooper, " It is in our house now," anf "All cannot be said aloud now," after telling him to listen to the sound, which seemed to come from the phonograph. Now that we're a ways in, any thoughts on what this means and how it's going to play out? What was the sound? I wonder if it was the sound of a frogfly. Cooper was also told to remember Richard and Linda. Who is Linda and when will we meet her? Did we already? Also, in addition to 253, 430 was mentiomed.

DoppelCoop actually vomits as well, but he does manage to hold it in until after Dougie Jones has already been pulled back.

After just reviewing the black box scene from Part I and the experiment scene from Part 8, I would tend to agree it is likely the same thing in all 3 scenes.

I don't think it's the same as the thing in the glass box/mother/experiment, though it could be. It seems more distinct in its difference in B&W, but was just too hard to see when I tried to upload the un-colorized image. It is also missing the horn type things the mother had and which appear on Dark Coop's playing card and Briggs' message.

Screen grab of the first scene in Andy's White Lodge vision, which appears to connect to the relation of alien/inter-dimensional beings as the "spirits that rule man and nature," as Hawk describes them. I thought I saw it upon my first viewing but had to re-watch and slow down to be sure. The image is shaking as Andy watches and it was very dark and extremely hard to see as a black and white image file, so I have taken the liberty of using a fill tool to colorize the figure.

A lot of reviewers seem to be having trouble with the concept of a "tulpa" in part because a some popular internet forums have run wild with the concept on recent years. A tulpa is a thought-form, an imagined being that can seem to take life when enough psychic power is directed at it. It can start as a fear or an imaginary friend, but takes shape with greater mental attention, and can, in some tellings, eventually become independent. Often associated with trickster-type phenomena if it breaks away from the creator's control. All this to say, with credit to IndieWire for planting the seed, Dougie Jones may have beem created by Bad Coop as a tulpa who lived independently until Coop entered this world and took his place. Some thoughts on tulpas from my favorite, now-defunct blog run by Jeff Wells: http://rigint.blogspot.com/2006/07/planet-of-lost-children-part-one.html

@jharp That rooster comment was very unneccessary. You appear to be mistaking Twin Peaks for Game of Thrones. Can we talk about Part 14 now?