Chris

Idle Thumbs 202: Poopwater, New Mexico

Recommended Posts

Like... recreational drug use, right?

Is caffeine included in that?

 

We call it recreational drugs here as a holistic term, i think because we have a massive problem with synthetic highs and other party pills (benzos) that kill a lot of students while NZ also has a massive Amphetamine problem so thats not exactly recreational.

But if you want to get pedantic; yes Caffeine, Tanin,  theobromine , tyramine,  etc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It just all seems extremely arbitrary to me. Certainly there are dangerous drugs out there, but given its relative benignity and cheap and easy production I honestly consider pot to be closer to chocolate and coffee than it is to heroin, even more so than ethanol is. We ingest so much for so many different reasons, some of the divisions I see drawn between bad drugs and good drugs are pretty silly in my eyes -- and that's before even getting into the legit medicinal usage of 'recreational' drugs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

I personally see drug use as wrong

All right I've been staying out of this because any time I see the words "I'm against drugs" I just kind of roll my eyes - not being interested, fine, that's your prerogative, and who gives a damp whistle - but being actively against it... 

 

Why? You've already admitted to drinking. Whether you do it rarely or not, you still do it. Why? What makes weed different? Why?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It just all seems extremely arbitrary to me. Certainly there are dangerous drugs out there, but given its relative benignity and cheap and easy production I honestly consider pot to be closer to chocolate and coffee than it is to heroin, even more so than ethanol is. We ingest so much for so many different reasons, some of the divisions I see drawn between bad drugs and good drugs are pretty silly in my eyes -- and that's before even getting into the legit medicinal usage of 'recreational' drugs.

 

Also not to mention the lack of knowledge out their in regards to it all.

For example ecstasy is a Class A drug, however kills almost nobody per year. Often the deaths are caused by other drugs that are thought to be ecstasy or dehydration caused by excessive pill consumption. Ergo should not be a Class A drugs and has many doctors / psychologists wanting to use it for medical purposes.

Also Weed has a great effect on sufferers of epilepsy, migraines, seizures and some psycho motor disorders, however its the CBD in weed that has the medicinal benefits not the THC. So yes weed shoudl be used for medicines but either as a pure CBD concoction like a Nasal spray (in development) or as a plant that has had the THC bred out of it (currenlty being done by weed growers in California). This has not been communicated to those who think that getting weed legalized means they can go lie to their doctor about pain usage and expect unlimited pot. Sorry thats not wahts going to happen.

My next point will be address in the below response 

 

 

All right I've been staying out of this because any time I see the words "I'm against drugs" I just kind of roll my eyes - not being interested, fine, that's your prerogative, and who gives a damp whistle - but being actively against it... 

 

Why? You've already admitted to drinking. Whether you do it rarely or not, you still do it. Why? What makes weed different? Why?

 

You and me could sit here and throw arguments at each other until the cows come home and neither one of us will change the others ideals, so i would like to keep this thread as civil as possible, which it has been to date but you seem slightly annoyed that I hold an opinion contrary to yours.

The reason why I see weed as different to the currently legal use of alcohol and cigarettes is: timing.

Scientific evidence exists that suggests Weed use is harmful, but not enough. A metric shit tonne of scientific evidence exists that suggests that Alcohol and Cigarettes are harmful but the thing is those studies came out after they were legalized. Its too late to undo the legalization of alcohol and cigarettes. Too ingrained in our society and economy.

Now the issue around Weed, and we are just talking about weed here not Ketamine or anything else is that we now have the science and laws surrounding this stuff to do the research first. Remember smoking was originally marketed as good for you, same with sun bathing, then 15 years later they turned around and said oops we were wrong a bunch of you now have medical issues.

The point here is to avoid that. Enough studies exists to suggest that we need to do our research first before blanket legalizing it. You may want it now but what happens in 15 years time when it turns out to cause severe medical issues? People blame the government, the government then has to put more money into treating it, then tonnes of money into making campaigns to lessen its use blah blah blah 

I want science to say its safe to the 0.05 percentile before supporting it, that's why. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

My point still stands. I said weed is only used by Teenage boys (mainly, I know girls who do it as well), and criminals.

Well 13.4 % of 4 million = 536,000 , and seeming the report Wikipedia references were stats taken from 2001, New Zealand had 245,370 (Stats NZ) involved in the court system in 2001 with 171,759 convicted for standard offending and 74,342 for serious offending, which leaves  about 240,000 people unaccounted for to which Stats NZ says we had just under 700000 teenagers in 2001

 

Yes we have it high, but its in ratio. Which is why I said its not societally prevalent because well everyone here knows its illegal and dismisses it as a youth thing or a criminal thing, that not to say adults don't use it, my father in law does (though he thinks hes hiding it form me) . Plus to be fair I am going on what I feel my society is like which is anecdotal but I live here so I would have a better understanding that someone who quotes stats established by the UN

 

 

In the population of more than 4 million, 13.4% of those between the ages of 16–64 use cannabis. This ranks as the ninth highest cannabis consumption level in the world

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The point here is to avoid that. Enough studies exists to suggest that we need to do our research first before blanket legalizing it. You may want it now but what happens in 15 years time when it turns out to cause severe medical issues? People blame the government, the government then has to put more money into treating it, then tonnes of money into making campaigns to lessen its use blah blah blah 

 

I think we would know by now if it caused severe medical issues and keeping it illegal just in case we discover one day that it is super harmful is kind of strange to me. What's even stranger about what you're saying is that since weed became illegal in the 1930s, we have discovered that it is actually much less harmful than what we were originally told which gives it the opposite trajectory of alcohol and tobacco. Some more studies are always useful but there is a hell of a lot of evidence that weed is far less harmful than a good number of things that are perfectly legal.

 

And even if it is harmful, is that really a good reason for why it should be illegal? Eating a lot of high calorie processed food probably puts you at a higher risk for heart disease but I doubt anyone would support making the distribution and consumption of Doritos illegal. If the best reason you can come up with for why something should be illegal is that we might find out it is harmful eventually, then it should probably be legal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Something to keep in mind when talking about whether or not something should be illegal is the history of that thing. I don't know the history of weed in New Zealand, when or why it became illegal, but in America it became illegal for the same reason most other drugs became illegal here: racism! That's a pretty bad reason for something to be illegal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think we would know by now if it caused severe medical issues and keeping it illegal just in case we discover one day that it is super harmful is kind of strange to me. What's even stranger about what you're saying is that since weed became illegal in the 1930s, we have discovered that it is actually much less harmful than what we were originally told which gives it the opposite trajectory of alcohol and tobacco. Some more studies are always useful but there is a hell of a lot of evidence that weed is far less harmful than a good number of things that are perfectly legal.

 

And even if it is harmful, is that really a good reason for why it should be illegal? Eating a lot of high calorie processed food probably puts you at a higher risk for heart disease but I doubt anyone would support making the distribution and consumption of Doritos illegal. If the best reason you can come up with for why something should be illegal is that we might find out it is harmful eventually, then it should probably be legal.

 

So yes Weed has been around forever, serious research has only really just started.

 

The current thing they are trying to ascertain is Schizophrenia / Psychosis. Prolonged use of the drug has been found to cause psychosis symptoms. This has mainly been found in youths, indicating that adults might be fine so many governments are waiting for replica studies and cohort studies (studies that follow people for up to 20 years) to confirm deny that. 

White sugar is currently being theorized to be to blame for the skyrocketing dementia rate which is costing govts millions, if weed has a significant chance of causing other mental illnesses through usage then they are going to want to avoid that cost.

Not to mention inhaling anything that lit like cigarettes isn't that healthy on your lungs. Every govt is doing a cost-benefit analysis 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not what I'm saying at all!!!

 

I'm just saying there's a thread already with a lot of posts about it and that's a good place to continue the discussion so it doesn't drown out other things.

 

Although I guess this episode is now the second-to-latest episode now that I think about it so it's not like it'll get much new discussion so nevermind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not what I'm saying at all!!!

 

I'm just saying there's a thread already with a lot of posts about it and that's a good place to continue the discussion so it doesn't drown out other things.

 

Although I guess this episode is now the second-to-latest episode now that I think about it so it's not like it'll get much new discussion so nevermind.

 

Its fine, I was just joking. Though I will shut up, talking about legalizing drugs on the internet is akin to shouting at a brick wall

However I am very impressed that no-one on this forum got super immature about such a contentious issue. I'm very impressed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes this poopwater thread on this video game website sets the high poopwater mark for refined and mature discussion.

poopwater.

 

You know what I meant. If I said drugs shouldn't be legal on YouTube i'd be called a F#ggot 8 ways from sunday but yea very mature for a thread called Poop water.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never been high and played a video game, but I have drunk and played Gran Turismo. And I have learned from this that DRINK DRIVING IS BAD KIDS.

 

Drunk driving (in Forza) nights used to be really awesome. I might have to get out my wheel and do that again.

 

Just me then?

 

I noticed that immediately. There's really nothing about that article that showed any forethought.

 

I might not have been that clear before, but I've just never bought a mattress. I always used the ones that came with the places I rented, I actually only bought furniture for the first time last year since we did need a desk and couple shelves on top of what the flat had. It didn't occur to me that a mattress costing half a grand could be normal/reasonable because that's a very significant amount of money to me for something I just thought of as being part of the bed itself.

 

Around here, I've never seen a place for rent by the public that was furnished. Occasionally, a friends parents or something will have a house up for rent because they're retiring or something. That's about it.

 

Oh yeah, I forgot about the pillows.  After getting a latex bed, I went all in and got a latex pillow as well.  It's the only one I've ever had that hasn't gone flat after repeated use.  I think they're great.

 

Is there a particular store/brand you like? I've got a really nice pillow, but I bought it when I was a stomach sleeper so it's way too thin for me now. Thinking about getting a replacement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is that because, to a certain level, it is legal in your country? 

 

Then you should understand how its baffling to those who live in countries where its NOT legal. 

 

Not to drag this out, but it's illegal in the UK, and along with osmosisch I was also surprised by the kerfuffle and utterly unbaffled by the anecdote on the podcast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there a particular store/brand you like? I've got a really nice pillow, but I bought it when I was a stomach sleeper so it's way too thin for me now. Thinking about getting a replacement.

 

It's been so long that I really don't remember.  I think it got it at a place like Bed, Bath, & Beyond but no particular brand.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Drunk driving (in Forza) nights used to be really awesome. I might have to get out my wheel and do that again.

 

I've done this before but always wanted to do a few timed laps sober, then repeat the same after 2 beers, 4 beers, and 6 just to see how dramatically the times are altered.  But I mostly don't because it seems silly and I don't even like the idea of subconsciously making it seem okay somewhere in my brain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I live in Denver, where weed is legal recreationally, not just medically, and I'm a ten-minute walk away from the nearest shop. I don't smoke anyway, but now I'm going to not smoke specifically to spite those of you for whom it's still illegal. While flipping both middle fingers in the air. HOW DO YOU LIKE THAT?!?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really don't want to extend the legality/morality/health discussion any further but I DO want to point out very briefly that Danielle is probably the single healthiest and fittest person I know, and she also pointed out that she hardly even drinks alcohol; this was an unusual occurrence for her. I don't know that, even for those who object to recreational drug use, this is actually a particular case for concern along any axis. She's not a notorious weedlord. Surely the notion of someone going outside their typical daily experience on an occasional basis in a way that doesn't harm or affect others is nothing to get too worked up about. Everyone is free to their own opinion of course but it's been a slight bummer to see so much judgment-inflected debate over a minor choice made by one of my friends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...notorious weedlord...

 

Well, time to file that away in the bank of possible usernames...

 

Also, agreed on all counts. Honestly, this whole "Drugs: Not Even Once: mentality probably does more to promote substance abuse and addiction, by stigmatizing even harmless experimentation to the point where someone can't admit to it, than smoking pot once every decade or two and then playing video games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now