PC or Console?

[Ryam BaCo]

I find it far easier to use a single controller over a keyboard&mouse combo...

my brother owns an xbox with games such as indiana jones or jedi knight 2. i played indiana jones for around 30 minutes till i stopped, because i wasn't able to controll indy precise enough and almost always had to replay jum-and-run passages, which got pretty frustrating soon. and for jedi knight 2: shooter controlls with 2 sticks instead of a good old mouse and a good old keyboard...just brrrrrrrr

[Erwin_Br]

Yeah, demos are one of the very few things that consoles have over the PC in terms of accessibility. In terms of just accessibility, I'd say that and online multiplayer are the two big ones, although Xbox Live is surprisingly painless and affordable.

You know, the speed of the processor, and even memory, aren't all that important compared to the kind of videocard you have. So I think we should really compare videocards with consoles. And I think you can get a pretty decent videocard that plays all the latest games for about the price of a PS2.

--Erwin

[Chris]

Yeah, but you need the rest of a computer for that video card to work. My problem right now is that the amount of money I can actually afford to spend on a machine is enough for a video card, but not for the other stuff that surrounds it. Not to mention, the PS2 will almost always work as advertised and certain games won't need special drivers or any silly lameness like that.

[manny_c44]

It also seems that because the limitations are clear and known for consoles, more work can be poured into the actual artwork and style of the game, rather than optimization at the risk of quality.

Even with PS2's limited hardware, if a developer has a good art direction and knows the boundaries, the results can be stunning. Usually, big budget console games have more fleshed out art aspects, while big budget PC games try to push the envelope of technical effects are settle for mediocrity (with the exception of a few titles, like Grim Fandango...which I've only heard about from friends).

[MrHoatzin]

(with the exception of a few titles, like Grim Fandango...which I've only heard about from friends).

HAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHHA!!!

[Salka]

From a few friends? And maybe the fact that every second word(s) of every review of every game ever made ever reviewed on Idle Thumbs... is 'Grim Fandango'?

D'ya suppose you might be missing something?

[ragnar]

I must say that I am turned on by the prospect of not having to check the required system specs on the back of a game before buying it.

You don't? You need to check if it says "XBox" "PS2" or "Gamecube" at least and if you only own a PS1 (or other older console) you are in as a bad situation as if you own an old PC. And you are even less likely than on a PC to be able to play older console-games on newer machines, the exception being the playstation series.

[Chris]

You don't?

No, you don't. The console for which the game is made is prominently featured on the front of the box (since you seem to want to play semantics), and once you see that you know instantly whether you can play it or not. It's utterly different from checking system specs and wondering how much worse "minimum" will play than "recommended". And tell me why you'd even be in the section for a different system than the one you own? Unless you're in some kind of crazy bargain bin, games are always separated by system, and even bargain bins are too in almost all cases. And you're not in "as bad a situation as if you own an old PC" if you don't have the correct console--Xbox and PS2 both cost $150 (or a comparable amount of some other currency), which is less than you'd expect to pay for even a sub-standard graphics card alone, and GameCube costs a measly $99, which is only 2/3 the price of the other systems.

[Simon]

Yeah, the point is you don't have to worry about keeping your system up to spec if it's a console. As long games are being released for your console, you can play them. The only update that I can think you'll ever need is a memory card for your savegames.

With PC hardware, you can be wondering whether 'Minimum system requirements' are actually going to allow a playable fun experience. There have been several games in the past where I've just fallen within the 'minimum' and had un-fun jerky moments. Video card compatibility is also a minefield as far as I can tell. Many new games are shipped with unresolved issues with certain video cards, and updated drivers can make older games no longer work properly.

Frankly, the hardware of PC gaming can be a real headache, and the world of consoles is a happier, more carefree place altogether. But I still hang in there with my PC and just hope it works with my new games when I get them home.

[Intrepid Homoludens]

PC games are 'notoriously' known to push the technical boundaries so of course they're going to be risky to buy compared to console titles. There are practically innumerable potential problems to prevent PC games from running at the nominal acceptable level (i.e. fundamentally playable), let alone the optimal level (all the bells and whistles turned on). You never know what's gonna happen when you load up the S.T.A.L.K.E.R.s and the Quake IVs on your rig, but only then will you really find out if you can at least get them to work on your particular setup. Hence, this is practically a case by case basis.

And that's not even yet considering how well the developers programmed the whole software. There are often instances where, even if you did own the $3000 desperately bleeding-on-the-edge dream system, it's still no guarantee. Many people with high end rigs still had problems getting Deus Ex: Invisible War to run smoothly, and this had more to do with the devs failing to streamline the game to run optimally.

That said, the console by comparison 'deliciously' levels the playing field, so to speak, by enforcing a 'no-brainer' standard, simply because the console itself never changes its specs, never needs upgrading (except every 5 years when its next gen younger brother is born). So there is far, far less risk of a game not running smoothly, everyone gets the optimal performance. It's so damn silky convenient. A clueless soccer mom can simply look for the Xbox logo and grab the game at Walmart and moments later enjoy a session of Prince of Persia with her hubby and kids, just as any hardcore console gamer can do.

[Roderick]

Do I smell a hint of posh elitism?

[Intrepid Homoludens]

De-clog your nose, mister. I was merely pointing out some more pros and cons. For one deficiency one platform has, the other platform compensates for, and vice versa.

[MrHoatzin]

I've been watching my roommie play Metal Gear Solid 2 on the PS in the living room and I have to say that the controls are fucking atrocious -- so much so that they make a minor nuisance of his playing style: he tries to play a sneaker by shooting everything in his fucking line of sight and then wonders why the enemies do a radio check and send in a dozen reinforcements with Kevlar shields (to my ample annoyance and copious consternation).

Looking around, aiming, shooting, walking, crouching, crawling -- all basic forms of being in this goddamn game are chores worthy of separate mentions -- except maybe hiding in a cardboard box, which is kinda cool. To mind also comes Metroid Prime which also had some fucked up all awkward-like controls. And just as a token Xbox mention, Halo sucks control-wise as well, though not as much as the other two. PC controls for a game like this could hardly be as convoluted. If there only was some more ergonomic left hand key pad as a stand in for the wasd, ~ through 0, tab, shift, alt, zxc, q, ert, fgh, space, esc through F12, [, ], Enter, et cetera, I don't think any controller eugenicists would complain.

Right now I am sitting in a comfortable chair, with my keyboard in my lap, with the optical mouse on my right knee (I use the area of denim a little under my right pocket as a mousepad). Later I may play some NOLFSIHARMW and I would not lament the lack of desk as you don't need a desk for this setup. I might as well be in my living room. So, I don't buy the controller works without a desk school of console adulation (which may or may not have been brought up in this thread).

[manny_c44]

You probably only find the control schemes of MGS and Metroid Prime akward because of your prior PC use...these control schemes are actually very intuitive, and some of my favorite outrside-of-the box control schemes.

MGS in particular is pretty easy to sneak around in. It has a pretty much revolutionary menu system and control scheme (or MGS did) X changes your stance and then the stick controls your movement. I'd guess that you and your roomie just don't have the patience to learn the control scheme...

Halo is the only game that is trying to play like a PC game out of that list, with one moving and the other aiming (emulation keyboard and mouse). I think this is the only game with atrocious controls from the ones you mentioned.

[Chris]

I can understand people saying "Halo's controls are not for me" but what I can't understand is people calling them atrocious; there are clearly innumerable people who adjusted to them almost instantly and reached a very high level of skill. Prime's controls are good too once you get past the bulk of the learning curve, but it's very difficult for me to believe that a player playing Generic FPS with Prime's controls could in any way outmaneuver someone using Halo's controls.

[Roderick]

I would like to add to this that Metroid Prime is NOT a standard fps-game. It's more of a firstperson adventure. Absolute precision doesn't enter into this as you can lock onto enemies to perform a wealth of moves. In comparison, Halo is much more of an fps, where you actually need to aim the reticule over an enemy's head. The controlschemes are adjusted according to the games' gameplay. In both cases, I think they've been optimised for controller-use for their respective playstyles.

[Chris]

Rodi: I completely agree. My point was directed at the surprising notion that Halo's controls are more awkward than Prime's (hint: they're both fine).

[Roderick]

[MrHoatzin]

Yeah, I'm getting pretty tired of the whole "mouse and keyboard are so much better, playing FPSes on a console is pointless" tirade. No, you don't get the remarkable precision that you get with mouse+keyboard on a controller, but who decided that FPS games always have to give you remarkable precision? You blahblah blah blah blahb...

Yeah, yeah, yeah, eunuchs are people too even though they have no balls.