Jake

Idle Thumbs 162: Cavorting Amongst the Corpses

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Lest I seem dismissive, I should note that I consider myself amongst the hoi polloi who don't have anything "interesting" to say. I'm not an artist, but I'm technically proficient in writing, for example (not that you'd know it from my posts, har har), but I flounder even at trying something like NaNoWriMo because I realize I don't have anything to _say_, so I find it difficult to justify the words I'm putting down. I start telling a story, but I realize I don't know why I'm telling that particular story among the infinite possibility space, and sputter out.

 

Even though it can be awkward, I recommend Storium (once it is released) for writers in your situation. I find that people waiting for my turn and expecting me to stay true to the world encourages me to write fiction frequently and within limits. The card system quickly becomes trite, but it takes care of the nothing-to-say problem. The textual results aren't always amazing, but I feel that I have much more developed ideas for when I actually go to creating my own cyberpunk story. I think Merus mentioned that there are story-telling forums of some sort that can accomplish the same, but I'm not familiar with them. 

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I should probably also mention I personally know somebody who is a technically great painter, however is obsessed with disney and pretty much defines herself that way.  It frustrates me to no end because if she just expanded her horizons a little; exposed herself to more of what's out there in the world she could do more interesting work.  So in part my annoyance is in my face a little, I could be placing assumptions on all people who do fanart through that frustration.

 

Is it possible to do something "interesting" within the Disney fanart milieu? I think it absolutely is. Disney's characters are among the most recognizable characters in our culture, and they come with all sorts of assumptions about euro-centrism, femininity and masculinity, etc. They're probably as relevant to modern day artists as representation of the Greek Gods or the Virgin Mary in their respective heydays.

 

Although, and this may be what you're getting at as well, expanding horizons is never a bad thing in terms of creating. In order to put a unique spin on it, she probably needs to have a unique point of view beyond simply re-gurgitating the Disney style guide, and new experiences would probably help her flesh out what that point of view could be.

 

Even though it can be awkward, I recommend Storium (once it is released) for writers in your situation. I find that people waiting for my turn and expecting me to stay true to the world encourages me to write fiction frequently and within limits. The card system quickly becomes trite, but it takes care of the nothing-to-say problem. The textual results aren't always amazing, but I feel that I have much more developed ideas for when I actually go to creating my own cyberpunk story. I think Merus mentioned that there are story-telling forums of some sort that can accomplish the same, but I'm not familiar with them. 

 

Thanks, that looks pretty neat, but I think I may not have expressed the nature of my issue clearly. I think things like Storium could help people who want to write, but have trouble sticking with it, or have trouble with the whys and wherefores of characters and motivations, because you have a constantly evolving backstory that you can use as a prompt. That's pretty cool.

 

The problem I experience I think is closer to: Why am I writing at all? Why take an hour out of my day to actually put a pen to paper? How is my voice unique, and what does it contribute to the reader? What is the message that wells up within me that I think the world needs to hear?  (There's a saying that you shouldn't be a writer unless you can't imagine not being a writer: I can easily imagine not being a writer, so I think it probably isn't for me. )

 

I have artist friends who, while they wouldn't describe it as such, are probably in similar situations. They enjoy the activity of putting ink on a page and creating images. It's relaxing, or improving their skills feels good, etc. But there isn't a broader "why" to the entire thing. They draw because they're artists: it's what they've always done, they're trained at it, they can create pleasing images that most people cannot, it's how they self-identify. But there's no real reason for it. I think this is the kind of situation that leads to some of these fanart communities. Of course, I'm at least one step removed from it, so I may be way off base there.

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Is it possible to do something "interesting" within the Disney fanart milieu? I think it absolutely is. Disney's characters are among the most recognizable characters in our culture, and they come with all sorts of assumptions about euro-centrism, femininity and masculinity, etc. They're probably as relevant to modern day artists as representation of the Greek Gods or the Virgin Mary in their respective heydays.

 

Although, and this may be what you're getting at as well, expanding horizons is never a bad thing in terms of creating. In order to put a unique spin on it, she probably needs to have a unique point of view beyond simply re-gurgitating the Disney style guide, and new experiences would probably help her flesh out what that point of view could be.

 

I have artist friends who, while they wouldn't describe it as such, are probably in similar situations. They enjoy the activity of putting ink on a page and creating images. It's relaxing, or improving their skills feels good, etc. But there isn't a broader "why" to the entire thing. They draw because they're artists: it's what they've always done, they're trained at it, they can create pleasing images that most people cannot, it's how they self-identify. But there's no real reason for it. I think this is the kind of situation that leads to some of these fanart communities. Of course, I'm at least one step removed from it, so I may be way off base there.

You hit the truth quite a bit, her interest in disney is pure fanaticism.  I tried having a conversation about feminism and disney once with her and she just was not interested at all.  When she does the disney stuff it's purely from a "I love this character" view.  She self defeats herself a lot and is pretty stubborn about trying new things.  Her original work is vastly superior but she doesn't connect with it that way, it's weird.

 

As far as doing the work and fanart, I think you're in part right that it's easier to borrow content than to create and that could be a part of why there's such a large base for fanart.  The artist could not even be aware that's why they're doing it really.  It could also be some people focus so hard on those technical skills that they don't take the time to observe the world around them and find inspiration to work.  Whether that observation be literal or more abstract thought about something observed. Realistically, there is no one real answer, everyone will have different reasons for doing what they do.  I paint in attempt to translate ideas and relationships I observe in my life, in a social commentary sense I suppose.  But that was not something I had really attempted until the past couple years on any level.  I guess my frustration may be that artists that obsess over a specific pre-existing property may not be consuming other forms of information to better themselves, at least that's the impression I often get from pure fanart.  Again though that frustration is more aimed at people who are clearly skilled artists that are adults.  I totally understand younger people doing fanart, it's something they love and they want to both express that and replicate an image; it's the practice that will let them hone their skills hopefully into something more later on.

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No offense all, but this conversation has huge shades of the "adults reading YA books" conversation to me (both are relatively pointless and inflammatory discussions spending your time arguing about how others spend their free time on a forum that's dedicated to playing video games, something others are super judgmental about). 

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I admit there's a part of that, but I actually don't have a problem with people consuming these properties they enjoy, it's just when a singular thing dominates everything they do that irks me a little.

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Isn't all art in chapels and such basically fan art? The Divine Comedy is the first fan fic of our time! None of that shit was/is canon. Unless I remembered wrong.

 

So I got back from my honeymoon in Italy last week, and this post just caused my brain to leak out of my ears. :-\

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So I got back from my honeymoon in Italy last week, and this post just caused my brain to leak out of my ears. :-\

Why?

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There's that deleted scene in Top Gun where Tom Cruise gets in a mech and wreaks havoc.

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What movies were the Thumbs talking about where Cruise is in a robot suit? I can't think of any other than Edge of Tomorrow.

Oblivion.

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Why?

 

It's a weird anachronistic way to talk about things. The idea of a canon is a much more modern idea, and it's certainly a weird way to frame religious art in the pre-Reformation era when the Church didn't place a primacy on Biblical text relative to the public expression of faith (the meaning of the word Catholic is derived from Greek meaning "according to the whole"). Fan art supposes a divide between the author and audience that just doesn't reflect the world view of early Renaissance European religious life. Religious art as proto-fan art is an interesting idea of course... it's just a very jarring way to think about it after spending a bunch of time walking around and being immersed in that environment.

 

P.S. The apartment we stayed in in Venice was right next to Campo Santo street.

 

P.P.S. We ate at a pizza place in Rome called de Remo. It was good.

 

P.P.P.S. I see that Campo Santo has been working on sweet hand and arm animations. While checking out some ancient Roman ruins my wife pet a bunny who then flopped on its side. It was adorable. Please include this as a feature in Firewatch.

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There was no robot suit in Oblivion though!

 

iirc in the next few sentences Chris adjusts to "wearing future suits" or something a little broader. Cruise does seem to be in the mood for more Minority Report-esque movies at the moment, anyway.

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Wait till you read the Jesus/Judas slashfic.

 

...

...

...which I'm sure actually exists...

 

I didn't actually click on any of these links

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I didn't actually click on any of these links

 

Some highlights:

 

Thank God Lazarus has a pool.

 

Lazarus himself was attempting to set up his new grill with the help of Philip, Andrew, and Thomas. Thomas, as always, was playing the part of the skeptic.

"I don't think that's going to work, Lazarus. It doesn't say that in the instructions..." he was chastising.

"Thomas, please," replied Andrew, shrugging him off.

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I think I was conflating Oblivion and Elysium which were at the same time.

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