Chris

Idle Thumbs 156: The Holo-Violator

Recommended Posts

I've heard multiple directors and people making movies that casting is almost everything when it comes to making a good movie. I remember a PT Anderson quote from one of this commentaries that his directing style is to cast great actors and then just support them while they act.

 

So obviously, I don't expect people that don't really give a shit about the new Star Wars movie to care about casting news. I didn't give a shit about the new Star Wars movies either - like Sean, I've cooled way way off on Star Wars. But this cast is so absolutely stacked its insane. It's like they grabbed every actor I had seen in a movie recently thinking "huh, that guy is pretty cool" and then gave them a lightsaber. This casting news has gotten me excited for the new movie in a way that worries me. I don't want to be excited about Star Wars again and be disappointed again. And this cast is full of up-and-coming actors, which is cool.

 

Anyway, didn't mean to freak out on the forums about this. Just wanted to hopefully point out why this news might be exciting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One last thing about FRACT - the 'Hand' thing is the central hub of the game. They are the three pillars of color that you activate at the very begging/tutorial. Also, I found that there are little posts/sticks that seem to indicate where to go. I've been following them and they've taken me to the next puzzle pretty quickly. Admittingly, I haven't played much, so it's still early days.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now Disney owns Marvel, does that mean we'll never see another marvel vs capcom fighter?

Hopefully they'll create their own fighter or kart racing game, they've got a big enough cast of characters to topple Mario Kart. Imagine it, a bubble head Han Solo sat in a millennium falcon kart racing against Manny Calavera in the Bone Wagon

Disney has owned Marvel since 2009. MvC3 came out in 2011.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disney has owned Marvel since 2009. MvC3 came out in 2011.

 

Now, Wikipedia and every other source may agree with you on this, but I distinctly remember that this happened just the other day, and 2009 is 5 years ago, so I'm pretty sure you're wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By the way, where did the episode title come from? I've listened to the episode four times now and I must be tuning out around that time or something. I thought it might have something to do with the Spelunky violators that Chris mentioned wanting to make with Olly during one of his daily streams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By the way, where did the episode title come from? I've listened to the episode four times now and I must be tuning out around that time or something. I thought it might have something to do with the Spelunky violators that Chris mentioned wanting to make with Olly during one of his daily streams.

 

It's when they're talking about the new and disgusting ways that the Star Wars movie will be marketed to you. Something like, "A Star Wars holo-violator will pop up when you're trying to read the Wall Street Journal."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now, Wikipedia and every other source may agree with you on this, but I distinctly remember that this happened just the other day, and 2009 is 5 years ago, so I'm pretty sure you're wrong.

Well, I think that's the Final  Word on this topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's when they're talking about the new and disgusting ways that the Star Wars movie will be marketed to you. Something like, "A Star Wars holo-violator will pop up when you're trying to read the Wall Street Journal."

Aw, poop! I totally remember hearing that part and just never clued in.

 

 

By the way, you guys have mentioned Italian Spiderman multiple times. If you haven't seen it before, you should totally watch some of the Japanese Spider-Man TV series from the seventies, which is a big part of what Italian Spiderman is meant to be parodying. It's exactly as ridiculous as Italian Spiderman, but entirely self-serious.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPX-FX0KStE

 

 

Marvel actually still owns the rights to this version of the character and recently mentioned that they intend to use him in an upcoming Spider-Man comic, which is the best thing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm constantly finding ways to reach places that I'm not sure if you're supposed to be able to reach or not, with the answer always being no, this path does not lead anywhere. I feel like a hypocrite, because I always think I want more free exploration and less direction in games, but in this case I'd really like a little more direction. Going in circles forever is pretty frustrating.

 

This always weirds me out when I feel it in a game, because I wonder - am I simply used to being handheld, and that's why now that I'm left to explore the world myself I'm having trouble enjoying it? Or is it just that this game's free exploration has been done in such a way that it doesn't really work for me?

 

I know it kinda heads into the silly area of playing a game "correctly" or not, but that doesn't stop me thinking about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This always weirds me out when I feel it in a game, because I wonder - am I simply used to being handheld, and that's why now that I'm left to explore the world myself I'm having trouble enjoying it? Or is it just that this game's free exploration has been done in such a way that it doesn't really work for me?

 

I know it kinda heads into the silly area of playing a game "correctly" or not, but that doesn't stop me thinking about it.

 

I think this happens with challenging works of art in lots of other types of expression.  Personal receptivity plays a big role, but a cultural shout of acceptance also helps.  I like to find out about pieces of experimental music that get great reviews, but don't read the text of the reviews.  It's incredible how often I struggle to keep focused and enjoy the piece, but when I go and read about the piece and someone can guide my listening it goes down much smoother.

 

I used to think I needed to listen to a piece of music at least three times to try and account for the fact that I'd probably not always be in the most receptive of places.  But now I feel so inundated by media in general that if I don't "get it", and no one's shouting positive things about it in that moment of time, I just move on.

 

Likewise, I don't worry about playing correctly; I don't like diminishing my aesthetic and play needs of the moment for chasing 100% receptivity.  Plus it's fun and great to accept that you missed something.  Imagine the few (or majority of?) people that heard the first Velvet Underground album when it got released and weren't in the right state of mind to appreciate it.  They could always go back after hearing the crazy amount of praise the band got later on and go, "oh shit! I heard that album so long ago! Thought it was shit! Huh, maybe I'll give it another chance."

 

I just think some of us work too hard to be empathetic to the creators.  It certainly pays off sometimes, but I'm currently in a state of mind where I think it's more often a bad habit that finds us wondering if we're wasting our time or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By the way, you guys have mentioned Italian Spiderman multiple times. If you haven't seen it before, you should totally watch some of the Japanese Spider-Man TV series from the seventies

 

Japanese Spiderman is fantastic, I watched the whole series (41 episodes) with a friend a couple of years ago. It was available on Marvel's website but now it just gives me a 'page not found' when searching for an episode... Well the episode guide is still there: http://marvel.com/tv/show/128/japanese_spiderman/episodes

 

Here's some episode titles:

 

"The Secret Emissary from Hell, the Enma Devil"

"The Mummified Beauties of the Uncharted Amazon"

"The Incredible Wild Girl Who Bullies Boys"

"To the Flaming Hell: See the Tears of the Snake"

"Once Upon a Time in the Mysteriousless World: The Cursed Cat Mound"

"Fearful Hit Tune! Song Dancing Murder Rock"

"The Terrifying Half Mer-Man! Calling the Miracle Silver Thread"

"The Time of Revenge Has Come! Beat Down Iron Cross Group!"

 

So to me Spiderman will always be about the fight against the Iron Cross army and Machine Bems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used to think I needed to listen to a piece of music at least three times to try and account for the fact that I'd probably not always be in the most receptive of places.  But now I feel so inundated by media in general that if I don't "get it", and no one's shouting positive things about it in that moment of time, I just move on.

 

Likewise, I don't worry about playing correctly; I don't like diminishing my aesthetic and play needs of the moment for chasing 100% receptivity.  Plus it's fun and great to accept that you missed something.  Imagine the few (or majority of?) people that heard the first Velvet Underground album when it got released and weren't in the right state of mind to appreciate it.  They could always go back after hearing the crazy amount of praise the band got later on and go, "oh shit! I heard that album so long ago! Thought it was shit! Huh, maybe I'll give it another chance."

 

I just think some of us work too hard to be empathetic to the creators.  It certainly pays off sometimes, but I'm currently in a state of mind where I think it's more often a bad habit that finds us wondering if we're wasting our time or not.

 

I think this is actually a really good approach, and I've been swaying ever so slowly towards it.

 

One thing that's made me more relaxed about whether I'm receptive or not has been reducing the hyperbole in my spoken opinion about a particular game/novel/film. If I talked in terms of things sucking or being terrible or being the best thing ever I'd feel pressure to make sure that my opinion about a particular work had solidified, and I'd really given it its due. But I've since realised that my opinion about something doesn't need to be set in stone after experiencing it - it's totally valid to have an opinion about a work that changes over time, or that perhaps comes out of not being receptive to it at the time. But the hyperbole was contributing to me feeling that I needed my opinions to be "true" and final.

 

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with hyperbolic expression of opinions in general - it's just that for me personally, reducing the hyperbole meant that I gave myself more freedom to experience things regardless of my perception of my own state, and to form and change opinions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Likewise, I don't worry about playing correctly; I don't like diminishing my aesthetic and play needs of the moment for chasing 100% receptivity. Plus it's fun and great to accept that you missed something. Imagine the few (or majority of?) people that heard the first Velvet Underground album when it got released and weren't in the right state of mind to appreciate it. They could always go back after hearing the crazy amount of praise the band got later on and go, "oh shit! I heard that album so long ago! Thought it was shit! Huh, maybe I'll give it another chance."

The period of time where you are only mildly receptive or not at all interested can help facilitate a eureka moment too. There are songs I heard on the radio as a kid that I'm just now hearing the lyrics of for the first time when they come on. I have to concentrate on the lyrics in order to notice them. It can be really surprising to find out that something I've become familiar with, yet wouldn't think I'm invested in, has a potential whole other dimension of appreciation available to me at another time. An extreme example of this for me is Chuck Close. I've always liked his work, but when I found out he was face-blind (about a year ago), his paintings took a new meaning for me that is just as significant (if not more) as how I appreciated his work before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The dual glee and disdain with which Sean dumps on Spelunky and all related chat has wildly overtaken Spelunky chat by multiple magnitudes as something I don't look forward to hearing on the cast. I know you guys are coworkers and friends, and thus I don't know if there many laughs about Spelunky put-downs while the audio's not recording, nor imaging there's any real or lingering tension, but it's starting to feel weird and out of place and sort of bitter on the podcast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's hilarious and I want more gleeful hatred of fellow hosts' passions!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The dual glee and disdain with which Sean dumps on Spelunky and all related chat has wildly overtaken Spelunky chat by multiple magnitudes as something I don't look forward to hearing on the cast. I know you guys are coworkers and friends, and thus I don't know if there many laughs about Spelunky put-downs while the audio's not recording, nor imaging there's any real or lingering tension, but it's starting to feel weird and out of place and sort of bitter on the podcast.

 

Talking too much about something and talking about not talking too much about something are both not great, in my opinion. I have to admit though, hearing Chris say that he doesn't want to invest in something like Dark Souls 2 because it can't guarantee him immediate bite-sized pleasure like Spelunky (before you interject, Chris, I know that's the least charitable interpretation of what you said, I'm just being playful) had me feeling a little funny, too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does that make you feel funny? I'm in Chris' boat - my life is just too busy to say "I am going to sink 40 hours into a game that's going to be rewarding for 20 to 30 of those hours" or something. Games are fucking LONG. I can read great novels in the time I waste in a long game, and I can basically read ALL the great novels in the time it takes to finish a long game. Spelunky, meanwhile, is amazing every day for 15 to 30 minutes or whatever, and it's never going to take much longer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interestingly enough, I've heard a number of people say that Dark Souls 2 is divided up into very manageable chunks of time, and so they treat it similarly to how Chris treats Spelunky, something they play for about half an hour a day for basically the next year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does that make you feel funny? I'm in Chris' boat - my life is just too busy to say "I am going to sink 40 hours into a game that's going to be rewarding for 20 to 30 of those hours" or something.

That's a misrepresentation of the Souls games though. They're rewarding pretty much from the moment you realise how the combat system works, and earlier than that if you like the aesthetic design sensibilities.

Further, especially on your first one they're likely to be much more fun/less frustrating if you play them in chunks (progress to the next shortcut or bonfire for example. The dying/respawning mechanic makes the game play in a sort of roguelike flow where you get to try until you die, and then your attempt mostly resets. That lends itself perfectly to pick up/put down play.

I found Spelunky infinitely more frustrating/hard to get into, mainly because I strongly dislike platforming but also because I don't find the early levels or general aesthetics appealing. It's got almost everything I like in a game so this is still frustrating to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does that make you feel funny? I'm in Chris' boat - my life is just too busy to say "I am going to sink 40 hours into a game that's going to be rewarding for 20 to 30 of those hours" or something. Games are fucking LONG. I can read great novels in the time I waste in a long game, and I can basically read ALL the great novels in the time it takes to finish a long game. Spelunky, meanwhile, is amazing every day for 15 to 30 minutes or whatever, and it's never going to take much longer.

 

Why is time spent in a game wasted? Is all time spent on certain games wasted? All time spent on types of games? All time on all games?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does that make you feel funny? I'm in Chris' boat - my life is just too busy to say "I am going to sink 40 hours into a game that's going to be rewarding for 20 to 30 of those hours" or something. Games are fucking LONG. I can read great novels in the time I waste in a long game, and I can basically read ALL the great novels in the time it takes to finish a long game. Spelunky, meanwhile, is amazing every day for 15 to 30 minutes or whatever, and it's never going to take much longer.

 

It makes me feel funny (which is not an absolute judgment of anything) for three reasons. First, Chris has put at least a hundred hours in Spelunky, so having him balk at the time investment for any other game seems silly if perfectly human. Second, Spelunky is only rewarding if you've invested a huge amount of time in it already. I guarantee you that the first twenty hours of "eating shit in the mines" is not particularly rewarding and that a sudden death ten minutes in clipping a mantrap isn't rewarding at all, even at Chris' level of literacy in the game. Third, Spelunky is not really much more suited to bite-sized play than other games. I tended to play Spelunky until I had a run I could be proud of, but like Osmosisch recommends, I tend to play Dark Souls until I find a bonfire or die, whichever happens first.

 

I totally get getting into a groove with a certain game and nothing else appealing to you the same way. I just don't think it's the unique merits of a certain game that does that, more than a set of habits that develop when you train yourself to play a single game intensively.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm wondering whether feels good while playing is being incorrectly conflated with rewarding in this discussion. I see all of my time playing Demons' Souls as rewarding regardless of how I felt while playing. The achievement I felt at finally getting good at that game was directly related to the previous phase, where playing felt fruitless and I thought I wasn't getting any better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For clarity, the part that made me post the uncomfortable comment was when Chris said he had an announcement to make, and when it was about the daily challenge Sean was the most disgusted I've heard in weeks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For clarity, the part that made me post the uncomfortable comment was when Chris said he had an announcement to make, and when it was about the daily challenge Sean was the most disgusted I've heard in weeks.

 

No, there's that, too. I was also disappointed that Chris' "announcement" was that he's missing a daily challenge, but Sean's show of disdain rubbed me the wrong way. The whole situation's uncomfortable, like I'm sure the many dozen hours I've been dumping into Dark Souls the past week has been for my own friends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know that when I go into Spelunky or Titanfall, the fact that I'm starting over makes it feel more convenient. Games with stories or grand-strategy games require me to take a few minutes to remember what was going on when I left. Lately, that requirement has kept me from playing those games. I'm going to try and play Shadowrun with small time-investments as an experiment. I've been playing nothing but Titanfall for the past two months, and I want to see if I can play a story game for 15-30 minutes at a time by not playing anything else when I have a moment to game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now