Terminal7 5: The Actual Best Thing

[Nelsormensch]

Terminal7 5: 



The Actual Best Thing
Terminal7 hosts its first special guest as the illustrious Quintin Smith of Shut Up & Sit Down joins Nels and Jesse to talk all things Netrunner! Continuing our multi-week faction discussion, the most interesting/evocative cards from not-quite-human manufacturing empire of Haas-Bioroid are highlighted before moving on to the genius and expertise of the Shapers.

Games Discussed: Android: Netrunner (Don't expect this will change much)

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[Brodee]

great podcast guys. I agree with Quinz about how you guys talk about the fun stuff about netrunner. it balances out all of the hardcore analysis.

 

One correction encryption protocol only works on installed assets/upgrades, so it won't work on a Snare!/dir haas in hq/r&d.

 

also, it sounded like you guys were in the same room, so great job sound guy.

Edited January 7, 2014 by Brodee

[tberton]

great podcast guys. I agree with Quinz about how you guys talk about the fun stuff about netrunner. it balances out all of the hardcore analysis.

 

One correction encryption protocol only works on installed assets, so it won't work on a Snare!/dir haas in hq/r&d.

 

Installed assets and upgrades.

[Nelsormensch]

One correction encryption protocol only works on installed assets/upgrades, so it won't work on a Snare!/dir haas in hq/r&d.

 

Ah yes, that's very true! So I guess there'd be probably no reason for the runner to pay to sack a Snare! if an Encryption Protocol was up. Unless you've got Isabel McGuire and you can pull it back up again

 

also, it sounded like you guys were in the same room, so great job sound guy.

 

Thanks! Matt helped me and Jesse not sound like butt, and Quinns just recorded the audio on his side and I edited them together. It actually ended up sounds better than I expected but as good as I hoped, which was quite nice!

[tberton]

In the middle of the podcast right now and I have to say that I disagree with you guys about Crims and Fast Advance not being fun to play against. I understand that seeing them all the time gets boring, but I have a lot of fun playing against Criminals for the exact reason that Quinns hates it: it accentuates the hidden information of the game. I like the fear of an Inside Job, Account Siphon or Emergency Shutdown. And, having played a lot of Criminal myself, I like trying to figure out what my opponent has in their hand. I know that if you keep drawing past 5 cards, it means you got a boatload of great events that aren't useful right now, so I'll draw you into wasting that Inside Job or I'll avoid rezzing my big ice for as long as I can. Playing against Criminals, anything can happen at any time and I love it.

 

As for Fast Advance, the most fun games of Netrunner I've ever had were against NBN Fast Advance. Once they've got an AstroScript or two scored, it becomes super exciting. Every turn is a hail mary, running R+D to keep them from getting another agenda, forcing them to rez ice so that they're poor. I've had a couple games like that come down to the last few cards in R+D and it's incredibly tense.

 

So I don't think it's really fair to say that HB and Shapers are how the game is meant to be played. They're one aspect sure, but the great thing about Netrunner is that there are so many options.

 

EDIT: On the topic of Strongbox, it's almost certainly Red Herrings, but the Runner has to spend a click to steal the agenda rather than 5 credits. It just makes so much sense, given what HB does.

 

EDIT2: Really surprised that there's not really been a mention of HB's focus on program trashing. Aggressive Secretary, Ichi and especially Rototurret all feel like quintessential HB cards. Rototurret especially is a "defines the game" card, so that Runner's always want to have a Sentry breaker installed before they install other programs.

[Nelsormensch]

As for Fast Advance, the most fun games of Netrunner I've ever had were against NBN Fast Advance. Once they've got an AstroScript or two scored, it becomes super exciting. Every turn is a hail mary, running R+D to keep them from getting another agenda, forcing them to rez ice so that they're poor. I've had a couple games like that come down to the last few cards in R+D and it's incredibly tense.

 

I think the thing that bugs me about FA is it's all about risk mitigation, but risk is the part of game I like the most. Once the corp scores a pair of Astroscripts, the game becomes way too much "Who will draw the right card first?" So then it's just who got luckier on their shuffle. Mostly though, it just seems like it's what the collective mind of the internet has deemed the "best" way to play and anytime that happens, it grosses me out.

 

It's nowhere near as dumb, but it's the same reason ICE-less NBN: TWIY* where it's just about getting two SEs in hand and then either tagging with Breaking News or letting the runner steal it and tagging with Midseason Replacements. That deck is literally just racing the opponent to draw the "right" cards and I find them gimmicky and silly. Ditto on Noise decks that run Crypsis as the only breaker and just install virus after virus after virus.

 

Again, FA is actually legit strategy and not like, I find it's just less fun to play against than other types of corp decks.

 

So I don't think it's really fair to say that HB and Shapers are how the game is meant to be played. They're one aspect sure, but the great thing about Netrunner is that there are so many options.

 

Oh yeah, "meant to be played" kind of has a value judgement in it. I think we just meant the classic/vanilla/more fundamental/way, not like the best way or anything like that.

 

EDIT2: Really surprised that there's not really been a mention of HB's focus on program trashing. Aggressive Secretary, Ichi and especially Rototurret all feel like quintessential HB cards. Rototurret especially is a "defines the game" card, so that Runner's always want to have a Sentry breaker installed before they install other programs.

 

Ah yeah, that's true. I guess it doesn't feel exclusively HB since there's a goodly amount of non-HB cards that trash programs too (Archer, Grim, heh, Burke Bugs, Swordsman, etc). It's probably just because I've gotten ruined by Archer so many times that it sits large in my ruined brain

[ajenteks]

Great episode!  Would you mind posting your alternate starter decks you scavenged from your second core box?

[Nelsormensch]

Great episode!  Would you mind posting your alternate starter decks you scavenged from your second core box?

 

Oh, I should! They're actually currently on loan to a friend, but when I get them back, I can. They're far from optimal, but mostly straightforward. I may actually removing everything related to traces though, just to simplify it even more.

[Zebadiah]

Hello! Love the podcast and Shut Up and Sit Down, it was amazing hearing you guys together talking about Netrunner. 

 

From the podcast, it sounds like you had the same desire as I did to be able to teach new players with better starter decks than the recommended core decks. I'll be publishing an article this week with decklists specifically designed for teaching new players Netrunner. I've already written the first part here: 

http://stimhack.com/teaching-netrunner-part-1/

 

Let me know if you find it helpful and thanks for the podcast!

 

P.S.: It was pretty cool to hear that one of you worked on Mark of the Ninja at Clay; it's a small world!

[ajr82]

Hey guys, just wanted to chime in to say that Nels talking about Netrunner on Idle Thumbs was enough to get me to pick up the core set, and listening to this cast has me up to three data packs so far.  I've downloaded OCTGN, but I can't seem to get it to connect.  Once I've figured that out, though, I'd love to have someone walk me through the interface.

[Jutranjo]

Hello, I wanted to ask something about Personal Workshop and theme. This topic looks the most suited.

 

I really love that you guys talk about these things, most sites only do mechanics reviews.

 

Thematically lots of things work well, like Stimhack doesn't give you money, it gives you some drug high to run better or trash more things. The credits are just a mechanical thing. 

Stealing money with easy mark, sure gamble, earning money with liberated account, Armitage codebusting, makes sense.

 

I'm sure you guys talked about credits pumping icebreakers but I've honestly forgotten when and what you said about it.

 

Personal workshop is some shack or something where you start work on/create things you've heard about or seen somewhere, like at Wyldside. It takes time (clicks) to start a project. That's cool, every day/turn you spend a little time tinkering with projects.

 

What's bugging me is how does the ability to instantly put things off it into the game mid run or during the corp's turn work thematically? What do you guys think?

 

Some scenarios make sense, NBN scores Breaking news. The runner hears about this, runs to the personal workshop and tries getting out with anything that's done, leaving the rest to burn. Even stimhacking archives or some server to finish some hardware or programs is cool though the doing it while running a server is weird. How does having a location away from where you're hacking from help you with mid run installations and flexibility with programs? 

 

Thanks for reading!