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Rob Zacny

Episode 244: Best of eSports 2013

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Andrew Groen and Taylor Cocke join Rob to talk about the eSports scene in 2013. The crew discusses how the different games have evolved and where they'd like to see eSports go in the future.

 

Link to episode 244

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With regular episodes I can enjoy listening even if I've never played the game. The only esport-game I follow is League of Legends and as soon as you start talking about SC2 or dota2 I lose interest. To make esports episodes really interesting you would need to have people involved(players and developers) with esports on the show.

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I would really like a regular podcast focusing on e-sports in general. I mostly watch League (and Company of Heroes 2) but I checked out EVO, the International and will probably watch CS:GO IEM. The only thing like it I have watched is the Rob Breslau Leauge show and the short lived Idle thumbs Dota 2 podcast. 

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Really good episode.

 

I've never been much into e-sports, but I've recently watched several Hearthstone lets-plays and a few of TotalBisquit's StarCraft II matches, and I'm beginning to see the charm... I loved how newbie-friendly and informative this episode was, as you addressed several of the things I've thought about myself: why e-sports is relevant, how to make it more popular, and what it is people want to see anyway. I hope to have a chance to watch some CS matches soon — it sounds a lot easier to understand than LoL and DOTA 2.

 

I don't think you mentioned it, but I think turn-based strategy games would work too — like Civilization 5 or Alpha Centauri etc.; Sure, the games would take forever and/or need to be cut up into several sessions, but I think it would be fun to watch.

 

Anyway, good episode! Not exactly what I expected. :)

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My interest in esports is more intellectual rather than as a potential fan. The level of coverage in this week's podcast was enough to hold my interest; I suspect if it were to dip a little further into the minutia I'd be wavering. For myself, as long as the coverage stays in a place where I can pick up the missing bits from context rather than having to really understand who Piefold or MoofMoof are, it's interesting enough that I can kind of view it as an anthropological expedition.

 

I come to 3MA largely for what it says on the tin, and the esports discussed have a definite strategy element to them, so as long as they don't take over the show, I'm good with regular esports episodes.

 

What I would definitely be interested in hearing some time is a deep dive on the evolution of the game or metagame strategy on an esport (any of them, whichever is most interesting). I know the subject gets a little weird because it winds up driven at least in part by the developer, but perhaps that's part of the interest as well; is the evolution of strategy in the game just following the tracks laid down by the developer's schedule? Does Valve know what the metagame for DOTA will look like in two years because they've got a pipeline of changes planned out, or are they just kicking new stuff out the door and waiting to see what happens?

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You guys (3MA hosts who are are way into esports moreso than readers of this thread) might find this show's wrap up of the year pretty interesting: http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1u2afu/if_you_watch_1_show_this_year_make_it_unfiltered/

 

I caught most of the crazy 5 hour length and there was a lot of real talk about how players/casters/streamers feel about the state of esports in general, the future or lack thereof for each game, WCS vs LCS vs Ti3, etc.  Be warned a lot of crass humor but a lot of honest discussion too  -- none of the guests are well known enough to really care about watching what they say.  Seems pretty rough to be a straight up esports journalist.  Lots of esports inside baseball stuff.

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Could I ask a quick aside question on the eSports topic? Why do players age out so fast? Rob joked about aging out at 24, which is clearly not far from the truth.

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Could I ask a quick aside question on the eSports topic? Why do players age out so fast? Rob joked about aging out at 24, which is clearly not far from the truth.

 

Most esports seem to tend to focus on APM ("actions per minute"). Depending on how well regulated it is, it'll either be due to loss of speed from age, or decreasing effectiveness of amphetamines due to overexposure.

 

I'd really like to see the development of more intellectual esports. What we have now is (metaphorically) speed chess; the games hinge on a few quick decisions and a bunch of fast execution, mostly of pre-planned standard gambits. I'd far rather watch something like a high-speed version of Neptune's Pride, where speed and execution are important but strategy and cunning factor heavily as well.

 

It's a problem I have with regular sports as well; I'm not into them enough to pay attention to the metagame, but that's where all the real strategy and thought happens. The actual match is just a glorified JRPG battle of personified stats mashing into each other.  "Quarterback uses Long Pass: It's Ineffective."

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Not that I know much about the science of aging, but it seems like mid-twenties is a little bit early, aware as I am of the intense nature of play. The only other sport I can think of with such hard limits is American Football, and that's due to the repeated hard impacts.

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I don't think it's the reflexes as much as the lifestyle.  Practicing for 8 - 12 hours a day living in a cramped team house... eventually it becomes a tradeoff you don't want to make.

 

FWIW the typical retirement age seems does seem to be moving up over time.  24 used to be like the oldest player still playing.  Now there are many way past that.

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