Childless, 31 Year Old White Men

[singlespace]

PAR has an article on the insane working conditions in the game industry and the incredible turnover rates:

http://penny-arcade.com/report/article/why-your-games-are-made-by-childless-31-year-old-white-men-and-how-one-stud

 

Kotaku also ran an article by an anonymous developer on the state of publishers today:

http://kotaku.com/we-need-better-video-game-publishers-472880781

 

It's amazing that this has been the status quo for well over a decade and it doesn't seem to be changing.

[Merus]

This was the problem unions were supposed to fix.

 

But yeah, that's why I never went into the games industry as a young man - I fancied having a life, and worked out I could get paid a lot more money programming anything else and making games in my spare time.

 

And then did not do that for a decade.

 

But still! It was a sound plan.

[Dewar]

As long as people keep agreeing to work like that, it will keep happening. You've got to know what you're worth I guess.

 

On the other hand, considering the low (or so we're told) amount of actual profit turned on most games these days, I wonder what would happen to the games industry if wages went up. More outsourcing I would guess, but would the big guys be able to even hold it together?

[axemtitanium]

PAR has an article on the insane working conditions in the game industry and the incredible turnover rates:

http://penny-arcade.com/report/article/why-your-games-are-made-by-childless-31-year-old-white-men-and-how-one-stud

 

I'm clearly the worst human being for commenting on this instead of the articles, but the url for PAR article is incredibly misleading. It clearly wants to say "Why your games are made by childless, 31 year old white men, and how one stud is sexing up all the game development ladies". Buh, time to actually try to make an intelligent comment.

 

There are a number of related issues here. One is that "game development" is still mostly staffed by people who would call it a "dream job" and, as such, are willing to put in long hours for little/no overtime in the hopes of impressing their "game dev heroes" or getting that coveted creative director position. The industry is extremely unreceptive to any sort of unionization for better pay and working hours effort because there will always be more fresh, hungry programmers to replace competent veterans. And that's assuming that developers want to unionize, which might jeopardize their climbing the design ladder, risk their jobs in the face of corporate execs, or lose their social standing among the "hardcore dev" crowd who compare working hours as a measure of worth. On the opposite side, Dewar makes a good observation that AAA development is actually not particularly profitable (EA has a 7% profit margin. Ubisoft's is just 3%). Rising costs, especially since the HD console generation, have massively cut into revenues, meaning that increasing wages would be disastrous to AAA.

 

What this means is that AAA development is unsustainable. More outsourcing is a bandage and ultimately amounts to underpaying someone in Asia/India rather than someone in America. I'm guessing that AAA development bottoms out within the next 5-10 years and there's another video game crash. The industry almost needs one in order to reset people's expectations (both the consumer's and the corporate's, re:Square Enix's ridiculous sales expectations for Tomb Raider et al.). In its wake will hopefully be a landscape dominated by smaller projects, mostly indie-driven if this year's GDC is anything to go by. And I think it'll be okay. And just for the hell of it, I bet the next console generation is the last one. There's barely any difference between consoles and PCs at that point, so the generation after next will probably just become some weird modularly updated blob that will run every game forever.

[Merus]

What's incredible to me is that even a decade ago, making your own game was something you could totally do. Game Maker was a thing! You could make proper games in it! And if you could program, so much the better. Cave Story was made that way.

 

I think AAA development is going to thin out - there's been this uncomfortable jump between indie games for which the most you can ask is about $20, and AAA titles at $60. A game like Darksiders 2 would have done quite well at a price point in between those two; it was substantial but not an event. It seems like digital distribution is mainstream enough that you could probably get that to actually work now; I think that now we're at a place where you can do pretty great looking stuff so long as you're willing to lock the camera off, the gap between how AAA looks and indie is going to diminish enough that there might be genuine value for a mid-size studio to offer.

 

I do wish people would stop referring to it as a 'crash', the Big Video Game Crash only happened in America, and only on game consoles. PCs were fine, Europe was fine, games were fine.The games industry is built on novelty and perpetual renewal. It's really quite the trick, when you think about it, but it means that a 'crash', where everyone goes down at once, is almost completely unlikely to happen unless the customers disappear, and that seems unlikely.

[axemtitanium]

Yeah, I'm probably talking about a crash in the different sense that any prior "crash". I'm thinking of a crash where AAA development eats itself because it has just become this massive ouroboros and being profitable is actually legitimately impossible (10 million sold or bust?) because costs have gotten too high. If selling a million copies at $60 is not profitable for you, then you're probably doing it wrong. Even so, I would like to see a move toward more diversity in pricing, cf. Darksiders 2. Midcore indeed.

[syntheticgerbil]

Okay, is this just an article promoting Nine Dots? Seems pretty fluff.

 

From what I've heard, in general trends the industry seem to point to the hours being less and crunch being an undesirable waste of time. http://www.igda.org/why-crunch-modes-doesnt-work-six-lessons Signs are pointing to change anyway, without Nine Dots somehow being this angelic studio from heaven we all need to care about. I mean isn't it a Double Fine policy to eliminate crunch and allow family time as much as possible after Psychonauts?

[Twig]

Can't speak for everywhere, obviously, but my place of work is pretty laid back about hours, as long as you get your eight and/or get your work done. Part of that may be that we make mobile games, though. Certainly not as demanding of resources as your triple-ay title.

Unfortunately, it's not exactly the most rewarding, creatively speaking. Hm.

[Chris]

What's incredible to me is that even a decade ago, making your own game was something you could totally do. Game Maker was a thing! You could make proper games in it! And if you could program, so much the better. Cave Story was made that way.

I think this is at least as true now as it was then, possibly even moreso. Hotline Miami, the original Spelunky, and Gunpoint were all recently made in Game Maker. Unity is probably one of the most accessible and robust 3D game engines ever.

The cost of large-scale commercial games has skyrocketed, of course, but an individual person would never have been making one of those a decade ago either.

[Zeusthecat]

Since I was a little kid I dreamed of working in the video game industry like so many others in my generation that grew up playing video games. It has been a major driving force that has influenced many decisions I've made in my life. In fact, one of the reasons I pursued a degree in electrical engineering with a minor in computer engineering was so that door would always be open even if it was still very unlikely. Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately in the context of this forum topic) I graduated in 2009 and could not afford to take my time trying to find my dream job. My wife and I had just had our first baby and I was lucky enough to be offered a job at a great engineering firm where I eventually moved over to their software development group so I could continue to cultivate the skills that were most relevant to what I am passionate about.

 

When I see articles about the crazy working conditions across a large portion of the gaming industry it makes me very sad, and I have seen quite a few of them over the last several years. I have realized at this point that it is quite unlikely that I will ever actively pursue a job in the game industry and that is primarily because I need to be there for my wife and kid and need a healthy work-life balance, something that appears to be rare in the game industry. This is further exacerbated by the fact that so many studios seem to have a short life-span and are unlikely to provide any kind of long term career which is what is important to me. I know I am talking in broad strokes and that there are some game companies out there that buck this trend but that seems to be the exception rather than the rule. If I ever find that opportunity to work for a game company that allows for a good work-life balance and is likely to be around for awhile I would take it in a heartbeat but at this point I'm not too optimistic about that happening.

 

The good news is, rather than bitching and moaning about it, I decided to take advantage of the tools that are available to hobbyists and everyday people and have started teaching myself how to make basic games to satiate my desire to take part in this process in some meager way. I downloaded Visual Studio Express, the Allegro game library, and Paint.net and just started making my own games from scratch in C++ and drawing all of my own bitmaps to stitch into the game. It has been such an awesome experience learning to translate my ideas into a game, even if it is something only I will ever see or play. I still hold out hope that one day I will come across that perfect opportunity and be able to do this type of thing for a living but I am grateful that there are tools out there to allow me to experience the process for myself.

 

Sorry for the long post, this topic struck a chord with me.

[Berzee]

Since I was a little kid, etc.

 

You basically told my precise story in the process of telling your own The only major differences being that I do not yet have an baby, and I fizzled out trying to make games with C++ and Java, then switched over to Flash games using Flixel, which is nice, because you can put it on Kongregate and be pretty sure that at least a few people besides yourself will play it (and tell you that it runs slow on their computer)! I'm in a situation like you describe, thinking "If I make progressively better one-person games on the side for a goodly while, I will be READY when <video game developer celebrity> emails me and offers me a Glorious Opportunity!!!"...but at the same time, the more I make games by myself the more I worry that I will become spoiled by not having to respect anyone's opinions but my own during the development process. =P

[Dewar]

I also have always had a dream of doing game design. At first it was Pen and Paper RPGs, now I really want to make a console game of some sort. Thankfully, I saw the horrible crunch times coming and avoid getting into either of those as a career path. Hobby wise, I got about half way through progamming a game for XBLIG using C# and XNA, but then switched jobs to a much more difficult (but satisfying) one and the game has been on the back burner for the last year and a half. Now XNA is being retired. I guess I really should be learning how to program phone games anyway.

[elmuerte]

I'm childless, 31 years old, white. I've dabbled in game development, as hobby and professionally. I've done professional webdevelopment. I've worked in academics. Now I work in the enterprise software business.

Software development wise, academics was the most interesting to me. But the funding structure doesn't provide a job, just a short-lived contract.

For me the academics part was the most gratifying, and I received the most respect.

Enterprise software development is extremely ungratifying. You work with a shit load of idiots, slackers, etc. Sometimes you are rewarded by some crunch time.

Game development is populated with way more talent, more respect from colleagues, but less job security.

Maybe it's a bit depressing, but as young software developer, it's shit all over. Or at least, that's my take on it.

[Corelli]

I am an idiot and I understand and can use Unity.

Game development is cracking wide open and my guess is that we're just starting to see the effects.

[Zeusthecat]

"If I make progressively better one-person games on the side for a goodly while, I will be READY when <video game developer celebrity> emails me and offers me a Glorious Opportunity!!!"

 

Haha! Buried somewhere deep down inside below my logic filter I have this same fantasy.

 

As great as it has been to start undertaking these tasks myself for my own enjoyment, I still crave the idea of having a career that involves going to work everyday and immersing myself in video games and sharing that experience with other people who share the same passion as I do. I can't imagine a more fulfilling way to live out my life. Since I am in a position where I cannot afford to take any big career risk I will have to wait and see how the state of the video game industry changes and hopefully find that company that is capable of striking a good work-life balance with good job security (and then hope for enough good fortune for there to be a job opening and come out ahead of all the candidates and land the job). In the meantime, I'll just keep learning and making my own stuff in my spare time and experiencing awesome games made by people who had the good fortune and determination to do what I dream of.

[clyde]

Y'all could just collaborate online in the meantime. I'm sure you have a list of ideas, I would think that one idea from the list would match someone else's. You might not make money from it, but it'll give you the sense that you are doing more than working a job and feeding yourself.

[singlespace]

Enterprise software development is extremely ungratifying. You work with a shit load of idiots, slackers, etc. Sometimes you are rewarded by some crunch time.

Game development is populated with way more talent, more respect from colleagues, but less job security.

Maybe it's a bit depressing, but as young software developer, it's shit all over. Or at least, that's my take on it.

Enterprise software is a large field ranging from hardcore database development to mind numbing SAP, but I'd generally agree with your assesment. Luckily it's not representative of the tech sector in general.

[axemtitanium]

 immersing myself in video games 

 

If you're in the Boston area, there's http://www.indiegamecollective.org/ which is a blob of indie devs and companies sharing a space to work. Their office is really cool. I'm sure there are similar establishments in all the major cities (SF, LA, Austin, NYC, etc.) and they'd probably appreciate whatever after-hours man hours you can contribute.

[Zeusthecat]

Y'all could just collaborate online in the meantime. I'm sure you have a list of ideas, I would think that one idea from the list would match someone else's. You might not make money from it, but it'll give you the sense that you are doing more than working a job and feeding yourself.

 

I do like the idea of collaborating with fellow hobbyists and sharing concepts but I guess I'm a little self conscious about my ideas. While they sound awesome and great in my head I have that juvenile fear that everyone else will think it's stupid and ridicule me. However, this (Idle Thumbs) community seems super supportive and I don't get the sense that that would be an issue here.

 

Are you aware of any threads on the forums here where this type of discussion is or was going on? If so I'd happily jump over and join in.

 

 

If you're in the Boston area, there's http://www.indiegamecollective.org/ which is a blob of indie devs and companies sharing a space to work. Their office is really cool. I'm sure there are similar establishments in all the major cities (SF, LA, Austin, NYC, etc.) and they'd probably appreciate whatever after-hours man hours you can contribute.

 

Now that sounds freaking awesome! Is this the type of thing where you volunteer to help out with some of the existing game projects that those indie devs and companies are working on or is the idea that you would bring your own game projects to work on in a community space alongside others?

[lobotomy42]

This is really not that different from most creative fields.  People LIKE working in them, so there's very little incentive to pay people very much, because there's always someone trying to get their foot in the door who's willing to work for less money or in worse conditions.

 

Have you tried being a novelist these days? An actor? A filmmaker? A musician? Most of the people who try these things will simply never get paying work in these fields.  Many of them will spend many many hours working on their masterpiece and never see a dime.  A few get lucky.  As it becomes easier and easier to makes games, the games industry will probably also move in this direction. Most games will be made by people with a passion working in their spare time, and a lucky few will have a career making blockbusters.  It's sort of sad, but on the other hand, it wouldn't happen if people fundamentally didn't enjoy (or believe they enjoy) working on these sorts of creative projects. 

 

If being an accountant were fun, we could abuse them more, too!

[axemtitanium]

Now that sounds freaking awesome! Is this the type of thing where you volunteer to help out with some of the existing game projects that those indie devs and companies are working on or is the idea that you would bring your own game projects to work on in a community space alongside others?

 

It probably depends on the company. This Boston collective is a bunch of separate companies pooling resources for a space. The upshot for them is lowered material overhead and the opportunity to share workspace with like-minded people. Apparently having lunch every day with other developers not working on the same project is massively helpful for hashing out ideas. As for your question, I think it's more towards the former. Finding (or organizing) local game jams would probably be more helpful for the latter.

[ChattyWhacker]

I mused the idea of being a gaming programmer in my youth in middle school but soon changed my career to performing arts....Yeah.  So, now I'm a computer science major and I have no intention of being a game programmer.  I enjoy programming but from all the horror stories I've heard from different development houses are similar to stories I experienced in the performing arts world.  I really hope that the industry finds better practices for it's core developers.