Sno Posted February 5, 2013 So this was just released and it seems very, very awesome, it is definitely a thing worth talking about. I'll probably have some thoughts to share once i put some more time into it, but right now I'm curious to see if anybody else here is playing it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted February 5, 2013 It looks brilliantly. It's not out in Europe yet, is it? I've got the GBA Fire Emblem still waiting on my 3DS (ambassador program), but might just skip it altogether and get this new shiny one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 5, 2013 It's up on eShop as a digital download, is that world wide? As for Sacred Stones, the one that came as part of the ambassador program, that is actually a really fantastic game. Of the games in the series we've seen released outside of Japan, it's probably my personal favorite, and it's also the one most like Awakening. Have you ever played a Fire Emblem game before? You haven't played any of the GBA games? Awakening gives you the option to play with the permadeath disabled, and i decided i would split the difference and play this "casual" mode on the hard difficulty, but i'm a few hours into the game and really regretting the choice, I really don't like what it does to the game. It's not about the reality of being able to permanently lose a unit and having to deal with the fallout of that, nobody plays the game like that, people will always restart missions if they lose somebody on a dumb move. Generally you only want to let that stuff stand if it was an exceptionally difficult mission where you feel like you did everything you could. Ultimately though, that's not the path you want to keep going down. If you've lost more than six or eight guys in a playthrough, and especially if you've lost units with unique functions, you're heading down a rough road. (It also just sucks! It hurts losing a character you like and have not just put effort into building up, but have also watched develop relationships with the other members of your party.) So what the permadeath actually did for Fire Emblem was set a flow and tone to the game where every move has weight and so you're cautiously evaluating enemy ranges and trying to intuit the actions the AI will take, always making sure never to put your units into needlessly risky situations. The thing is, with the cautious pace and the occasional mission restart, you end up spending like three times as long on the game than you would otherwise. That is the main reason i decided to play on casual, i've been through these games before, i know what it's like, and... I don't know. I'm torn. I'm probably going to end up playing through it twice if i decide i like it enough. (It seems awesome, and i didn't really actually like the last few FE games.) Anyways, i'm saying that i think i would recommend playing the normal classic difficulty for a first exposure to the series. The easiest difficulty with the permadeath enabled. Also, make sure your units all get some of the exp share, letting strong units eat up all the experience is a bad rookie mistake. Let some of the tougher guys soften up enemies for the weaker guys to get the kill. Support bonuses are also pretty essential, make sure you're placing your units such that they're building affinity while performing actions. Stronger relationships mean stronger support bonuses. ALSO. This game has DLC hooks and there's a time-limited free DLC on the eShop. Except it's not actually on the eShop, you have to download it from an in-game store that isn't accessible until a certain point in the story. Combined with the shipping delays, that's all kind of insane. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted February 6, 2013 I'm sort of concerned about all the eShop full game downloads: Virtue's Last Reward already ate up half of the memory on my machine. Do I need to start swapping out memory cards if I want to download more than two big games? It's kind of a drag that makes me think I should wait for a physical copy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro Creep Posted February 6, 2013 I'm sort of concerned about all the eShop full game downloads: Virtue's Last Reward already ate up half of the memory on my machine. Do I need to start swapping out memory cards if I want to download more than two big games? It's kind of a drag that makes me think I should wait for a physical copy. Honestly, if you have even a fleeting interest in purchasing eShop games, a 4GB SD is what you should have at the very least. Fire Emblem is around 1.5GB (the actual cartridges can hold up to 8GB, so even this is relatively small compared to what could be done). If you have a spare 4+GB card lying around, the process to dump all of your save data is as simple as copy-pasting the folders from the root of the original card to the root of the new one. From an American perspective, picking the eShop release over a physical cart was an incredibly easy decision. Shipments of carts have been delayed for periods ranging from a few days to a few weeks at some retailers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted February 6, 2013 This being Nintendo, I'd have thought the process would be a lot more arduous. I've searched a bit and am pretty interested now: apparently the 3DS supports cards up to 32GB, more than enough for its entire lifespan. If I can get a cheap card I might just migrate - I won't even have to swap out cards and data in between games or anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shammack Posted February 6, 2013 Yeah, that's the way to go. I just picked up a cheap 32 GB card during an Amazon sale, and I've barely made a dent in the free space after downloading New Super Mario Bros. 2, Paper Mario Sticker Star, and Fire Emblem in addition to all the ambassador virtual console games and the various eShop games I've been accumulating since the DSi. As for Fire Emblem, I'm enjoying it a lot so far, but I do slightly wish I had a manual for it -- I feel like there are a lot of systems that I don't fully understand (for example, sometimes when I have two units adjacent to each other, they'll attack together, but other times it's just a stat boost... and I don't really know what "pairing up" my dudes does for me). I've been trying to let my stronger guys soften up the enemies so the weaker ones can get some experience, but it's proving to be pretty difficult to pull off. The weak guys are starting off so weak that I basically can't use them if there's any chance they'll take damage from anybody, and the strong guys can usually deal about 3/4 of the enemies' HP worth of damage, but not quite enough to let the weak guys finish them off in one hit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro Creep Posted February 6, 2013 Yeah, that's the way to go. I just picked up a cheap 32 GB card during an Amazon sale, and I've barely made a dent in the free space after downloading New Super Mario Bros. 2, Paper Mario Sticker Star, and Fire Emblem in addition to all the ambassador virtual console games and the various eShop games I've been accumulating since the DSi. As for Fire Emblem, I'm enjoying it a lot so far, but I do slightly wish I had a manual for it -- I feel like there are a lot of systems that I don't fully understand (for example, sometimes when I have two units adjacent to each other, they'll attack together, but other times it's just a stat boost... and I don't really know what "pairing up" my dudes does for me). I've been trying to let my stronger guys soften up the enemies so the weaker ones can get some experience, but it's proving to be pretty difficult to pull off. The weak guys are starting off so weak that I basically can't use them if there's any chance they'll take damage from anybody, and the strong guys can usually deal about 3/4 of the enemies' HP worth of damage, but not quite enough to let the weak guys finish them off in one hit. There are two types of "pairing". Note: Stats are italicized, unit modifiers are capitalized. Duel The first is two or more units simply standing next to each other on the field. The attacking character gains a stat boost, the size of which depends on how many allies are adjacent to them at the time of attack. There are a few extra features to Duel, one of which is Dual Strike(both characters attack). Another is Support Block, where a Support character negates damage done to the one being attacked. Pair Up The second is when two units combine to occupy a single square on the map, and effectively function as one. The first unit (Lead) gains a stat bonus depending on the class and level of the second unit (Support). The Lead unit can also carry the Support unit as if the Support unit had the same Movement value. This is very useful for Mages or other characters with a low Movement. Pair them up with a mounted unit for the greatest effect. Both systems increase a Support rank, which influences marriage options and offspring stat growth. Note that not all characters can have a relationship just anyone, except for the Avatar. A great resource for this stuff is Serene's Forest. It's full of charts and formulas that go into pretty deep detail about all of the systems that are tucked away in the game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 6, 2013 As for Fire Emblem, I'm enjoying it a lot so far, but I do slightly wish I had a manual for it -- I feel like there are a lot of systems that I don't fully understand (for example, sometimes when I have two units adjacent to each other, they'll attack together, but other times it's just a stat boost... and I don't really know what "pairing up" my dudes does for me). The pre-battle screen tells you everything you need to know. A chance for a coordinated attack and a chance to nullify damage by blocking the enemy's attack, and if neither of those happen, you just get stat boosts based on the support level. I think that's how it works. (Additionally, in the case of multiple adjacent units, the one with the highest support rating seems to be the one that joins in.) I've been trying to let my stronger guys soften up the enemies so the weaker ones can get some experience, but it's proving to be pretty difficult to pull off. The weak guys are starting off so weak that I basically can't use them if there's any chance they'll take damage from anybody, and the strong guys can usually deal about 3/4 of the enemies' HP worth of damage, but not quite enough to let the weak guys finish them off in one hit. So the pairing system would actually be helping you out a lot here. You can take a strong unit, and based on their class and the support rating, they will buff certain stats of the joined unit. You can give the weak ones the slight edge they need to start catching up. Paired units will also ensure affinity gains and coordinated attacks no matter the situation, in addition to the unit in the "back" being protected from damage. (Switching the lead unit in a pair is also a free action and can be done after moving and before another action.) So you make your units safer and stronger, but the reason you don't want to just pair everybody up is that you generally won't be able to then deal enough damage in a single turn to hold back an aggressive enemy group. (The back unit in a pair can only assist in coordinated attacks.) Also, Serene's Forest is a great resource, I've been looking to myself as well. You might want to actually hold off on checking it out, though. There's some big game systems in Awakening with functions that kind of serve as giant spoilers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
K-bohls! Posted February 6, 2013 Yeah there are definitely systems that Awakening just seems to ignore explaining. As someone who played a fair amount of Sacred Stones I knew the general pace and what to expect, but the finer details can be hard to suss out. I also think "Normal" is way too easy, even for someone who hasn't played FE in a while. I am playing Classic Normal and barely even need to pay attention. I have my dude and Frederick team up and murder fools, one hit usually kills and never more then three or four damage when attacked. The maps seem to be built around very obvious choke points, which makes it dreadfully easy. Anyone know if it ramps up the difficulty? I am only around mission six or seven so I hope it does. The systems outside of battles are top-notch though. It took a while to care about the story or characters (you have amnesia!), but I find the support conversations and barracks to be good fun to engage in. Kellam4lyfe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 7, 2013 Well, about Frederick, i hope you're not making the mistake of letting the early game tank eat up all the exp. Either use him as bait to pull enemies into a situation where other units can easily finish them off, or use him for pairing buffs to help somebody else get some exp. Also, I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around all of the Wireless/Streetpass/Spotpass/DLC stuff in the game, it all seems kind of crazy. For the Streetpass thing in particular, it looks like you can set up a team that will then populate the world map of another player's game as a random battle to engage in. You might be able to recruit other people's avatars by winning fights that have been seeded into your game? I'm not clear on how it all works. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tegan Posted February 7, 2013 I really liked the demo of this, but the local EB Games broke the street date and now that there's a shipment shortage I'm not sure if I'll be able to get a copy at all by the time I can afford one. As a side note, I don't know much about Fire Emblem, but it's my absolute favourite example of taking a doofy-ass video game tune from years gone by and making it as grandiose as possible by giving it an orchestral treatment. You know that incredible theme music that the series has? It's literally a commercial jingle. Fire Emblem, tough simulationWhen you'll begin playing it, you won't be able to sleep anymore Although you should surpass your opponent, a critical hit ! When there's nothing more left, Life Staff, when you're in a hurry, Relife Staff Both in attack and defense, don't press unwisely, And don't let anyone die !! Fire Emblem, tough simulation When you'll begin playing it, you won't be able to sleep anymore Put too much effort on powerful people, And your warriors on the whole will only be novices Fire Emblem, tough simulation A tale of love and courage Fire Emblem, tough simulation Come and win bravely ! When things become dangerous, run like the wind ! Those who get cocky will put themselves in peril Fire Emblem, tough simulation Come and win bravely ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 7, 2013 I'm far enough into the game that now i'm now starting to deal with the big lasting decisions about promotions and reclassing and which relationships i actually want to push for. I'm loving it, i'm completely hooked, they're doing some awesome things with the series tropes in this game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
K-bohls! Posted February 8, 2013 I heard tell that characters can get married if a relationship progresses far enough, and that children can fight for you. Have you actually done any of this? I am wondering if for every possible combination of characters there is a whole other character specifically made to be their offspring. That would be pretty radical if true, and it would probably prompt another play through. I was also curious about killing Frederick and Lissa off during the first mission to see how the story reacts. Hope to really sink my teeth into the game this weekend. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 8, 2013 That is absolutely true! It's one of the major features that makes the game stand out, and it's hard to talk about because it spoils a few big parts of the story. It's a time travel story, the kids are coming back from a horrible dark future to save the past. With a few exceptions, the identity of the child is specific to each possible mother, but the stats and skills are derived from both parents, and they will have unique supports with those parents. (Additionally, look at a character's list of possible supports, the S-ranks indicate possible romantic partners.) The player avatar also has the unique trait of having supports available for every single story character in the game, including the offspring. (The avatar's gender determines who can be married.) Speaking of which, the player avatar also has the unique trait of being able to reclass into absolutely any class in the game that isn't character specific. (This is important: There's two kinds of seals, one for promotions and one for class changes. Any skills a character earns are retained between these shifts.) As for the killing off of non-essential characters that are closely tied into the narrative, usually how FE handles it is simply saying that they have been gravely wounded and can no longer fight, but without saying that they've actually died. I assume it's the same here, so they're probably still going to pop up in cutscenes, but will otherwise be completely gone from the party. (So no supports, no side stories, none of that.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro Creep Posted February 8, 2013 As for the killing off of non-essential characters that are closely tied into the narrative, usually how FE handles it is simply saying that they have been gravely wounded and can no longer fight, but without saying that they've actually died. I assume it's the same here, so they're probably still going to pop up in cutscenes, but will otherwise be completely gone from the party. (So no supports, no side stories, none of that.) I haven't lost any of my units yet (I'm a dirty rotten save-scummer) but I've seen screenshots of unit lists where it actually states that they're flat-out dead. That might not be the case for everyone, though, I don't know (and don't really intend to find out). This game has been a blast so far, it's exciting, intense, and just all-around fun. For my first runthrough on Hard Classic, I'm going to stay as far away from the Serene's Forest guides as I possibly can, then replay on Normal Casual to mess with the various pairings and see what comes of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bork Laser Posted February 9, 2013 I have a 32GB SD card and I think it should handle my digital release needs for quite some times. I've bought three digital retail games and I've barely scratched the available space on my card (with my ambassador titles & a handful of other eShop games. In Fire Emblem news, I think this game is really great and I'm about four hours in. I opted for the casual mode because I'm hardly able to dedicate enough time to retry battles 90 times at this point in my life. In addition, perma-death modes in games such as these tend to motivate me to drive to the nearest beach and throw my 3DS into the Atlantic Ocean. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted February 9, 2013 Is the class/speed of SD cards of importance for the 3DS, for loading times of games, or useful only for the icons in the system menu? The standard SD card in the 3DS is class 4 I believe, but it goes up to 10. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bork Laser Posted February 10, 2013 Is the class/speed of SD cards of importance for the 3DS, for loading times of games, or useful only for the icons in the system menu? The standard SD card in the 3DS is class 4 I believe, but it goes up to 10. I'm not sure; I didn't pay attention to any details about the SD card when I bought it, really. Games run perfectly smooth and I've been using the card since New Super Mario Bros. 2 released. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Roderick Posted February 10, 2013 Could you check which class it is? Should be on the card somewhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 10, 2013 I am now a fair bit further into the game and i continue to to feel very strongly about this game just being absolutely great, i think everybody should play this. I do have a few fairly niggling issues with it though. I think the streetpass/spotpass/dlc features, while initially impressive, also come across as a bit inelegant and kind of mess with the game's overall balance in a somewhat unpleasant way. (The legacy characters in particular feel just kind of thrown in.) I also miss the magic triangle from a few of the earlier games. Magic is still a big enough thing in this game that it feels like it should be in there. (It was like the weapon triangle, but for different schools of magic.) Also, ultimately, i think the design of the game exhibits a sort of half-hearted commitment to permadeath. For example, many earlier games would open up additional chapters in the story if you had lost a certain number of characters, thus presenting more opportunities to earn experience, gather supplies, and recruit additional new characters. A perfect run would actually miss out on a good deal of content, and so losing characters is easier to accept as just part of the flow of the game. This game, in contrast, cannot be designed around death opening up new avenues because of the casual mode, and instead definitely feels like it wants you to keep everybody alive. (Indeed, much of the most interesting content that can potentially comprise the back two thirds of the game largely depend on you keeping certain characters alive.) It's not exactly an explicit negative, but it is an example of how this game seems fundamentally a bit different from some of the other FE games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Astro Creep Posted February 11, 2013 The class of card is something to worry about when reading or writing large single files, not something fragmented like downloaded games and their saves. The save is the only thing being written since the game had been loaded as far as I know. I have an old class 2, a class 4, and a class 10. I've tried Crimson Shroud, a large game by eShop standards, on all three, and noticed no appreciable difference between them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
K-bohls! Posted February 11, 2013 I lost my first men in battle this afternoon. Both Virion and Gregor fell prey to being attacked at range from the other side of a wall; I guess you learn little details like that the hard way. But alas I shall continue on. Actually in the Barracks roster it says something like Virion is "retired", I assume this is the thing where they can still be part of the story but can't actually fight. It just straight up says Gregor is dead, which is a shame because I thought he was pretty decent. I am glad the game is starting to fight back, and the battle maps are finally starting to open up. I also had Sully and Stahl get married which made me feel like a total creep. It's a cool system, but really weird if you stop to think about it for a few seconds. Oh well, on to getting Kellam and Miriel to hook up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sno Posted February 15, 2013 Another spotpass update was just pushed out for the game, this one has the first of many additional story "paralogues" that will show up towards the end of the game once enabled, and they apparently have additional story characters to recruit. (There's also more legacy characters to battle and recruit, this time from Path of Radiance.) The spotpass updates, unlike the DLC chapters, are free. If you have spotpass for the game enabled, it should download automatically, otherwise i think you can still download it manually from the wireless menu on the campaign map. (The same thing you'd do to enable it if it downloaded via spotpass.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lobotomy42 Posted February 26, 2013 So, I started this game on "Hard" + "Classic" mode and, about six missions in, I'm starting to regret it. Is it a good idea to give up on trying to level all my weaklings for now and start using Frederick in missions, or will that just make Maribelle, Donnell, etc, permanently unusable? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites