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Codicier

Warhammer Total War...

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So after years with people saying " wouldn't it be great if Creative Assembly made a Warhammer Fantasy Battles game" it looks like it finally is happening, which makes me a very happy bunny.

I loved the old Shadow of the Horned Rat & Dark Omen games so the news that one of the only true AAA strategy game developers taking a shot at the mythology is pretty big for me.

All in all it seems a great deal for all parties involved, GW get their license worked on by some of the best in the business and CA get to work on something that will not constraint them in the way their historical franchises might have.

Might we see CA attempt a narrative campaign? or will they stick to their tried and tested formula of a grand strategy over map and tactical battles?

Anyone have any thoughts of which way it would be most interesting for CA to take this? or fond memories of the old WFB games?

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Total Warhammer. Add magic and hero units on top of Rome Total War. Done.

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Isn't that basically what the King Arthur games are?

As a big Total War fan and non-Warhammer fan, I don't really care that much, but I doubt their A-team will get taken off of Total war, and be very wary of any team from CA that's not their A team.

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Damn. I really don't know if this could ever live up to my expectations at this point. I'm also super wary of it for the same reason Squid Division is - TA has two other projects on the go, is now really the time to be trying to do this?

All of that said, if the development team pulls this off... it's literally a dream come true.

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Isn't that basically what the King Arthur games are?

King Arthur is terrible sadly.

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King Arthur is terrible sadly.

Honestly the only real problem I had with it (the first one, haven't played the second) is that camera controls are the opposite of what they are in Total War, though that was super annoying. The rest of the game was quite enjoyable, though I got it in the Paradox complete pack so I don't know if I would have thought it worth the money had I purchased it stand alone. That being said it wasn't as good as this will probably/hopefully be.

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Isn't that basically what the King Arthur games are?

As a big Total War fan and non-Warhammer fan, I don't really care that much, but I doubt their A-team will get taken off of Total war, and be very wary of any team from CA that's not their A team.

Beware the cautionary tale of Relic when you assume that a studio's core self owned IP's wont get put to one side when a cash cow like Warhammer rolls into town. I think there are very few people on here who didn't love both Homeworld and Company of Heroes, but when you look how many games for those franchises have been released in the same period as Relic have pumped out one Dawn of War expansion after another(not that i'm complaining hugely, I really enjoyed all the DoW games) it's easy to imagine Warhammer Total War ending up selling more than the core Total War games.

All in all this seems a perfect way for CA to make a lot more cash every time they iterate on a new Total War engine, instead of developing a engine for just one IP it now supports two (or four depending if you consider the different era Total Wars all separate IP's).

I could be utterly wrong but I can easily see the"A" team moving from Rome 2 directly to the Warhammer game & the B team staying and working on the expansions and dlc for Rome.

Also I really should bite the bullet and give the King Arthur games a go, as they are sitting on the shelf of my Steam account gathering dust currently.

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Beware the cautionary tale of Relic when you assume that a studio's core self owned IP's wont get put to one side when a cash cow like Warhammer rolls into town. I think there are very few people on here who didn't love both Homeworld and Company of Heroes, but when you look how many games for those franchises have been released in the same period as Relic have pumped out one Dawn of War expansion after another(not that i'm complaining hugely, I really enjoyed all the DoW games)

Some what of an exageration. There's been:

2004 DoW

2005 DoW Winter Assult

2006 DoW Dark Crusade

2006 CoH

2007 CoH Opposing Fronts

2009 CoH tales of Valour

2009 DoW 2

2010 DoW2 Chaos Rising

2011 DoW2 Retribution

2013 CoH2

(the 3rd DoW: expansion, Soulstorm wasn't developed by Relic). They made DoW + 2 expansions, then CoH + 2 expansions, and then did DoW2 and two expansions. Then returned to CoH2 which is due out soon.

And before that, the studio made three Homeworld games. That was quite a long time ago, and it's not like they ditched the franchise. Some things come to a natural end. And, I think a lot of the devs left Relic for Ironclade and made Sins of a Solar Empire.

I would like to see another Homeworld game. Actually,... I'd be happy with a copy of the old game. One of the few glaring omissions from gog's collection.

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@Riadsala you have a point certainly now that i look at it, idk why it doesn't feel that way to me somehow though. It's probably our current position in that cycle that makes me feel that DoW was more high profile than CoH (though not as critically beloved). It feels DoW probably outsold CoH, but ofc video game sales numbers are so shrouded in mystery that i doubt its possible to actually find out whether that just my own bias or true.

Btw am I correct in thinking that CoH shared its engine with DoW2?

Also i seem to remember persistent rumors that Homeworld 3 was in pre-production.

side note: didn't another studio make Homeworld: Cataclysm?

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This does seem like a good fit. I've always thought of the old Mindscape Warhammer games as pretty direct ancestors of the Total War series.

And hey, it's gotta be better than Mark of Chaos.

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Shadow of the Horned Rat and Dark Omen were pretty cool Mythlikes, although Shadow of the Horned Rat actually preceded Myth by a year or something.

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Shadow of the Horned Rat is a game I badly wanted to play when it came out, but was just out of my hardware range and I never got to try it. If anyone knows where to find it today...

Riadsala, I don't think your list entirely gets at what's gone on at Relic the last ten years, though. CoH got two expansions, one of which has a reputation for being kind of underwhelming. Dawn of War got two major expansions. Then Dawn of War 2, then Chaos Rising which was almost a game in itself. Then Retribution, which is this DoW 2 omnibus.

I think the feeling that Warhammer shoved Relic's other projects aside has some basis in reality. Also, where Homefront at?

But I don't have that anxiety about Total War. Truth is, I think Total War has become a gaming name on par with Warhammer. Romans and redcoats and knights are more instantly relatable than Skaven. Also, Total War's core eras could use a break.

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Also, where Homefront at?

I think you mean Homeworld. If there's anyone who has a good excuse for having Homefront on the brain right now, though, it's you. Great article, by the way!

I have enjoyed every Relic game, although the Outfit and Space Marine less so than the strategy games. So I don't have any particular worries about them. But this Creative Assembly Warhammer game could really either elevate me to new heights of joy or disappoint me greatly.

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In my head this screams "Epic" more than Warhammer Fantasy Battle. Armies of imperial guard or space marines v orks, chaos or eldar on a much grander scale than anything relic did in DoW. Of course the argument there is "relic have already done 40k" I guess.

What with the upcoming Space Hulk release looks like GW are loosening up their back catalogue again. I hope against hope they have played Firaxis's XCOM and are thinking "Mmmm. Necromunda."

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What with the upcoming Space Hulk release looks like GW are loosening up their back catalogue again. I hope against hope they have played Firaxis's XCOM and are thinking "Mmmm. Necromunda."

In my ideal world Firaxis will have looked at how Relic and CA have took GW's existing successful IP's that fit well with their engines, and thought just that. Honestly it's a near perfect fit.

It's much harder to get excited about Space Hulk actually being developed by a relatively unknown studio, than it is to fantasise about a dream combo (even if that combo is unlikely to actually happen).

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Have been thinking about this.... I hope CA takes some lessons from Relic's approach (actually, the same approach as GW too). Don't try and put everything in the base game. Even if you ignore the strategic map, there's still a LOT of content to create if you want full fleshed out armies of all the main races. There's a lot more variety than in their historical games (in terms of needing more 3d models and animations: demons, dragons, and all the other monsters ). Plus you need a magic system that feels right and looks the part.

Something like Dawn of War 1's approach... start with a fixed series of battles and some core races (Empire, orcs, elves, dwarves, skaven perhaps. I have a soft spot for Bretonnia too). something more like the old WFB games... sure, while it would be a "smaller" game than previous Total Wars, it would still be pretty epic). Then once you have a solid base, add in a big chaos expansion for all four chaos factions. Then you can think about adding in lizardmen and the other continent and some sort of strategic layer.

The danger of course is that they try and build it all round charging for poxy DLC a bit too much. Relic (until recently) had a pretty good balance.

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I know it's not going to happen for all sorts of reasons, but as an ex-warhammer player I'd love a rule-by-rule or at least a close, turn-based adaptation.

If not that, there are certain mechanics that would be interesting to take from the wargame. For example, I remember the two players deciding where to place the scenery pieces, each one deciding where to place certain pieces like hills, walls, etc and different scenarios allowing special rules on what and where to place stuff. It was something that allowed your army to play to your strenghts and felt more interesting than the standard maps we are used to in computer games.

Terrain is generally very dull in games like TW. I feel that especially when I'm supposed to make strategic decisions on the world map and I have no idea how that's gonna reflect on the actual battle map.

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