Neal Stephenson's CLANG

[brkl]

No, this is in the correct subforum.

Neal Stephenson is making a game about swordfighting. He's kickstarted it, and this whole thing is nuts.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/260688528/clang?ref=live

[Twig]

This is possibly the best Kickstarter promo video I've ever seen.

[Roderick]

Was that Gabe Newell hammering the wrench? Holy shittttttt.

It's a great comedy skit on its own. Kickstarter is turning into a comedy channel comparable to Funny or Die or College Humor. Still, this looks cool. It reminds me of the design goals of Die By The Sword.

I'm not sure exactly what the product is going to be though. I understand it's an arena game about two-handers, but will there be a sword peripheral to control it with? Neil spends some time explaining that you shouldn't control a sword game with a controller, but developing a whole new controller seems like an expensive and difficult thing way beyond the half million Kickstarter goal.

I don't want to shoot holes in this thing, I think it's cool and interesting. But there are some questions.

[Orv]

"Low-latency, high-precision motion controller:

Critical to a satisfying sword fight is fast, accurate response. This is especially important for CLANG given the depth and complexity of moves that are used in real sword arts. Initially, CLANG will make use of a commercial, third-party, off-the-shelf controller that anyone can but today."

As for the initial game, think Jedi Knight duel mode. Bunch of people sit around and chat and hang out while two people go at it. Winner fights next in line.

[brkl]

It's the Razer Hydra controller (probably), it's mentioned in the FAQ.

[Roderick]

OK.

[Twig]

Yeah that was Gabe.

Also as always when people bring up motion-controlled sword-fighting I'm doubtful of its FUNNESS because there's no way to administer a proper tactile response to swords actually CLANGing against one another. The game may express the CLANGiness to its heart's content, but I don't feel the CLANGiness. My arms continue a-swingin'.

this is generally fine in a video game context, such as in the case of Skyward Sword, because it is a video game. But when it is your entire reason for making the game, when it is the crutch of your concept, it becomes vastly more important to employ realism in the real world as well as the graphical representation displayed on screen. There is a certain disconnect that occurs, not just from the previously-mentioned arms-keep-swinging problem, but also in the resulting on-screen movements. How does the game react to this? Will the sword on-screen suddenly have to snap to the appropriate orientation? What if that orientation is inside a wall (or, perhaps worse, the enemy)? Etc.

EHHHHHHHHHHH.

[mikemariano]

Also as always when people bring up motion-controlled sword-fighting I'm doubtful of its FUNNESS because there's no way to administer a proper tactile response to swords actually CLANGing against one another. The game may express the CLANGiness to its heart's content, but I don't feel the CLANGiness. My arms continue a-swingin'.

[Salacious Snake]

My arms continue a-swingin'.

That was the first thing that popped into my mind, too.

Even without solving issues like that, playing Die by the Sword with a Hydra sounds fun, so I may be on board anyway. Furthermore, the control side is only one part of what they hope to address.

This discussion makes me want to dust off the Novint Falcon, except not.

[ysbreker]

Was that Gabe Newell hammering the wrench? Holy shittttttt.

Yes it was. But it was a crowbar he was hammering on. Not a wrench. Which makes the "These things take time" line all the more awesome.

[TheLastBaron]

That was the first thing that popped into my mind, too.

Even without solving issues like that, playing Die by the Sword with a Hydra sounds fun, so I may be on board anyway. Furthermore, the control side is only one part of what they hope to address.

This discussion makes me want to dust off the Novint Falcon, except not.

I was going to say something about the Falcon, except it seems like it wouldn't be a good fit for a sword game. Maybe if you taped two of them together.

[vogon]

Also as always when people bring up motion-controlled sword-fighting I'm doubtful of its FUNNESS because there's no way to administer a proper tactile response to swords actually CLANGing against one another. The game may express the CLANGiness to its heart's content, but I don't feel the CLANGiness. My arms continue a-swingin'.

you could probably do something with a flywheel or gyroscope that throws itself off balance when the virtual sword is hit, but I'm not sure that's physically feasible to do in something that's designed to be a game controller you use in a living room.

[Roderick]

Yes it was. But it was a crowbar he was hammering on. Not a wrench. Which makes the "These things take time" line all the more awesome.

I mean to say crowbar, I mean, it's obvious, but my mind blarged.

[Forbin]

I appreciate the honest outlook on the quality of the game. I'm not sure people will be that interested in their middlewear, but I hope they're successful.

[Nachimir]

you could probably do something with a flywheel or gyroscope that throws itself off balance when the virtual sword is hit, but I'm not sure that's physically feasible to do in something that's designed to be a game controller you use in a living room.

I think that might be doable, but would probably require a very large battery. Either that, or the user has to spin it up like a powerball between swings. An easier but just as clunky way to create inertia would be to stack weights on the top of the controller, like a dumb bell.

Maybe all such realism would just be a hugely technical and non-rewarding drag though. A lighter controller lets a player take the part of a much stronger and faster character.

[brkl]

You can still limit the characters strength and speed. When the player moves the controller, that's the position the character will try to move his hand to, as fast as the character can. If something gets in the way, he won't be able to go all the way. At that point the character is probably in a vulnerable position and the player should react. There's no problem as such if the controller is able to track movement well enough to maintain "absolute" position.