Jump to content
Roderick

Feminism

Recommended Posts

Which ultimately just polarizes everything and harms the feminist cause. 

 

I'm sure the feminist cause is very touched by your concern, and appreciates the advice. As, I imagine, it did when it got the same advice about Anita Sarkeesian, Jennifer Hepler, Adria Richards...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

EDIT: And yeah, what tegan said. What harms the feminist cause is the failure to oppose misogynist terror tactics wherever they occur, not the failure to foster a perfectly open dialogue at all times. First, put out the burning house, then decide whether it was in danger of spreading.

 

I was literally in the middle of typing something along the lines of "it's like worrying you left the stove on while your house is on fire" when I saw your post go up and you basically said everything I was going to.  One of these days I'm going to say a smart thing before you can beat me to it Gormongous.  Assuming I ever say anything smart.

 

My pointless whining aside, I agree with Gormongous and Tegan and probably others I didn't fully read.

 

In actual contributions, here's yet another article talking about it.  In particular I want to highlight this part because it's something I said earlier in this thread

 

If it had been a man at the centre of the controversy, the attacks would never have happened. If a woman posted a rant as psychotic as Quinn’s ex did, she’d be lynched as a “crazy bitch” by the very same people currently holding up a blog post as incontrovertible proof of Quinn’s “guilt”, and the man in question would be Internet high-fived for getting some. The original accusations were 0% about “exposing corruption in the gaming industry” and 100% about emotional revenge - and the subsequent attacks about hatred, pure and simple.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't seen a single thing that Zoe Quinn did that ACTUALLY breaches journalistic ethics (OR WHATEVER) in any material way. Her own personal life is her own personal business. That's it. All the allegations I've seen people make about betraying the public trust or whatever have been utterly without merit. None of it holds any water as far as I can tell. It's infuriating to keep seeing people raise this vague specter of "Well, let's not let the harassers or misogynists distract us from the shitty things she actually did in reality" because all of the "shitty things" people keep talking about are either 1) fabricated, 2) largely or entirely speculative, or 3) not actually relevant to anyone except to her and the people directly involved.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

DJApmG5.jpg

As an aside, I was unaware of the FYC until this whole thing, but that these have quickly become the public faces of the 'reasonable gamer' push-back against the corrupting SJW influence is just ... I lack the words to describe how incredibly perfect it is. Sometimes caricatures are real, folks.

Just to give people a taste, and maybe lighten the mood here a bit :). Just watch it for ten seconds, starting from where I've linked (NSFL - one F-bomb) http://youtu.be/5Ub8n1H6tYk?t=3h50m57s

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That Jordan dude was also thinking about putting the Beat Up Anita Sarkeesian game into the DVD release of their dumb "documentary" Patreon thing. In earnest. And then the negative response got him to turn that around - http://www.patreon.com/creation?hid=856632

 

Man. I just... ugh. So dumb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

DJApmG5.jpg

As an aside, I was unaware of the FYC until this whole thing, but that these have quickly become the public faces of the 'reasonable gamer' push-back against the corrupting SJW influence is just ... I lack the words to describe how incredibly perfect it is. Sometimes caricatures are real, folks.

Those guys are running some crowd-funding campaign for something called The Sarkeesian Effect, about how she's a scam artist and ruining gaming or some bullshit.

 

I call them Butt Chin and Baldy, respectively. I'm a child. Sue me.

 

Baldy has a rather incredible website. He's apparently a very successful and intelligent man who also unfortunately happens to be a massive piece of shit. He's also a massive piece of shit who also unfortunately happens to be very successful and intelligent. Anyway, his website... It's an excellent target for vitriolic mockery, should you be so inclined. I don't really want to like give him publicity, but basically he spends many hours drinking whisky and smoking cigarettes while pontificating the many ways in which the world is bringing down the white man.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I almost can't believe this Sarkeesian Effect thing is real.  The Q & A section on their page reads like an Onion article, replete with "why do I agree with you" type questions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'm really enjoying Tim Schafer's responses to people getting mad at him for tweeting about the latest Feminist Frequency video. He's basically just calling them out for their idiocy. This is the kind of thing I've long dreamed of. I hope other high-profile male developers get in on this action. Someone like Cliffy B, maybe. Although I know he's said some... questionable stuff before, but man. Can you imagine the backlash if he openly supported Feminist Frequency? Or fucking Gabe Newell? We get enough dudes in the press doing it already, and it's clear that the anti-feminism crowd think the press are fighting against the developers for whatever stupid reason. It's time for developers to prove them wrong. C'moooooon please.

Cliffy B actually talked about it a year and change ago back around when the Kickstarter happened.  (He and Tim Schafer had a short twitter convo about it around when I was checking out Tim's twitter feed to see what exactly was going on.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well then he should do it again!

 

I actually remember that now that I'm reading it again. Thanks for reminding me!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's hilarious that there's this whole thing going on between Tim Schafer and JonTron on twitter right now. Bogleech summarized my feelings on it quite nicely.

 

So when can we stop elevating people to celebrity status for playing video games? Everyone plays video games. We’re putting content consumers on the same level as content creators and it’s sad. Especially when a beloved content creator with decades of experience expresses concerns over sexism and just gets called an “ignorant dumbass” by fanboys blindly siding with another mere fanboy who has no actual inside knowledge of the industry or any other credentials other than liking games a lot and filming it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People are tweeting #IStandWithJonTron to show support for him. Also to mock him. I'm using the hashtag for the latter! Yayaya hashtags ^__^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think that's necessarily a fair description of what youtube games personalities do, but this is probably not the thread to talk about it. There are a lot of people whose charisma, humor, and showmanship make them entertainers in their own right, though, even if they medium through which they choose to express it is playing games for the internet to watch. It doesn't make me comfortable to say that game devs make content and they don't.

I mean, playing games and talking about them is basically what Idle Thumbs is. I think it's tremendously dismissive to say that it's inherently less worthwhile than any actual game creation.

Crap, I said this wasn't the thread to talk about it then talked about it. I suck :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People are tweeting #IStandWithJonTron to show support for him. Also to mock him. I'm using the hashtag for the latter! Yayaya hashtags ^__^

 

Same, let's see if this will ire those pesky man babies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Turns out 4Chan doesn't even need to create a sexualized, tasteless character for TFYC, their followers will still abuse her nonetheless (this was unwarranted, in response to a mocking #IStandWithJonTron tweet of mine) -

 

vVEFAvU.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I see that hashtag, I just want to add #IStandWithJonTronInTheI/OTower #GetTheMessageOut

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This reply from JonTron made me laugh out loud:

 

@TimOfLegend Also that's very classy of you to mob your entire fanbase on me because I have an opinion. Stay classy, Tim.

 

Does he not see the irony? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'm really enjoying Tim Schafer's responses to people getting mad at him for tweeting about the latest Feminist Frequency video. He's basically just calling them out for their idiocy. This is the kind of thing I've long dreamed of. I hope other high-profile male developers get in on this action. Someone like Cliffy B, maybe. Although I know he's said some... questionable stuff before, but man. Can you imagine the backlash if he openly supported Feminist Frequency? Or fucking Gabe Newell? We get enough dudes in the press doing it already, and it's clear that the anti-feminism crowd think the press are fighting against the developers for whatever stupid reason. It's time for developers to prove them wrong. C'moooooon please.

It's not gaming but Joss Whedon will surely do right? :D This is so satisfying, watching nerds heads explode at the audacity of someone to not hate women

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not gaming but Joss Whedon will surely do right? :D This is so satisfying, watching nerds heads explode at the audacity of someone to not hate women

Reading his latest tweets put a giant grin on my face.

 

(Also, I totally have to start posting in this forum more. The community here is amazing!)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People have legitimate (From my view, of course. Few here share it.) reasons to be, not vitriolic, but suspicious and critical of Zoey Quinn, and of course that doesn't means she deserves abuse, but she does deserve public scrutiny for her actions. 

 

Yeah, but does she? Because a lot of that 'scrutiny' is in the service of misogyny disguised as reasonable-sounding rhetoric (because part of the problem with sexism is that we think it's reasonable), and there's plenty of relatively normal behaviours that can be twisted when presented in the context of someone being a master manipulator - for instance, putting on a game jam while also being critical of another game jam.

 

I would be very, very careful about any accusations that come up about Zoe in the future, because you cannot be sure that misogyny or character assassination is not a motivating factor.

 

On a lighter note, here's Seanbaby, showing both sides of the Sexism in Games issue:

 

BwBs8b5CYAAvR5T.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is related to those charming gentlemen who run the Sarkeesian Effect patreon. Yesterday, I had a lengthy twitter conversation with a guy, who was searching for mentions of Sarkeesian Effect, defending the two men responsible for the patreon as the only truth. They were, supposedly, the one true voice in the chaos telling of how big of a fraud Anita Sarkeesian was, scamming people out of their money.  Nearing the end of this conversation I posted my irrefutable evidence of who these Sarkeesian Effect guys really were.

 

9UliSXw.jpg

 

I love that he almost seems to take me seriously.

 

On Zoe Quinn's game jam 'sabotage', that 'evidence' has multiple tweets just repeated over and over. What a joke. Is that really all you have to support this alleged 'sabotage'??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I remember seeing that tweet just under a friend of mine reporting they were going to watch Muppet Treasure Island, so there was some weird synchronicity there.

 

Edit: I'm in my Data Mining class, and we're being asked to consider a data mining project. I'm sorely tempted to build a classifier that can determine whether or not someone's a misogynistic troll. (It's down to that, or trying to work out whether a sentence in a review is positive or negative.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×