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Dishonored - or - GIFs By Breckon

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just had a fun bug on the party level, everyone i bumped into fell over and died, that made the party a little awkward.

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I just tried doing a sneaky run of the party. It was all going okay until tried to blink to behind an unaware guard, and he somehow flew over a railing and broke his neck on the floor of the foyer below. I tried to stay non-lethal after that but it really didn't work out

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I noticed today that when you blink through someone, they go like «uurgh.» Also, I noticed that I've now completed three missions, and haven't had any problems with getting inadvertent kills registered or anything like that.

From what I gather my non-killing achievement will be somewhat hampered by affiliating with these two characters (

Granny Rags and Slackjaw

), and I'll have to do some crazy sequence of sleep-darting, running and closing doors at one point to avoid triggering something that registers as a kill. I haven't read up on the details to avoid spoilers, but if anyone knows what I'm talking about, could you please tell me if I need to prepare for this in some way? Will it be clear when I have to do this "trick"?

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Damn this game is good. At first, I was completely put off by the art style and the setting as well as the erroneous comparisons to Bioshock (which I didn't enjoy). I'm still not a huge fan of the plot and the setting but the gameplay is absolutely superb. The game looks much better than I thought as well.

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Man, how do you not like that art style and setting? The story isn't much, and the world isn't really credible, but damn it looks and feels terrific. I love the faces. My Shephard could be in this game:

post-6685-0-90268000-1351776361_thumb.jpg

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The world of Dishonored with its whale oil powered tesla coils, zombies and magic seems like a not particularly well thought out mess to me. I'm actually getting used to the the art style (my initial impression was based on the trailers and gameplay videos) and the graphics are acceptable on PC. The cartoon faces are super weird, though, but I think I might be getting used to them as well.

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They're not that weird to me. Playing video games and looking at movies just makes you expect everybody to look like dolls. I've seen people who looked weirder than many of the characters in this game.

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The world of Dishonored with its whale oil powered tesla coils, zombies and magic seems like a not particularly well thought out mess to me.

I don't know how on earth you can think that stuff isn't well thought out. Sure there's a lot of weirdness in there, but that's kind of the point. They're building an entirely new world. Especially when you read the books in the world, how can you say that's not well thought out? They thought it out hardcore.

I wonder if people had the same reaction to the hodgepodge that is Lord of the Rings back in the day?

I'm only ragging because Penny-Arcade said the same thing. "Pastiche." Pastiche of what, a bunch of crazy shit they came up with? Not pastiche.

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did the 'outsider' have any motivation to help you and give you special powers, or was it all just for shits and giggles to see what you would do

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I don't know how on earth you can think that stuff isn't well thought out. Sure there's a lot of weirdness in there, but that's kind of the point. They're building an entirely new world. Especially when you read the books in the world, how can you say that's not well thought out? They thought it out hardcore.

It's little things such as things requiring electricity only running on whale oil. Why just whale oil? To me, it seems like someone at some point just thought that it would be rad if whale oil was the main source of energy in this world, you know, because Moby Dick is cool (or something). The fact that there seems to be a serious shortage of the stuff (if I remember the announcements correctly), yet no one has come up with viable alternatives, suggests to me that the history of the world of Dishonored is not fully thought out.

Even weirder* is the way in which the whale oil is converted to electricity. It seems to involve, well, nothing at all. It just happens. The developers of Dishonored didn't craft a completely new world; it is very much rooted in ours. At least there is no indication that the physics of that world are fundamentally different from ours (apart from magic). That is why it seems super weird to me that they give such alien properties to such a common substance. I don't remember if Lord of the Rings fundamentally changed the properties of one particular material or object that is common between our world and the Middle-Earth, but at least I didn't find the world as confusing and fragmented as that of Dishonored. There were magical swords and trinkets, of course, but it was never claimed that this was caused by trace amounts of Tungsten in the blade. In fact, I would probably be more comfortable with Dishonored, if the machinery ran on some magical substance and not on refined whale oil.

Perhaps "well thought out" was not the best way to put it. For all I know, the developers might have spent years crafting the world. Unfortunately, it just feels somehow broken to me. In any case, this isn't a huge issue for me and, like I said, I'm enjoying the game immensely. However, I don't think I would find a book set in the world of Dishonored very convincing.

*To be honest, some (or most) of this confusion might be a result of me not being arsed to read every book excerpt that I find. If there is some logical explanation for all this stuff, I would definitely like to hear it, although I think it shouldn't be necessary to read those things in order to feel that the world isn't fake.

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Hmm, I guess the whale oil thing didn't throw me because I encountered it first as a game system instead of a fictional resource. My suspension of disbelief wasn't broken by a lack of explanation though.

It also didn't seem weird in the context of stuff like the outsider. I just assume "there is magic." "shit is weird."

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It's little things such as things requiring electricity only running on whale oil. Why just whale oil? To me, it seems like someone at some point just thought that it would be rad if whale oil was the main source of energy in this world, you know, because Moby Dick is cool (or something). The fact that there seems to be a serious shortage of the stuff (if I remember the announcements correctly), yet no one has come up with viable alternatives, suggests to me that the history of the world of Dishonored is not fully thought out.

I don't understand. Are you saying every time there is a shortage of something, people will come up with a replacement, and that because this hasn't happened in Dishonored, it's a badly thought out world? Haven't we seen shortages of all sorts of things all throughout history for all sorts of reasons?

Even weirder* is the way in which the whale oil is converted to electricity. It seems to involve, well, nothing at all. It just happens. The developers of Dishonored didn't craft a completely new world; it is very much rooted in ours. At least there is no indication that the physics of that world are fundamentally different from ours (apart from magic).

"Dishonored works exactly like our world except where it doesn't, so therefore I don't understand how part of Dishonored works differently from our world." That's a very confusing sentiment to me.

That is why it seems super weird to me that they give such alien properties to such a common substance. I don't remember if Lord of the Rings fundamentally changed the properties of one particular material or object that is common between our world and the Middle-Earth, but at least I didn't find the world as confusing and fragmented as that of Dishonored. There were magical swords and trinkets, of course, but it was never claimed that this was caused by trace amounts of Tungsten in the blade. In fact, I would probably be more comfortable with Dishonored, if the machinery ran on some magical substance and not on refined whale oil.

I think your mistake is calling whale oil "a common substance." It's fairly obviously not common. It can be turned into electricity with almost no effort. It explodes when jostled. Bone charms made from whale bones have magical properties. The whales themselves are hinted to be supernatural beings in some sense (use the Heart in various places). Lord of the Rings has magical racist swords that glow blue when orcs are around. What are those made out of? Magictanium? What is mithril armor made out of such that it works the way it works in Lord of the Rings?

I mean, if the universe doesn't make sense to you, then it doesn't make sense to you, but I can't possibly fathom why someone would find Dishonored more or less plausible than any well crafted fantasy world. A lot is left unspecified and unsaid, but there are hints to almost all the big mysteries and it strikes me as much more internally coherent, consistent, and interesting than most fantasy worlds we see crafted for video games.

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It's little things such as things requiring electricity only running on whale oil. Why just whale oil? To me, it seems like someone at some point just thought that it would be rad if whale oil was the main source of energy in this world, you know, because Moby Dick is cool (or something). The fact that there seems to be a serious shortage of the stuff (if I remember the announcements correctly), yet no one has come up with viable alternatives, suggests to me that the history of the world of Dishonored is not fully thought out.

You realize that you literally just described a thing that is happening in the real world now, right? Just remove every reference to whales from your post. It's not exactly the most subtle or nuanced use of allegory I've seen, even by video game standards, but it makes perfect sense.

The society depicted in Dishonored let their greed get the best of them and shortsightedly invested everything they had into a limited resource for its short term benefits without stopping to consider the long term consequences, and you can see the unfortunate results of that decision everywhere as you play.

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I don't understand. Are you saying every time there is a shortage of something, people will come up with a replacement, and that because this hasn't happened in Dishonored, it's a badly thought out world? Haven't we seen shortages of all sorts of things all throughout history for all sorts of reasons?

You realize that you literally just described a thing that is happening in the real world now, right? Just remove every reference to whales from your post. It's not exactly the most subtle or nuanced use of allegory I've seen, even by video game standards, but it makes perfect sense.

Am I aware that there are various shortages in the world? Of course I am, I'm not completely ignorant. Are there other oils that have similar properties than (our) whale oil? Definitely. Have they tried to use those instead? Perhaps not; Perhaps they have, and have failed. Maybe (their) whale oil is unique among oils? Maybe. In any case, it is not the only way to generate electricity.

Even though most of the electricity is (strangely) used to power up arc pylons and light walls, electric motors have clearly been invented. I can only assume they are of the traditional coil and magnets variety. Strangely they don't seem to have invented an electric generator which is very similar in structure. If they had, they would have loads of alternatives to whale oil (even if whale oil was magical and unlike any other oil in the world). This sort of development, or lack thereof, seems very bizarre to me.

I appreciate the effort to depict a shortsighted society with various shortages - the developers did a very good job at that for the most parts. However, I can't help but feel that the shortage of whale oil is more akin to a shortage of apples and not of food.

Anyway, fine, whatever, so everything is running on whaleoil. I can deal with it.

"Dishonored works exactly like our world except where it doesn't, so therefore I don't understand how part of Dishonored works differently from our world." That's a very confusing sentiment to me.

I think your mistake is calling whale oil "a common substance." It's fairly obviously not common. It can be turned into electricity with almost no effort. It explodes when jostled. Bone charms made from whale bones have magical properties. The whales themselves are hinted to be supernatural beings in some sense (use the Heart in various places). Lord of the Rings has magical racist swords that glow blue when orcs are around. What are those made out of? Magictanium? What is mithril armor made out of such that it works the way it works in Lord of the Rings?

Whale oil is common between this world and that of Dishonored. It is not a mythical substance in this world and at one point was commonly used as a material for candles and other stuff. To my knowledge it cannot be turned into electricity with almost no effort. Like I said, I have no problem with trinkets and pieces of equipment having alien properties in, for example, Lord of the Rings simply because it is not suggested that these properties originate from Tungsten or something. Mithril does not exist in our world so it is easy, for me at least, to accept that it gives the armor magical powers. I guess I just have to deal with the fact that whales in Dishonored are magical magical mammals, and their oil* has qualities completely unlike the whale oil of this world. This sort of weirdness just alienates me from the setting a bit.

I mean, if the universe doesn't make sense to you, then it doesn't make sense to you, but I can't possibly fathom why someone would find Dishonored more or less plausible than any well crafted fantasy world. A lot is left unspecified and unsaid, but there are hints to almost all the big mysteries and it strikes me as much more internally coherent, consistent, and interesting than most fantasy worlds we see crafted for video games.

To be honest, I have not played many fantasy/scifi games. For all I know, the world of Dishonored might be much better crafted than most of those. I don't remember being nearly as weirded out by the world of, say, the Witcher 2, though. Maybe it is because so much of that world was different from ours, and not just a couple of very specific things.

Anyway, this is not nearly as big a problem for me as the size of these post may suggest. Obviously many people find the world of Dishonored to be consistent and well crafted, while I find some of the design decisions somewhat alienating. Furthermore, it seems I'm not very good at articulating why I find the setting so inconsistent, but the feeling is definitely there.

Like I said, it hasn't spoiled my enjoyment of the game by any means. Dishonored may yet prove to be my game of the year.

* Interestingly, I didn't have problems in accepting bone charms, as they immediately fell into the magical trinkets and talismans crafted by wizards category in my mind.

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For some reason I think of the whales in Dishonored as being the kind of monsters that were drawn on old maps. Obviously it's not the stuff from Moby Dick, because that stuff didn't glow or explode.

EDIT: And in Moby Dick they don't drag the whales to a harbour and start cutting them up while they are alive. That's only mentioned in a book, though.

Also, the shortage is a new thing that only came about after pretty much the collapse of society. All their equipment is rigged to use whale oil and there's no-one around to replace that infrastructure with something else. Obviously there's still enough whale oil for the administration, those canisters are everywhere. So for all we know, the other countries mentioned briefly in the game have other sources of electricity, but Dunwall is a producer of whale oil, so it's been the cheapest form.

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Whale oil is common between this world and that of Dishonored. It is not a mythical substance in this world and at one point was commonly used as a material for candles and other stuff. To my knowledge it cannot be turned into electricity with almost no effort. Like I said, I have no problem with trinkets and pieces of equipment having alien properties in, for example, Lord of the Rings simply because it is not suggested that these properties originate from Tungsten or something. Mithril does not exist in our world so it is easy, for me at least, to accept that it gives the armor magical powers. I guess I just have to deal with the fact that whales in Dishonored are magical magical mammals, and their oil* has qualities completely unlike the whale oil of this world. This sort of weirdness just alienates me from the setting a bit.

That's part of the crux of the fiction. In Dishonoredland, it CAN be turned into relatively easy fuel for electricity. That's like saying Spice in Dune can't possibly be the most precious commodity in the galaxy because paprika is so cheap here. I'll let you in on a secret: Piero is a fucked up dude and thinks he can get the same energetic properties as whale oil in much larger quantities if you coax it out of people the right way.

Corvo can bend space and time and if he runs out of the stamina to do so he can drink magic juice.

Whale oil isn't mostly used to power light walls, that's just how the player interacts with it most. There are cars, and boats, and even the crappy parts of town have electric lighting. You know what's really weird? Attuning your body signature before going on shift so you can walk through a wall of light and not evaporate.

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That's part of the crux of the fiction. In Dishonoredland, it CAN be turned into relatively easy fuel for electricity. That's like saying Spice in Dune can't possibly be the most precious commodity in the galaxy because paprika is so cheap here.

I have not read/watched Dune but is Spice really supposed to be the same object as paprika in our world? Because if it isn't, I think you are still missing the point I was trying to make with all the whale oil vs whale oil and Tungsten vs Mithril comparisons earlier. I'm aware that whale oil is a direct source of electricity in Dishonored, I'm just saying that I find this design choice surprisingly alienating. I am also completely aware that there is magic in the world of Dishonored - I'm more than halfway through the game already - so there is really no need to list all the occurrences.

Anyway, I feel like this discussion is going nowhere, and I'm kind of sorry that I even brought it up. I think I'm backing away now.

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I don't get why Spice in Dune can be something other than regular spice, but whale oil in Dishonored has to be regular whale oil. Its presentation in the game makes it clear it's not the same substance.

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To be fair, I would probably have the same kind of problems if the Spice (whatever it is) in Dune was not "Spice" but "paprika". Now I can at least think that it is some spice that is unknown to us.

I guess a big part of the problem is the fact that it was not immediately clear to me that whale oil in Dishonored is actually magical whale oil, because of, you know, video games. In the same way, I don't assume that glowing wrench in a video game is a magical wrench, or that a highly explosive fuel tanks are fundamentally different from real world fuel tanks (which tend not to explode very easily), or that a machine that wouldn't work in real life would have some weird physics behind it when the easier explanation is that the designers cut corners a bit. And so on...

I would like to read a book on the history of science and technology of Dishonored, though. I still find the range of things that have and have not been invented quite incredible.

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I'm torn in my opinion of the setting. I'm pretty fatigued by alternate versions of industrialization. I'm beyond sick of zombies, and elaborate, foppish clothing can go back into game artist portfolios forever as far as I'm concerned.

I would be way more turned on if Dishonored took place in 19th century France.

On the other hand, the art direction in the game is great, and the weird hybridization of old shit and future shit actually looks cool in this case, unlike all the "steampunk" garbage that's eroded my soul over the past few years.

If someone had described the style of Dunwall to me without letting me see it, I'd have rolled my eyes and dismissed it out of hand, but, you know, it turned out pretty cool, at least visually.

And of course, they get to pick and choose based on desired gameplay elements. They want reprogrammable forcefields that can vaporize people, but no security cameras or telephones? OK, it's a made up setting so they can do whatever the hell they want. It's not very compelling, but it works.

The magic also is clearly there for gameplay reasons, so, you know, there we are. I don't think the Outsider works at all in a narrative sense, but if they feel the need to have some external justification for my ability to teleport around and possess rats, then I'm not going to protest too much. I like teleporting around and possessing rats.

I guess what I'm saying is that Dishonored may be full of questionable elements, but it's in service of making the game work a certain way, and I like the way it works (and the way it looks). I sure as shit wouldn't read a novel set in Dunwall!

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I guess what I'm saying is that Dishonored may be full of questionable elements, but it's in service of making the game work a certain way, and I like the way it works (and the way it looks). I sure as shit wouldn't read a novel set in Dunwall!

So you're saying in a book setting is more important to you than execution?

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So you're saying in a book setting is more important to you than execution?

I'm saying that the setting would sabotage the execution in this case. Whatever poor soul was contracted to write Worlds of Power: Dishonored would have to waste effort writing around gameplay conceits. A Dunwall-esque setting invented specifically for a novel would be approached differently.

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To be fair, I would probably have the same kind of problems if the Spice (whatever it is) in Dune was not "Spice" but "paprika". Now I can at least think that it is some spice that is unknown to us.

I guess a big part of the problem is the fact that it was not immediately clear to me that whale oil in Dishonored is actually magical whale oil, because of, you know, video games. In the same way, I don't assume that glowing wrench in a video game is a magical wrench, or that a highly explosive fuel tanks are fundamentally different from real world fuel tanks (which tend not to explode very easily), or that a machine that wouldn't work in real life would have some weird physics behind it when the easier explanation is that the designers cut corners a bit. And so on...

I would like to read a book on the history of science and technology of Dishonored, though. I still find the range of things that have and have not been invented quite incredible.

Here's how you can tell that "whale oil" is to whale oil in the real world like "spice" in Dune is to spice in the real world.

1. Whale oil in the real world comes from actual real world whales that have no supernatural properties. Whales in Dishonored are not real world whales. They look different[/url, they have fins that are anatomically impossible for actual whales, they have supernatural powers (charms made out of their bones can do crazy things), the Heart hints that there is something special about them, etc. None of this is true about real world whales. The whales in Dishonored are different from the whales in real life, and so are their respective oils.

2. Whale oil in the real world does not glow in the dark. Dishonored whale oil does. They are thus different things.

3. Whale oil in real life does not explode when jostled. Dishonored whale oil does, at least once you've refined it. They are thus different things.

4. Whale oil in real life can't be plugged into a socket and turned into electricity. Dishonored whale oil can. They are thus different things.

I can't even believe I'm typing this sort of stuff because it seems patently obvious to me that Dishonored is set in a world where whale oil is completely different from what we call whale oil in our world, and I can't even imagine why you would want to criticize it for giving properties to whale oil that it doesn't have in real life, but here we are. It just seems like such a weird beef to have with the game.

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One of my favorite things about this game is eating everything in sight. I love going into someone's kitchen and just munching everything down. I even like the sound effect.

Crunch crunch crunch, now your pantry is empty, Lord Whatsisface. I wasn't even hungry.

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