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Sony Shitshow

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I think a lot of you are forgetting that the Geohotz situation goes beyond Sony going after him and instead getting the information of anyone who was logged viewing his site or videos. How is that information relevant? It's not illegal to view information on how to hack the PS3 in the first place, so why did the judge award Sony such information? Not one of those IP addresses and the information that goes along with them can be proven that they went and certainly installed custom software/firmware on the PS3.

If everyone is spitting out analogies, then also car manufacturers don't have the right to the information of everyone who has looked up how to modify their car.

I think many are going to disagree on the right to do whatever you want with a piece of hardware once you own it. I stand on the side of the fence that breaking the EULA is all okay, you just forfeit your warranty and I feel that the law show be changed so that EULA don't extend beyond that. I think it's a step upon consumer freedom to tell someone how they can or cannot use something they have already completely purchased, whether it's a computer or using the Hello Kitty massager as a sex toy.

That said I don't think it's any companies right to track down personal information of those that may or may not be using the system the way they intended. It's kind of like that old joke where the police come after you for removing the tag from the mattress if we are going to keep with the analogies.

Edited by syntheticgerbil

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Well said, that pretty much sums up my thoughts on the subject that I was too lazy to wordify.

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Totally agree, although I do have to take issue with one thing.

using the Hello Kitty massager as a sex toy.

:barf:

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I stand on the side of the fence that breaking the EULA is all okay, you just forfeit your warranty and I feel that the law show be changed so that EULA don't extend beyond that.

I agree. I'm pretty sure I break EULAs all the damn time. I know you were being a lot more specific than this, but something should be done about holding people to these massive documents that no company actually believes its consumers are reading.

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Something good has become of this thread: At least we now know brkl will not get prostrate cancer.

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Sony found a goat of the scape type and they have called it Anonymous.

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And what on Earth do the hackers intend to accomplish with that if it's even true? Sony's image is in ruins as it is and I'm pretty sure many of the insane fanboys are starting to hate Sony now (although that's because they want PSN back).

Last time I heard, Sony admitted that they didn't have a firewall and was using outdated software, which might not be true, but I'm sure many of us here would believe it immediately, which just goes to show how bad Sony's image is now.

Wouldn't this just make users hate the hackers? For all we know the hackers might have done it for a laugh, but if they do this, they'll just break Wheaton's Law. Seriously, how can anybody be on their side if they did this? "HA, HA! They published my credit card info on Sony's site? YES! That I'll teach Sony! Now let me go find a cardboard box to live in, because I'm ruined! But yeah, #$%@ Sony! Those hackers are awesome!":tup:

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Has everybody else received an email from Sony already? Cause I haven't. I mean, how long can it take to send 100 million emails?

Last time I heard, Sony admitted that they didn't have a firewall and was using outdated software, which might not be true, but I'm sure many of us here would believe it immediately, which just goes to show how bad Sony's image is now.

Wait, Sony admitted not having a firewall and using outdated software? Then why on earth wouldn't we believe that to be true no matter how good or bad Sony's image is? It's not like companies lie about these things just to make themselves look even worse.

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According to this site, at least, but it looks like they "Fox Newsed" it a bit, because what the testimony really says is that he has no information on what security they had, but it MIGHT have been outdated.

If we had a drinking game and took a shot every time a person from Sony said may, might or could in a sentence about the security breach we'd be dead by now...

We should take bets on whether PSN will be back up in time for the release of Duke Nukem Forever! :tup:

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Wouldn't this just make users hate the hackers? [...] Seriously, how can anybody be on their side if they did this?

Sorry, but who on earth is on the hackers' side anyway? I can't imagine anyone is exactly pleased about being locked out of their online services for several weeks and potentially having their personal/financial information floating around.

A third attack isn't going to change anyone's perception of the hackers because I think they're universally considered dickheads. It's simply going to inconvenience and frustrate people even more, which is probably what many hackers get off on anyway.

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Sorry, but who on earth is on the hackers' side anyway? I can't imagine anyone is exactly pleased about being locked out of their online services for several weeks and potentially having their personal/financial information floating around.

A third attack isn't going to change anyone's perception of the hackers because I think they're universally considered dickheads. It's simply going to inconvenience and frustrate people even more, which is probably what many hackers get off on anyway.

I know some people are on the hacker's side and think Sony deserved the attack for the whole Geohat incident and some are still defending Sony, I'm on neither's side.

It might just be me, but it looks like there are more people angry at the bumbling cartoon dog that failed to protect your pie instead of the weaselly cat that got away with it.

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In my experience, it sounds to me like internal processes are broken. In many (big) companies I've worked in, often the only deadline anyone cares about is the delivery/go-live date - as that's where the money arrives from. Everything needs to be planned around that, and further, security testing is usually the last thing to be done - there's no point testing half-built servers and networks. Now, since everything likely slips, the security testing then has to fit into a smaller timescale. Added to this, management often don't treat security testing as a serious quality gate, and it's just a 'tick in the box' so to speak. So, dev/build/config timescales slip, delivery/go-live doesn't, sec testing has to be squeezed in and as a result may not be done properly, which they (mgt) don't care about anyway. Add to that patching processes, update processes and what have you might not function correctly - although it's a lot more complex than simply updating your machine at home: These machines often run bespoke software, and installing the latest OS patches (for example) might break core functionality of the bespoke software. You then need to wait for the software provider (or internal dept.) to re-code, test, and then issue their own patches that are compatible with the OS patches, by which time there are likely more OS patches. Rinse, repeat. I'm not trying to provide an excuse for Sony, but trying to give an insight into what I suspect was going on behind the scenes.

Hopefully on the other hand, this very public and serious security breach might focus managers' minds the world over to show them what exactly will happen as a security risk triggers.

[security risks are very hard to quantify, as if significant investment occurs in security, and nothing happens, management will look at it as 'dead money' - i.e. a massive cost centre that doesn't provide any revenue. Therefore they are unwilling to invest, and are tempted to cut-corners. Unfortunately, cutting corners introduces a risk, and it's up the management who often don't understand the subject to put a figure on that risk triggering, and then also a percentage chance of that triggering. Those two are used to calculate the overall cost to the business should a risk trigger.]

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Sorry, but who on earth is on the hackers' side anyway? I can't imagine anyone is exactly pleased about being locked out of their online services for several weeks and potentially having their personal/financial information floating around.

Yes, the hackers are assholes for playing with everyone's private information just as much as Sony for getting the information of all who viewed Geohotz site and videos. Everyone messed up.

I'm sure the folks at Sony have already learned a lesson in privacy and protecting their users, so what's the use to keep trying to crack the guys? I just want to get back on PSN at this point. I could go with some Uncharted 2 online play.

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Has everybody else received an email from Sony already? Cause I haven't. I mean, how long can it take to send 100 million emails?

I have, but my sister (who uses the same PS3 with a different account) has not. Who knows.

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Ok, that does it! Holding my PC/Mac copy of Portal 2 for ransom. Fuck Sony!

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"Sony posted an update to its PlayStation blog Friday stating it was "unaware of the extent of the (network) attack" adding it needs to "conduct further testing of the incredibly complex system" before it can restart its network."

gob_bluth_come_on.jpg

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These are Sony's new security measures. Image from their internal presentation.

attachment.php?attachmentid=685&stc=1&d=1304896342

post-619-13375603387133_thumb.jpg

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I'll admit I only skimmed that "tl;dr" message, but it looks like it's saying "We didn't do it, but.... Yeah, we're so going to do something to Sony later as retaliation!"

Anon is anon and anybody can be in the "club", if someone commits a crime and says they are anon, anon did it.

Either way, why on Earth are they threatening Sony again? Didn't they say they wouldn't attack Sony because they didn't want to upset the nerds? Anon sounds a bit like Smeagol: "WE DID IT! NO WE DIDN'T! We don't want to hurtses the nerdlings! Nerdlings are out friends! Screw the nerds, DEATH TO SONY! Sony wants to take my preciooooous!".

I guess all we can do is watch the "Sony & Anon Comedy Hour" until this is over....

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Yes, the hackers are assholes for playing with everyone's private information just as much as Sony for getting the information of all who viewed Geohotz site and videos.

Isn't Sony getting that information the judge's fault? People make ridiculous claims all the time, but the legal system is supposed to mete out the reasonable ones. Rewarding that information seemed like a big breach of privacy, and not useful for actually determining the severity of the security breach. I can imagine an argument for wanting to know how many unique visitors saw that information in order to establish a plan for proceeding, but knowing the actual IPs is ridiculous.

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I'm guessing they requested the information and that the judge did not hand it over just for the sake of it, but I suppose it could be seen differently.

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Lolcats with trollfaces for heads.

> implying cats don't normally have trollfaces

> implying we weren't going in this direction anyway

> implying ps3 has games

(Etc.)

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