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toblix

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"You have been raped, Ok." Ign.com

OR:

"I was raped" Ign.com

OR:

"You have been raped, Learn More." Ign.com

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I have to wonder if these were just photoshoped to get me to play it and learn something.

tricky educational sobs.

edit: Ok I tried it. Turns out if you play life as a game from the get go, even with an intelligence of 11 you can make money hand over fist by the time your 25. My truck driver was certainly doing a lot better then I am in real, real life.

Too bad he died at 34 from alcoholism, I figured the smoking would have gotten to him first.

Edited by Murdoc

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Fantastic GAME... err....GAME, you know...like fun and stuff. I respect people who strive to highlight issues like this, I really do, but GAME?! Mental.

This is the really weird issue that all serious games face. They use game-like stuff to make serious points and educate, but because the GAMES INDUSTRY is about profit from entertainment, peoples understanding of what a game is never seems to stack up with it.

I've even met academics from the Serious Games Institute in Coventry who've, a little sheepishly, said "Uh, yeah. The entire term is just shot through with holes and we're not sure what to do about it".

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Yeah it keeps coming back to terms like Serious Games (or Art Games for that set), because alternatives like Interactive Experience are just so horrible. 'Simulation' may just work, with a bit of crowbarring.

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I asked a friend about this game and he said his wife threw a brick at him.

Maybe he was joking, but I must try this now when I get home.

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If someone ends up downloading/playing this "Video game", I'd be interested to see what you think about it.

I'm mildly intrigued but not enough to give them my personal info.

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I think that games are the wrong medium for stuff like this. I might watch a film to educate myself a little about a subject, but this tends to be incident specific, nearly always once only and not really for fun. I play games to escape from worldly horrors, not be reminded about them.

I cannot imagine a time ever that anyone will want to play games, which generally require a significant investment of time, about misery and suffering in our world. In fact, unless it had a deep moral message and was overtly educational (and thus less like a game) it could well offend people; imagine a 'game' based on the holocaust.

I do think games are an art form, they are certainly on a par with great paintings in terms of beauty for me, I just can't see a way they can cross into the 'serious' realm the way that films, plays, paintings etc do.

This is an interesting topic, and I'm a total art ignoramus, so please enlighten me if I'm talking bollocks (again :erm:) This is really quite an interesting subject :tup:

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I played a game of it. There is a demo where you get 3 lives. I went to 76 and died of diabetes, Emigrated from China to the UK at about 55 raped at 28.

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I think that games are the wrong medium for stuff like this. I might watch a film to educate myself a little about a subject, but this tends to be incident specific, nearly always once only and not really for fun. I play games to escape from worldly horrors, not be reminded about them.

I cannot imagine a time ever that anyone will want to play games, which generally require a significant investment of time, about misery and suffering in our world. In fact, unless it had a deep moral message and was overtly educational (and thus less like a game) it could well offend people; imagine a 'game' based on the holocaust.

I do think games are an art form, they are certainly on a par with great paintings in terms of beauty for me, I just can't see a way they can cross into the 'serious' realm the way that films, plays, paintings etc do.

This is an interesting topic, and I'm a total art ignoramus, so please enlighten me if I'm talking bollocks (again :erm:) This is really quite an interesting subject :tup:

My opinion is that games have trouble crossing into the serious realm because many of them are goal-driven. Players get tasks and do them, without having to understand the consequences of their actions. Doing Task A trigger Task B, and it all feels very fatalistic. Movies and books can pull off determinism because the audience is always an observer rather than a participant. Having a game like Real Life without goals that just presents a world and tells you to experience it seems like the way to go when trying to make serious games.

I think that it does meet the educational and moral requirements for seriousness, insomuch as things that people care deeply about such as starvation and rape are represented factually and based on real statistics. Playing a few rounds will supplement your understanding of life in other countries, but I agree it doesn't replace the impact of reading or watching a personal story about life in other countries.

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imagine a 'game' based on the holocaust.

*COUGH*

Just because it's not to your taste, doesn't mean it can't or shouldn't be done.

My opinion is that games have trouble crossing into the serious realm because many of them are goal-driven.

The Redistricting Game is a great example of something that has goals illustrating a serious point.

I'm *kind* of with you both on serious games being a crappy and troubled label, but IMO it's more of a market limitation than an inherent limitation of the form. Many important and useful things are systems based, and can hence be represented using game-like systems. The lines are blurring somewhat between serious/non-serious projects, but the chances of any serious game going through a traditional distribution channel are minuscule.

Edited by Nachimir

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The Redistricting Game is a great example of something that has goals illustrating a serious point.

I'm *kind* of with you both on serious games being a crappy and troubled label, but IMO it's more of a market limitation than an inherent limitation of the form. Many important and useful things are systems based, and can hence be represented using game-like systems. The lines are blurring somewhat between serious/non-serious projects, but the chances of any serious game going through a traditional distribution channel are minuscule.

I was thinking more about goals as scripted events, like how in GTA4 you have to kill Dwayne or Playboy X to trigger a call from Brucie to open up new missions. I guess what I don't like is goals without consequences, or goals that feel arbitrary. A lot of games depend on the player to be invested in the cutscenes to give meaning to the goals. In The Redistricting Game it sounds like you're given power to play around with the world, and then you can have an epiphany where you realize that what you're doing has analogies to actual behavior. The 1's and 0's could be easily substituted for real people whose lives you are affecting.

I think for games there is a real technical limitation when you get to a personal scale, since you need to have a good suspension of disbelief. You can't model Playboy X in the same way you can model a demographic in The Redistricting Game.

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...*COUGH*...Just because it's not to your taste, doesn't mean it can't or shouldn't be done...

I wasn't saying it couldn't, shouldn't or wasn't to my taste, I was trying to say that I just didn't think it would be easy, as in this quote..

Train's spontaneous popularity resulted in a lot of backlash: people have told Brathwaite to stop making games, and that she should be punched in the face for creating Train.

If the person who made that game tried to make money out of it there would be uproar I am sure. I'm not agreeing with that, in fact I think those who would get annoyed would be missing the point; it could well serve to highlight what happened and thus educate a little. But still the masses would moan and cause trouble.

I like the idea of actually trying to subvert the game once you have made your moral choice. In this case, literally derailing the games 'intended' direction.

I agree Nachimir, that it's probably more of a market limitation than inherent, but I don't think games are the right medium nor can I ever see them being. Games are thought of as entertainment by planet Earth to all intents and purposes, it would take a massive shift in public understanding to change that even a little bit, even more so to make it economically viable.

There is a certain level of moral disconnection when we play games, also a suspension of belief, I'm not sure what would happen to games as a whole if those elements were to be eliminated.

I have more to say on this but I am too knackered right now! Interesting and thought provoking topic this.

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Someone should combine this game with progress quest. That would get rid of all the unnecessary clicking and thinking.

Does the games creators really expect schools to use this. I'm guessing they're aiming for high schools and not elementary. But in high schools you can read books that say all sorts of swearing and sex and stuff in the library but you cant even go to a web page that says the word damn. Maybe if they turned it into one of those books with the buttons you're supposed to press when the symbol comes up in the text and it makes a sound. I could just imagine. Its a pick your own adventure with sounds of raping and being murdered.

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I agree Nachimir, that it's probably more of a market limitation than inherent, but I don't think games are the right medium nor can I ever see them being. Games are thought of as entertainment by planet Earth to all intents and purposes, it would take a massive shift in public understanding to change that even a little bit, even more so to make it economically viable.

There is a difference between entertainment and art, and I definitely think there is room for games that offer more then escapism, not saying escapism is bad.

If I understand you correctly you are saying that games is, and will always be, only good for pure escapism. Now that is a thought that scares me, but I sure think I get more out of my hobby then that.

Also, artistic things need not be commercially sound. Revolution seldom is.

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... I don't think games are the right medium nor can I ever see them being. Games are thought of as entertainment by planet Earth to all intents and purposes, it would take a massive shift in public understanding to change that even a little bit

I would argue that Film is thought of as entertainment by most people, but that doesn't prevent harrowing or tragic films from existing. If anything I think games are exactly the right medium as experiencing something can be a lot more powerful than merely spectating.

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Also this game appears to be aimed at an education setting, like a school.

I remember my school having a couple of educational computer programs, on it's BBC micro and *********. Like the red circular guy called 'Pod' or something. You typed in verbs and he would act them out. He frowned at swear words. Or one that was a kind of simulation of sea-trading on the Spanish Main or something. Eventually everyone would run into torrential rain and sink.

I can't seem to find these on the net.

The point is that some educational games can be force-fed to children and they will actually lap them up, it being more fun than regular schoolwork. And if I am any indication, then they do actually stick in the mind too.

On the other hand maybe times have changed and even young children are completely blasé about computers now.

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I don't get it. What is the actual gameplay of this? I mean, what does the player do and how much control does he have over the simulation?

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I don't get it. What is the actual gameplay of this? I mean, what does the player do and how much control does he have over the simulation?

A reasonable amount, at a young age you have very little to no control, though as you get older the control you get increases. Specific things you can do are:

choose activities, budget, invest/borrow money, get involved romantically, get married, have kids, adopt, emmigrate.

Along with these random events happen, such as a friend neighbour getting in trouble and you could help them.

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