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Awesome MI2 2D/3D Projection thingie

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Chris tweeted this link here:

And it got me thinking: This is how they should remake these games. By projecting the new backgrounds on 3D geometry and having slight -- slight --camera movement on all the scenes. It would require modelling all the shit, but it wouldn't have to be detailed models, you wouldn't need texturing (only the redone 2D art), and it would look awesome holy shit. The trick is that you get the awesome feeling of space that the 3D graphics combined with slight camera movement gives, but you get away with really simplistic 3D modelling, and no texturing.

Please give me a reason this isn't one hell of an awesome idea. Okay, the whole seamless switching between old and new mode would be harder/more impossible to implement. BIG FUCKING DEAL. It's awesome 3D!

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But it doesn't REALLY need to be 3D, does it? Just a still from that video would've been good enough even without any fancy space manipulation. That way the old/new transition would be the sameas ever. If you can seemlessly integrate the sprites into the backgrounds (I have no idea how it works, can you tell?) then it would simply look gorgeous.

It was my understanding though that there were only about 4 or 5 pieces of the original background art still in existance. Is this true? If there are so many missing I can't imagine LA will want to put in so much effort

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It was my understanding though that there were only about 4 or 5 pieces of the original background art still in existance. Is this true? If there are so many missing I can't imagine LA will want to put in so much effort

I think it's more like we've only seen 4 or 5, and the rest are hidden somewhere.

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Boy, if that's the case, a Monkey 2 SE should be a snap. All your hi-def backgrounds are already finished, you just need some new character sprites to match and boom, you're done. No need for any of this 3D mumbo-jumbo.

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But it doesn't REALLY need to be 3D, does it?

No, not really.

But the whole point of my post was how great it would be if they used this 3D technique. But, you know, whatever.

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I think it's more like we've only seen 4 or 5, and the rest are hidden somewhere.

Oh yeah that probably makes more sense.

My main, personal concern for an MI2SE would be the Guybrush sprite. The original is only perfect for me because of the nostalgia value but, when I really think about it, it's a low detailed sprite mostly covered by a beard. It's incredibly unclear to the point that I can't really translate what it's supposed to look like in the real world. As a result I think I'm just going to end up hating whatever they come up with which is a shame...

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Boy, if that's the case, a Monkey 2 SE should be a snap. All your hi-def backgrounds are already finished, you just need some new character sprites to match and boom, you're done. No need for any of this 3D mumbo-jumbo.

I think some of the backgrounds may need to be touched up or were done really rough originally and finished on the computer, but I have no idea. Every original background released so far looks pretty finished to me. Certainly would be much more refined than the messy brushes they used for some of the backgrounds of MI:SE.

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Oh yeah that probably makes more sense.

My main, personal concern for an MI2SE would be the Guybrush sprite. The original is only perfect for me because of the nostalgia value but, when I really think about it, it's a low detailed sprite mostly covered by a beard. It's incredibly unclear to the point that I can't really translate what it's supposed to look like in the real world. As a result I think I'm just going to end up hating whatever they come up with which is a shame...

That's what I love about it. To me, Guybrush is barely even a character. I know some people like to talk about how much they love Guybrush Threepwood as a hilarious character, but it's never been that for me, at least not in the first two games. I really like that I have no fully-formed human conception of who Guybrush is; his cypher-like nature is really central to the effectiveness of those games.

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This is a very successful technique if you exactly know what the point of view will be : we used it in a more limited and straightforward way (in that case, I think most people call it texture projection and sometime camera mapping) to get a very awesome matte painting of a city landscape straight into the game without loss of quality and still get room for some minor camera pan, traveling and shiny fog/atmospheric post processes.

Mulan uses a similar technique for its opening sequence on the Chinese Wall

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It'd be a great day when the Deep Canvas tech from Tarzan ends up in games (ZBrush polypaint is a step forward I guess)

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This is so awesome.

Edited by vimes

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Les Gobelins is an awesome school - I mean, I've never met a guy who went in and out of there who was less than excellent at what he/she did- and every year, the 2nd year students output awesome shorts for the Annecy festival.

are pretty awesome, my favorite one being Monstera Deliciosa (despite the music) and Le Lac Gelé.

Also, Tekkon Kinkreet really felt like a step down for Studio 4°C, both in terms of animation and content. I hope they stray away from anime's stereotype for their next one.

The short you linked to is brilliant though :

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Edited by vimes

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That video rocks, incidentally, and while I think 3D isn't necessary, it does have the added benefit of being able to nicely scale to any resolution.

But without the 3D it's just some new artwork. I don't get it.

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Yeah, in the first two games, he's not so much a character as a stand-in for the player's piratey ambitions. Stylizing him in a post-MI2 manner would be a mistake.

That video rocks, incidentally, and while I think 3D isn't necessary, it does have the added benefit of being able to nicely scale to any resolution.

The subtle 3D is what brings the quality up to a level which actually matches my mind's eye's opinion/memory of what that game would look like if it was higher res, though. I think part of what's a little funky about Monkey 1 special edition is that there's all this added detail where there used to be implied detail, but there's nothing dynamic added where there was only implied/imagined movement or life before. Adding that subtle swing/perspective of the camera tells my brain "yes, this thing you're seeing is actually a real space and not just a painting," which is something the lower resolution artwork didn't have to try and sell. I think that in gaming unfortunately, the requirements to properly achieve suspension of disbelief often scale up along with the fidelity of the game. As your overall game looks and behaves better, elements which used to be able to get a pass just by being representations of a cool thing need to actually be a cool thing.

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I think it's more like we've only seen 4 or 5, and the rest are hidden somewhere.

There is a giant art 'bin' at LucasArts that contains all the painted art, and bonus art that never made it into the game.

We were never allowed to see it :(

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There is a giant art 'bin' at LucasArts that contains all the painted art, and bonus art that never made it into the game.

I've heard it's all in an amazing gallery hidden behind a turnstyle bookcase.

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I've heard it's all in an amazing gallery hidden behind a turnstyle bookcase.

I heard it contains Peter Chan's skeleton but I think I read that in a walkthrough somewhere.

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This conversation reminds me of reading about Cyan's awesome offices, with all sorts of hidden shit and amazing elevators.

I guess bums and dope fiends live there now.

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Holy shit, Hannes Appell created this? Any Germans here who know him? He worked at Giga Games (a former TV show) as a moderator for two years to get into some kind of film school, I believe. Guess he made it. :clap:

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I don't know about Germans, but he's a regular on the Mojo forums. He reckons he's doing the Voodoo Lady's scene at the moment as an experiment.

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Holy shit, Hannes Appell created this? Any Germans here who know him? He worked at Giga Games (a former TV show) as a moderator for two years to get into some kind of film school, I believe. Guess he made it. :clap:
Yeah, I saw his name as well and thought 'Shit, those were the days', or something. He and Etienne were the most fun. After he'd left, I couldn't stand to watch Giga Games much longer - the show went downhill, I went uphill, I'm not sure. Giga Games: A Youth Well Wasted.

Oh, and the video looks great. And thanks for the fantastic Goblins Gobelins linkage.

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Whoa that is a cool video. We briefly investigated this technique for the fantastic/innovative/sexy yet tragically cancelled game we were working on at NCsoft. Our goal was to use this as a way to quickly and cheaply convert concept art to semi-3D scenes. If I recall correctly the idea was dropped due to the poor flexibility it gives. Pan the camera just a bit too far and you start seeing the seams...

As cool as this looks though I'd really like an MI2 special edition to just have higher res scanned backgrounds plx. :tup:

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If I recall correctly the idea was dropped due to the poor flexibility it gives. Pan the camera just a bit too far and you start seeing the seams...

But... flexibility compared to what? If you already have 2D art it gives you more flexibility, since you'll be able to move the camera at all. Compared to full 3D, sure it's limiting, but then you already have full 3D, so why consider it?

As a replacement for actual 3D it's very limited, but when operating within those limits it looks damn nice, much better than any parallax scrolling I've seen. It also allows better looking visual effects than any 2D solution, since you're actually operating inside a 3D space.

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As a replacement for actual 3D it's very limited, but when operating within those limits it looks damn nice, much better than any parallax scrolling I've seen. It also allows better looking visual effects than any 2D solution, since you're actually operating inside a 3D space.

Yes sir, this technique is parallax scrolling for the future. I thought that was the appeal in the first place?

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I suppose Marek meant it was too limited for the NCsoft project?

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I suppose Marek meant it was too limited for the NCsoft project?
You're right, you're right. At first I thought he meant they had finished the 2D graphics already, and only wanted to "enhance" them this way.

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