Left 4 Thumbs

[Wrestlevania]

In case you've not been checking the Steam Community calendar, I've bumped all forth-coming Left 4 Thumbs sessions forwards 1hr to 8pm GMT by popular request.

That means we're starting now, peeps, so get in 'ere quick!

[James]

I've been having increasingly frequent problems connecting to games. I hope this doesn't become a permanent feature, particularly with L4D2 on the horizon.

[Pilgrim72]

Thanks for the invite Armchair! A great game tonight with great guys.

Found your forums too... hope you all dont mind me having a look in.

Hoping to link up with some more Idle gamers in the near future!

[Scratch]

Thanks for the invite Armchair! A great game tonight with great guys.

Found your forums too... hope you all dont mind me having a look in.

Hoping to link up with some more Idle gamers in the near future!

Welcome to the forums mate. Most of us from the regular L4D games are around here somewhere. You'll see them pop around occasionally.

Enjoy your stay.

[SuspectKitten]

I've been having increasingly frequent problems connecting to games. I hope this doesn't become a permanent feature, particularly with L4D2 on the horizon.

Yeah, me too! We missed you last night!

Hoping to link up with some more Idle gamers in the near future!

Good to have you onboard, good game last night! Welcome welcome

[Pilgrim72]

Thank you, thank you... You're far too kind!

[DanJW]

http://www.vg247.com/2009/11/03/l4d2-realism-mode-glows-dropped-one-hit-kill-witch/

Ooooh, I hope they patch that into the first game too!

[James]

http://www.vg247.com/2009/11/03/l4d2-realism-mode-glows-dropped-one-hit-kill-witch/

Ooooh, I hope they patch that into the first game too!

I was there when that was being confirmed! That isn't at all impressive or remarkable, but it delights me nevertheless.

On a related note, Danny boy had assumed that melee weapons were replacing pistols as the infinite ammo option, making things more realistic. I understand why they haven't done this, but it did get me wondering whether it would be possible to set this up on a custom server. It would probably be easier to remove the pistols completely than add a new variable to keep track of their ammo (if that would even be possible without client-side mods), and you'd have to make sure everyone could get a melee weapon at the beginning (or even spawn them with one), but it could be pretty interesting to have bullets be a luxury, and to work out strategies for making the most of them. Then again, you can get through most of a game on primary ammo anyway. Perhaps that could be off more scarce, too.

[Scratch]

Realism mode was one of the things I was looking forward in L4D2. It sounds even more hardcore now that we have the details. I doubt they would patch that into the first game considering how realism and scavenge are the two "advertised" new modes.

[Wrestlevania]

Very much liking the look of Realism mode on paper--sounds like it could add some extra depth to playing with reg'lar folks.

Anyone know if you can play Versus in Realism mode? Wasn't mentioned in that article.

[James]

Realism and versus appear as separate modes in the demo menu. That suggests not.

[Wrestlevania]

Realism and versus appear as separate modes in the demo menu. That suggests not.

Hmph, suspected that might be the case in the final game, too. Oh well, I would imagine it might just be too stupidly hard for both teams then. Or maybe not..?

[Denial]

I think Realism versus would be too quickly fatal for the players - it's not backed up by hard evidence, but I suspect you'd have one or two players pocked off by hunter pounces not far from the team, and the others would be overwhelmed by weight of numbers in fairly short order...

[n0wak]

I think Realism versus would be too quickly fatal for the players - it's not backed up by hard evidence, but I suspect you'd have one or two players pocked off by hunter pounces not far from the team, and the others would be overwhelmed by weight of numbers in fairly short order...

Considering the slaughter-fest we had a week ago, where we could barely leave the safe room without dieing, I'd have to agree. Realism mode might be good against AI opponents, but against humans? It'd be a little unbalanced unless they had very specific and very quick modes (wouldn't really fit the long campaigns). Maybe scavenger mode could work.

[liquid]

I just canceled my Modern Warfare 2 pre-order, in light of recent events. I wasn't a fan of L4D, but I only play it one night. The lack of iron sight was the main put off for me. That and the lack of friends to play it with. Should I get this or wait for Bad Company 2 in March?

[DanJW]

If the lack of iron sights put you off L4D, then it's probably not the kind of game you are looking for.

[Scratch]

Why would you really need iron sights in L4D? The weapons we have are quite sufficient to kill zombies.

That's a really specific thing you're looking for in games. Do iron sights really matter that much?

[DanJW]

I really like having iron sights in more realistic military shooters - Call of Duty, STALKER, etc. It improves the verisimilitude for me. L4D isn't one of those.

[Scratch]

I understand how iron sights can be useful and I prefer having them as well. But judging whether or not to play a game based on it's inclusion of sights on weapons doesn't seem right.

[Cigol]

Maybe not iron sights, but the lack of ability to 'aim' is something that nags at me whilst playing. All you do now is shoot from the hip and it's wildly inaccurate at times. There's a lot of little things like this that the L4D series seems to ignore completely... I mean, I've pre-ordered the game a second time around so clearly it's not a big deal - but I wish they'd do more with the game.

[DanJW]

Maybe for the "realism mode", but in general I think the more arcadey feel suits Left 4 Dead and makes it more accessible to all types of gamers.

[n0wak]

But doesn't that generally fit the context of the series? I mean, apart from Bill, these aren't exactly soldiers. Just regular folk caught amongst the zombie apocalypse, picking up what they can find along the way. Shoot from the hip and GO GO GO.

I mean, if you're going on about the lack of iron sights you might as well criticize the lack of cover mechanics, squad commands, user classes, and instant respawns while you're at it. But then, that's exactly the type of game that L4D is trying NOT to be. Keep it simple and focus on the action.

[James]

I think Realism versus would be too quickly fatal for the players - it's not backed up by hard evidence, but I suspect you'd have one or two players pocked off by hunter pounces not far from the team, and the others would be overwhelmed by weight of numbers in fairly short order...

What if the infected couldn't see glows, either? That probably wouldn't completely redress the balance, but it would make setting up ambushes much trickier.

[Cigol]

But doesn't that generally fit the context of the series? I mean, apart from Bill, these aren't exactly soldiers. Just regular folk caught amongst the zombie apocalypse, picking up what they can find along the way. Shoot from the hip and GO GO GO.

I mean, if you're going on about the lack of iron sights you might as well criticize the lack of cover mechanics, squad commands, user classes, and instant respawns while you're at it. But then, that's exactly the type of game that L4D is trying NOT to be. Keep it simple and focus on the action.

It doesn't take military training to understand that focusing on your shot and picking your targets is more precise than not. All I'm suggesting is the ability to 'focus' with perhaps a little adjusted zoom and control over the accuracy of the shot (as opposed to the scattergun approach it takes now). Maybe it's just me but it feels like its taking the control away and it's always there nagging that I don't have the option in scenarios where it'd be useful (such as picking off from a distance). I think it'd fit right in personally - better than the scoped rifle they have now which is nigh on useless as anything other than a rail-gun.

Cover mechanics on the otherhand wouldn't make a lot of sense obviously - but there are some areas in the game where you crouch down and you can't see over the top. That's where a system like vietcong's which allows you to automatically peek over would come in handy.

User classes would needlessly complicate things I agree - but I don't see why they couldn't get away with subtle characteristics for characters like they did in Goldeneye 64. The coach is a big guy for example, and Bill looks like he knows how to handle a gun... It's not out of the realms of possibility anyway, and if it were balanced right I don't see why it would take you out of the game - if anything it could have the opposite effect. And whilst the AI doesn't listen, the games pre-set audio commands combined with voice-chat work more or less as squad commands already.

I'm not actually arguing for any of these in the game incidentally, just give me mini-zoom and less random accuracy for that aiming mechanic. Or at least produce an SDK so modders can create it for me. It's the only thing aside from a lack of variety in the core gameplay that irks me.

Maybe for the "realism mode"

That's fine with me. Where do I sign?

Edited November 4, 2009 by Cigol

[DanJW]

I've had a hunger for L4D this week, but with no recourse other than public games.

Jeeeeeeezus it makes me hate humanity so much. What is it about this game that attracts so many ADHD sufferers? Most people leave a lobby if it doesn't go to a game within 5 seconds. Then there's the constant ragequits, or the teams who use unbeatable exploits to ensure a win. Or the teams than sprint off and don't notice that you have been pounced, and then vote-kick you for "beign laem".

Are all online games like this now?

Ahhg. I love this game but I can't stand the people who play it.

Except for you, you gorgeous Thumbs people. It makes me love you all the more.