Jake

Far Cry 2

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I am honestly starting to think you are just fuckin with me.

 

-All the video shows is that Nick is going out of his way to artificially create an interesting situation by choosing the least effective option,it feels very forced.

 

-Again you don't really explain how the shooting mechanics compare,is it the recoil,the sound,the animation,the aiming be more specific.

 

-I don't want to shoot all the time in a sandbox game for that I have serious sam or brutal doom,if this is a sandbox it's supposed to give me something interesting to do besides shooting and if shooting is my only true way to interact with the world then give me something to shoot,not all the time but more than this game offers.

 

-If you categorize it like that then stalker has only 2 things as well, shooting things and collecting things.By number I meant not only variety of things but also volume.I like to point out that you contradict yourself,first you say that the fact that you don't shoot often adds weight to the instances when you do and now you say that nothing gets you out of the shooting,which is not true.You know what gets me out of the shooting?The constant amount of fuckin travelling,which by the way far cry 3 solved with having a much better fast travel system.Also before you can skin the animals you have to SHOOT them.

 

-Constantly do missions and ignore the story?Pretty amazing,oh it's like in far cry 3 that you can go hunting, assault bases, take bounty missions.Yeah it's great,if that's what you want far cry 3 has it,btw you don't even need to listen to some fuckin idiot talking, you just go to a sign post and accept.I don't care about the story.

 

-Again all those supposed wacky situations,forced.Here's a far cry 3 wacky situation that happens because the world is more alive,scouting a base to assault,looking for the best way to enter when a fuckin jaguar jumps on you from the rear because he almost kills you, you panic and shoot at it with an unsilenced weapon alerting most of the guys in the base.

 

-Far cry 2's do something is shoot people and travel and if you want to spend your time travelling instead of shooting that is the game for you.WHEN  I get to shoot it's fine,nothing special unfortunately I have to travel for an hour before I get to do it.Going to a safe house is  a detour,in 3 you would just pick the stuff you need on the way.

 

-I think a lot of people are at awe by far cry 2 on this forum because they are not very versed in the fps genre or they WANT to like this game because the idle guys love it,probably the combination of the two.

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Indeed, travelling is a big aspect of Far Cry 2, even if you ignore the story and talk about mechanics mostly. Most of the decisions you make in the game (outside of quick decisions in combat) are probably about travelling:

 

* do I use roads

* do I use boats

* do I just go by foot (or whatever means of transport I can find on the way) and avoid the risky routes

* do I use fast travel (less available, less interesting but quicker)

* do I pick the short route or the one with least checkpoints

* do I try to sneak past a checkpoint (probably losing my car/boat and having to find another one)

* do I try to fight my way through a checkpoint

* do I try to just speed through a checkpoint

* do I pull up a map while speeding down a road to make sure I'm going the right way or do I focus on the road and go by memory/signs

* do I try to take care of other things while taking this potentially dangerous trip to the mission location or do I just try to get there fast (I find the first approach to be much more interesting).

* do I make a potentially long detour when I see the diamond detector blink

* do I find a good vantage point and observe before starting shooting and try to find the best way to approach the combat; or do I just go into combat whichever way I'm approaching from.

etc.

 

And then there's enjoying the scenery while travelling.

 

One of the biggest problems I had with it is that picking roads or boats does not make enough difference in being able to avoid fighting -- with both you can encounter patrols and checkpoints at a similar frequency.

 

I enjoyed Far Cry 3 as well, probably more than most people here, but it did somehow make the travelling aspect less important.

 

About your comment about whether it is enjoyed by good or mediocre FPS players or whatever: IMHO the Idle Thumbs community has never cared much about being good at games or "playing to win" or playing in an optimal way. So if you care about that in Far Cry 2, I see where your difference in opinion is coming from.

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Rakombo I think Erkki sums it up well the main "do something" is that you're unrestricted in how you do everything.

No invisible walls or out of bounds you are liberated in how you tackle an objective, to me the fun is seeing if my plan was really smart or incredibly Ill-thought-out.

Best part is, both are fun.

I loved Far Cry 3 an awful lot too Erkki, to me they are two beasts that I .

The lack of UI pulls me into the world and I'm not reminded I'm in a game.

Also, anyone found an Oculus Rift mod for this at all? It kinda seems an obvious poster child for the benefits of it.

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Erkki I do play to win,and I believe that a game should support that mentality.In my opinion any game can have wacky bizarre situations if you go out of your way to make them.For instance in the clip Nick tried to snipe the truck driver,even if he succeeded he would have to blow it up and then lose or kill the rest of the convoy instead he could have use the explosive crossbow.If the game mechanics are solid I should not be deliberately fuckin up to make it interesting.I wasn't saying that you need to to be a mediocre fps player,I meant that maybe the people that consider this games mechanics good did not really experience a lot of open world games or fps games.

 

 

I f the lack of UI is a big deal to you than I can see why you like this game.I personally don't look for realism in my games,from experience it brings more bad than good.I would argue that Far Cry 2 was more immersive for me because I did not have to deal with pseudo realistic bullshit.The Far Cry 2 map that is so liked on here is just stupid in my opinion,why cant I lower it?And if you want realism make the map static,that would actually be interesting to actually figure out and being able to track where you are.And about the Oculus Rift I think games like mirrors edge are by far more suited for it because you have a more interesting way to interact with the environment.

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The explosive crossbow is basically a cheat. If I remember correctly, it was added later with some DLC (the same that added the "Phaedrus" missions?), and originally it didn't exist. If you are using it, try to play without and maybe it'll become better.

 

But sure, the trucks are usually more efficient to take out with some kind of explosive while they are driving. Personally I don't see the point of always selecting the most optimal way, though and I think many here agree. It's not necessarily going out of my way to not use the explosive when I can.

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It's weird to say this, but Far Cry 2 is a "go-with-the-flow" game. Like, after you get to the point where all the systems are open and you can do anything...just walk to some random place. Appreciate the scenery, and then have that sense of nirvana crumble once you get in a random fire-fight. Set yourself some goals. Like osmosisch said, if you play to win and try to play it as any old shooter, you won't have fun. I'm playing a permadeath run and it's the funnest shit ever.

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Same here I like to immerse myself as I enjoy as escaping to a world rather than exploiting weapons and winning as fast as possible.

I did what Nick and Chris did and stare out accross the plains, watching the god rays vanish as a storm rustled up the grass as the animals run along a distant ridge.

If you play to win at all cost, fine. I don't think it's a right that all games should accommodate such a demand. Miasmata for one is brilliant for being an antithesis to such gamification.

Also I'm not sure if nicks mistake was so highly scripted, if it was, thanks nick and Chris for your accompanying music, a quaint highlight of my gaming year.

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I enjoyed both Far Cry 2 and 3, but they were pretty different games on a deeper level than just variety or how much "stuff" there was to do. Far Cry 2 dropped you into a hostile world where you felt like a mostly-insignificant cog in a terrible machine and more or less left you to your own devices. It wasn't perfectly balanced and it had some significant flaws, but it did something interesting and different instead of being yet another sandbox game which is actually just a giant theme park full of boxes to tick (at least not outwardly). Far Cry 3, I think, tried to compensate for the perceived flaws of FC2 a little too drastically, and ended up skewing in completely the opposite direction. It's a big, dumb, ego-tripping power fantasy, and it doesn't make any bones about it - it's reflected directly in the protagonist's story arc. I didn't hate the crafting or the hunting missions, but you could become overpowered incredibly early if you focused on that stuff. You clear an outpost and it's gone forever, which makes travel even more consequence-free than it already was. Then you get to the second island and, as if the game hadn't already done you enough favours, you get an enemy uniform so you don't even have to engage unless and until you want to, and a (admittedly really sweet) wingsuit to make travel easier yet. Like I said, I still had fun with FC3, but 2 was by far the more engaging experience.

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So, I was recording my permadeath run yesterday and this moment felt pretty cool.

 

 

Points to anyone who finds the IGN.com quote in the video.

 

Far Cry 2.

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So, I was recording my permadeath run yesterday and this moment felt pretty cool.

 

Far Cry 2.

I wasn't really feelin' the 'moment' through the combat, which just seemed to sort of go on... but then I beheld the moment what you were referring to.

 

And I was nodding as well. Talk about timing, that was pretty much on its way to happening the moment you opened the door and got out. Far Cry 2.

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Yeah, reason why I uploaded that moment was because of all the crazy violence and stuff happening, then, after it's all done, there's this eerie silence, and the trees are swaying, and there's a lush waterfall and it's so peaceful. It felt like those moments Idle Thumbs always explained: crazy moments of extreme chaos and uncertainty, ending with wondrous contemplation and silence. The car explosion was the period at the end of that moment.

 

Far Cry 2.

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Far Cry 2 indeed! I've not played much of it, really, but what I have played I've enjoyed. There was a particularly exciting moment when I was pinned down by a sniper whilst crossing a bridge. I had a sniper rifle too, but he was better than me. I'm gunned down, and then rescued by my pal, who it seems is only a mercenary in occupational terms. He takes charge, barking at me to take cover and firing on the sniper. 

 

It was beautiful. A seemingly chaotic, unique scenario, which felt as thrilling as any heavily scripted moment I've experienced this year.

 

 I don't like how frequently guard posts regenerate tho. Driving around is enough of a hassle without constantly getting your car shot to bits and having to pinch another one.

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I think a lot of people are at awe by far cry 2 on this forum because they are not very versed in the fps genre or they WANT to like this game because the idle guys love it,probably the combination of the two.

 

It's the exact opposite for me.  I started listening to Idle Thumbs because of my love for Far Cry 2.  I stumbled on these guys during a google search which stemmed from an argument about FC2 on a different forum.

 

Huge STALKER fan here but FC2 oozes plenty of atmosphere and is endlessly replayable imo.  FC3 ooozes "i'm playing a video game."

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I'm hearing reports that in the next Bioshock game using plasmids gives you malaria.

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I tried FC2 last night thanks to the steam sale and idle thumbs. Only 2 hours in but I'm enjoying it.

The best moments for me so far have been:

Seeing a car on the road and assuming (thanks to the intro "the soldiers mostly keep to themselves") that we would drive past each other amicably. Only for them to open fire on me, forcing me to madly shoot with my pistol until I killed the gunner then lob a grenade due to no ammo to kill the driver while he changed seats. This resulted in me lost without a transport. Fun!

The second was barreling into a road block while looking at my map. The biggest shit storm happened as I tried to hide and pick enemies off one by one.

I mean, this is what I was told to expect, but I assumed it was all hyperbole. I had fun in those 2 hours. I never felt like I had nothing to do, only that there was too much to choose from. Can't wait to get a few more hours under my belt.

I think it helps that I've heard so much praise before starting, but also that it's just "my kinda thing" unlike most shooters that bore me.

My only criticism so far is that the map feels like a bunch of tunnels forcing you through them.

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