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Diablo III

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You're less than 1 act into a 4/5 act story. 

 

It sounds like you're really down on it. Personally, I think it's a really fun game that gets more entertaining as your character hits higher level and has more options. Like miffy said, the story really isn't great, so I wouldn't look for that to elevate things.

 

If you're not enjoying it, stop playing. Not everything is for everyone. 

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Yeah the story is definitely pretty bad, though honestly that's kind of how all Blizzard games are (I was actually really in to the story in WC3, but in 2003 I was also 12).  Based on what you said you're still in Act 1 which is really early into the game.  The second act isn't in the town and is actually my favorite act in the game so if you aren't digging the tone and setting there's a chance you'll enjoy Act 2, at least more than Act 1.  The gameplay opens up a lot more once you get a little higher level (I'm assuming you're around level 20 now and 30-40 is where you have a lot more skills and rune to mess around with).  As far as loot goes I actually found that loot seemed to be dropping a lot more when I played than back in 2011.  I don't know exactly what they changed in loot 2.0, but I was playing with a couple friends and we were all finding legendaries maybe once every 30 minutes or so.  I'm not sure if that's related to having more people in the party or what, but it's a noticeable increase.  I would say at least give the game a try for a little bit of Act 2 to see if you find it any more engaging, but if you don't you shouldn't feel bad about quitting.

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They upped the drops when they got rid of the auction house because you can't just buy shit now, so yeah, loot is way better. As for WCIII, I am exactly with you, except that I was 15. High five for being teenagers with low standards for storytelling!

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I could be wrong, but it sounds like you are pretty low level?

 

The combat, even on higher difficulty, is pretty simplistic at low levels because you haven't been given the range of skills/runes necessary to develop more sophisticated tactics. So ya, it's really boring early on.

 

I agree that the tone/story leaves a lot to be desired. I think they just figured that the bulk of players are more or less going to be doing repetitive loot runs at the end game, and so they didn't invest a ton in one-off story moments that people will not want to see more than once.

 

This is not an interesting first-person story game, it's a flashy piñata. The mechanics are going to get more difficult as you level up, but if you can't see yourself doing loot runs over and over late game, it might not be the game for you. I played a bit with some friends, and enjoyed my time getting gear upgrades for a little while. But there isn't much there, especially if you don't have a group of friends to play with. If you find the combat at all fun as you get a bit higher level though, you might enjoy sinking some time in late game.

 

Edit: realized I basically said the same stuff everyone else already did  : (

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If that's where you are in the game, you're probably not even getting shoulder or head drops yet, and likely not "rare" drops (yellow) yet either. I don't think I've ever seen a legendary with an equip level lower than 20 for example, so if you aren't at level 20 yet you have not even achieved the ability to see an epic drop.

 

The story is TERRIBLE. It's really bad. And you're right at the intersection of low level issues where you have no gear, not a full compliment of skills, and normal is numbingly easy but upping the difficulty to hard/expert just makes it take longer rather than make it more interesting.

 

The thing I actually like at max level is playing with a full group of 4 at the highest level you can handle. The action is non-stop and completely crazy. Solo low level play does not have that for a number of reasons (some of them valuable).

 

 

e: Forgot the part where if you're just not flat having fun and in it for the story, it's probably not for you. If you're willing to stick with it for another 90 minutes or so the game will begin to open up pretty significantly in terms of game play.

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The story basically becomes high comedy in the last two acts, with the most incompetent villains this side of Snidely Whiplash. Good grief.

I played through as a Witch Doctor which was absolutely goddamn hilarious just because of the class/skill flavours. Doing things like transforming into a chicken, charging a group of enemies, exploding, throwing a jar of spiders at them and then making a circus troupe of zombies make a 'human' pyramid and fall over and explode... well, I just can't get enough of that.

There's a butt-ton of skill/rune combos that I found interesting to experiment with but this only really came into its own in act 3-ish, maybe midway through 2. Level 25 I think.

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Has anyone else been lured back by the new Patch? This includes:

--- Seasonal gameplay with leaderboards and new Legendaries: the main appeal for me is that you start completely from scratch (no artisans, no Paragon points); after the season ends, heros are rolled into the main roster

 

--- Portals into the realm of the treasure goblins (for level 70 I think); I've not been, but I imagine it's stupid amounts of loot

 

--- Greater rifts that you must beat within 15 minutes; all loot comes from the end boss, which includes new legendary gems that you can level up. To access these rifts, we have to complete a normal rift at Torment difficulty level; bosses can drop a stone that gives access to plane of trials, where you get assigned a starting rift based on how well you do against waves of enemies. My best hero got given a rift level of 1, which I managed to beat in order to get level 2... by contrast one youtuber got dropped straight into rift level 27!

 

Forgetting the silly plot, I still find Diablo III a fun game for spurts of an hour or so. The rift stuff needs the reaper of souls expansion, but given that I've put in 230+ hours over the last couple of years, I didn't mind paying an extra $40 for the expansion (which unlocks adventure mode, great with hardcore characters!)

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So now I am playing this game on Xbox One. I know most folks here don't have that platform but if you do feel free to add me (gt SilentBtAmazing). It is really fun, my favorite version (I also play on PC sometimes).

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I finished this game (Xbox One version) on the weekend.

 

There is a slow, depressing slip from ‘this is exciting’ to ‘I am doing nothing but holding down a button to see pretty colours’. That takes about 5 hours then there is a grinding, tedious trip to complete the game in another 15 hours. I’ve never been so non-plussed by a title that radiates this much polish. You can see the development budget oozing from every festering pore of the demon spawn you kill  but it is ultimately pointless; you press the same three buttons and wait for cool-downs so that you can then press the same three buttons again. It is mindless, repetitive and shocking that the equipment management is the most consistently interesting thing in this botched, pseudo-MMO. All the extra content seems to just be about replaying areas you have already done before but with the added ‘adventure’ of having to kill a certain number of enemies - dialled in doesn’t even start to describe it.

 

The story line is utter bobbins too with a bunch of ridiculously named people going on about nothing you actually care about as they try and trope an already clichéd fantasy world into the ground as you search for endless Mcguffins and rescue another damsel in distress.

 

The Multiplayer makes it so that at least you can laugh at how mind-numbingly rubbish the game is.

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I finished this game (Xbox One version) on the weekend.

 

There is a slow, depressing slip from ‘this is exciting’ to ‘I am doing nothing but holding down a button to see pretty colours’. That takes about 5 hours then there is a grinding, tedious trip to complete the game in another 15 hours. I’ve never been so non-plussed by a title that radiates this much polish. You can see the development budget oozing from every festering pore of the demon spawn you kill  but it is ultimately pointless; you press the same three buttons and wait for cool-downs so that you can then press the same three buttons again. It is mindless, repetitive and shocking that the equipment management is the most consistently interesting thing in this botched, pseudo-MMO. All the extra content seems to just be about replaying areas you have already done before but with the added ‘adventure’ of having to kill a certain number of enemies - dialled in doesn’t even start to describe it.

 

The story line is utter bobbins too with a bunch of ridiculously named people going on about nothing you actually care about as they try and trope an already clichéd fantasy world into the ground as you search for endless Mcguffins and rescue another damsel in distress.

 

The Multiplayer makes it so that at least you can laugh at how mind-numbingly rubbish the game is.

 

Picked it up this weekend on PS4, expecting it to be every bit as grindy and boring as you described.  I'm gonna be super stressed about work for the next couple of months, so what better way than to get a game that allows me to turn off my brain!  :)

 

What difficulty did you play the game on, twmac?  I had heard that "expert" was the difficulty to start with, and have been finding combat at that level to feel like a fun dance of movement, placement and timing.  (Then again, I haven't hit requisite 5-hour marker where things got boring for you). 

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Maybe they have tuned it a bit better for the consoles, but when I stuck it on expert, the enemies became sponges and while there was a risk in dying, it was utterly boring to watch my dude bash an enemy for 30 hits until it went down.

 

I put it down after my post above and never picked it up again, with all the recent console talk, maybe it's time to give it a shot again. 

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Yeah Expert is much too easy after the first few hours if you get any useful Legendaries at all. My only complaint about the game in terms of difficulty is I think they should unlock the various difficulties all right at the beginning. The last few hours on the toughest unlocked difficulty were too easy. That said I really do think the main game is after that playthrough, in Adventure Mode chasing Legs and Keys. I get that it's not for everyone but I really like these types of games and think Diablo 3 on PS4 and Xbone is one of the best executions of the genre.

Btw my rule of thumb is that if a regular enemy takes more than three hits to kill, it's time to drop the difficulty. Think of the system as being time-based rather than number-based and it makes more sense.

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I finished this game (Xbox One version) on the weekend.

 

While I'll grant that you may personally be finished with the game, I can say with certainty that you haven't finished it in a weekend.

 

The game isn't "beaten" by completing acts 1 through 5. That's just how you unlock the rest of the game. It's meant to be played for however long you want to play it, for whatever goals you set for yourself.

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Btw my rule of thumb is that if a regular enemy takes more than three hits to kill, it's time to drop the difficulty. Think of the system as being time-based rather than number-based and it makes more sense.

 

Yeah, that's a pretty solid rule of thumb.  You should be able to pretty easily rip through many of the regular mobs in the right difficulty for you.  Tuning the difficulty so that you have to really work on regular enemies means the tuning is going to be such that blues and yellows take forever to kill, not to mention that blue and yellow enemy damage output is going to be absurd unless you've gone very heavy on defense.

 

Another thing to keep in mind that you might need to move difficulty around as you play, since enemies are tuned to your level while your damage and survivability are tied more to your gear.  Some bad luck with the RNG while leveling can mean you can go from a level 25 that's geared to survive Torment 1 to a level 29 geared only for Master.  Just drop the difficulty, and if you get that incredible drop that makes things easy again, just jump out and back in to raise the difficulty back up.

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While I'll grant that you may personally be finished with the game, I can say with certainty that you haven't finished it in a weekend.

 

The game isn't "beaten" by completing acts 1 through 5. That's just how you unlock the rest of the game. It's meant to be played for however long you want to play it, for whatever goals you set for yourself.

 I think our definitions are different.

 

All five Acts are done, the arc of the 'story' is complete and I have seen the credits - that is beaten. Now if you want to talk about it being completed, I am not even close.

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Picked it up this weekend on PS4, expecting it to be every bit as grindy and boring as you described.  I'm gonna be super stressed about work for the next couple of months, so what better way than to get a game that allows me to turn off my brain!   :)

 

What difficulty did you play the game on, twmac?  I had heard that "expert" was the difficulty to start with, and have been finding combat at that level to feel like a fun dance of movement, placement and timing.  (Then again, I haven't hit requisite 5-hour marker where things got boring for you). 

 

I played it on Expert. Mainly with a friend

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 I think our definitions are different.

 

All five Acts are done, the arc of the 'story' is complete and I have seen the credits - that is beaten. Now if you want to talk about it being completed, I am not even close.

 

Oh they're absolutely different. For me this would be akin to saying finishing the tutorial and winning a match of DOTA is having "beaten" the game.

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This is the one I subscribe to:

 

http://www.backloggery.com/games.php?user=twmacb&status=2

 

"Beaten - The main objective has been accomplished. Usually marked by the defeat of a final boss and/or viewing of credits. You've stormed the castle, rescued the prisoners, and saved the universe from the clutches of an unspeakable evil. Consider yourself a hero! Some games don't have that obvious climax, but you can usually find some goal to reach before it is beaten."

 

You cannot compare Diablo III (a game with a defined 'story' arc) to DOTA (a multiplayer game). That would be like telling me that I haven't 'beaten' Gears of War 3 because I haven't dropped hundreds of hours into all the multiplayer modes and that to say I have beaten GoW with only the single player content would be like saying I had 'beaten' Awesomenauts.

 

Sorry to get tetchy here, because I used to say 'I've completed this game' and people used to arch an eyebrow. On that particular point I conceded because completed is to have exhausted a game of content. So I settled on 'Beat' as a short hand for 'saw to its natural conclusion' in the same way that I feel that I have seen Dark Souls to its natural conclusion.

 

I am not finding another short hand for this Badfinger - I refuse!

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I understand it's mostly just semantics. However, I absolutely can compare Diablo (a long form multiplayer ARTS) with DOTA!

 

The best way I can find to compare them is that for the people who are into them the most, they aren't game they play. It's THE game they play. They're games you get together with 3 or 4 people (often strangers) to make progress towards an common goal as a group. It's a game that's never over, so you play it in sessions.

 

For better or worse, the game is nearly explicitly designed around the premise that Acts 1 through 5 are an extended tutorial, and that much of the interesting content is after you have unlocked adventure mode and hit level 70. It's intended to be played to an indeterminate conclusion for as long as you can create challenges for yourself. With patch 2.1 some of those like increasing rift difficulty are now fully laid out rather than implied.

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A game with a 20 hour tutorial?

 

Didn't Final Fantasy XIII do that and everyone called it a piece of shit?

 

I am joking of course (apart from FFXIII being shit).

 

I see how you are bending your comparison for it to work. I would argue that I know people that don't consider Plants versus Zombies/Dark Souls a game they play but the game they play that they set themselves new challenges, with updated patches that have introduced new challenges. At the same time there is still a substantial and rewarding campaign you can beat and a satisfying conclusion.

 

Diablo III has a substantial campaign and conclusion that you can beat.

 

DOTA does not have that and does not have that structure.

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I saw the credits of Diablo 3 twice. I have beaten that game twice. I will never complete that game, as it contains randomly generated elements and is therefor un-complete-able. If a game has credits and I've seen them, that game is beaten (barring an epilogue chapter or something, see: Red Dead Redemption). Requiring more than that for someone to say they've beaten a game strikes me as saying that unless someone has watched every special feature and the director's cut and found all of the bonus online content, they haven't REALLY seen a movie. That line of thinking is bullshit elitism to me. If that's how you like to enjoy content, that's fine, but don't require it of me. I saw the credits, enjoyed the journey, and now I've got other shit to do. I beat that game, and I'm moving on. I enjoy that I can (and do!) go back to Diablo 3 for a quick bit of monster-killing every now and then, but that's bonus content, just like going back to complete more areas in Just Cause 2 is bonus content after all the missions and side-quests have been done, or going back to Assassin's Creed to find the last few collectibles. Game is beaten.

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Requiring more than that for someone to say they've beaten a game strikes me as saying that unless someone has watched every special feature and the director's cut and found all of the bonus online content, they haven't REALLY seen a movie. That line of thinking is bullshit elitism to me. 

 

I agree that it's bullshit elitism if you demand more than that generally, but I don't think this analogy holds for every game. Fez is the best example of a game where I truly believe the "real" part starts after credits roll. Diablo 3 is a softer example, but there are definitely mechanics that you either don't explore or only barely scratch the surface of before the first completion of the story campaign. 

 

I dunno if it's a GOOD thing that these games put so much of themselves after "The End", but I don't think it's unreasonable or elitist to consider these specific games unfinished at that point.

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I saw the credits of Diablo 3 twice. I have beaten that game twice. I will never complete that game, as it contains randomly generated elements and is therefor un-complete-able. If a game has credits and I've seen them, that game is beaten (barring an epilogue chapter or something, see: Red Dead Redemption). Requiring more than that for someone to say they've beaten a game strikes me as saying that unless someone has watched every special feature and the director's cut and found all of the bonus online content, they haven't REALLY seen a movie. That line of thinking is bullshit elitism to me. If that's how you like to enjoy content, that's fine, but don't require it of me. I saw the credits, enjoyed the journey, and now I've got other shit to do. I beat that game, and I'm moving on. I enjoy that I can (and do!) go back to Diablo 3 for a quick bit of monster-killing every now and then, but that's bonus content, just like going back to complete more areas in Just Cause 2 is bonus content after all the missions and side-quests have been done, or going back to Assassin's Creed to find the last few collectibles. Game is beaten.

 

 

First off, you don't need my permission (or anyone's) to tell you when you're "actually" done this or any game. Second, my stupid semantic argument was about the word "finished". The game has adventure mode right on the mode select screen. This isn't an elitism argument, these aren't hidden features, this isn't getting 106% completion on both castles or whatever. If all you do in Diablo is play Acts 1 through 5, you literally have only played half the game modes available on the options screen in a game whose design philosophy is the campaign is your appetizer to the rest of the game.

 

Like I said, I can understand completely that one would be finished with Diablo 3 (I have been finished with it multiple times over the last 2 years only to return), but not that you "have finished". The introduction of seasonal play has reinforced that design philosophy even more. I'm not chastising anyone for not playing more Diablo. I think it's a good game, but I've quit it enough times to understand it's eminently quittable. This is just the long form way of saying there is a hell of a lot more game in this game than calling it a day after beating all 5 acts.

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Okay, sorry if the last post of mine was insulting I was not trying to incite elitism accusations. After having read more of your arguments though I now think that your definition of 'beat' is wrong.

 

I can see how you argue your case for Diablo but then this means that Eternal Sonata, Nier, Dark Souls II - none of these can be considered 'beat' until you have done multiple playthroughs (even though you will have seen credits and come to a conclusion) and that is patently you looking for something different in a game. The comparison with DOTA continues not to work because the main mode is the multiplayer - if you wanted to rename campaign 'tutorial' then I would then agree with you but that isn't Blizzard's intent either.

 

To use your analogy - the campaign is not an appetiser - the Adventure mode is the dessert and After Eight mint. The reason for this is all the mechanics will be available to you before then and the enemies and modes are familiar but you get to refine the experience (if you want to).

 

Also - half the game modes - isn't Adventure mode new to Reaper of Souls?

 

Anyway - please don't take this as me trying to be insulting, I am enjoying arguing the definitions of this.

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My aunt would take issue with someone claiming they beat solitare because they saw the end cinematic.

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