So, this "GTA 4" thing then...

[miffy495]

Friends all give you a different benefit. Here's the rundown if you're interested:

Roman will let you call one of his cabs to you whenever you want.

Little Jacob will sell you weapons at a heavy discount.

Brucie will give you helicopter rides around the city from any heliport to any other.

Dwayne will give you a pair of friends to come along with you and provide backup if you want.

Packie will give you car bombs that you can activate by dialing a phone number. (there's one mission that involves these so you'll know how to use them)

Also, I believe that there are a few different girlfriends you can meet through the internet dating site who will give you different benefits. Health boosts, star removal, etc. That kind of thing. Haven't done that part though, so I can't speak from experience.

At the very least, if you have Dwayne as a friend ([bIG SPOILER]and he's alive) I'd get him to the "like" level as his benefit can come in handy on some harder missions. Jacob's is useful too if you go through ammo as rapidly as I do. Packie's is just plain fun. Roman and Brucie are unneccessary unless you really want that achievement, although I think Roman is over 90% by default so it's not such a big deal.

EDIT: Nachimir posted while I was writing, but I'll add on top of what he said as well. The reason I left Francis out of my list was that after you complete the story mode the benefit goes away. He also doesn't count as a friend on the game's list. Francis' trick is handy (I'd assume, I made the other choice) but if you really need it there's a girlfriend with the same ability who you can continue to call on after completing the story.

[toblix]

But how does the "likeness" level work? Do I have to constantly keep them liking me, so that I have to choose and focus on who I want to keep happy and who I don't care about? Can I lose friends permanently?

[Nachimir]

Every time you take one of them out, their "like" percentage increases, and all of them are shown in your game stats. If you take them to do something they really like, their percentage jumps up quite fast.

Every time you snub someone, it goes down, but only by 2 - 3%. I'm most of the way through the game, and only had one dip to around 85 or more from 100. It's not difficult to get them up to the point of giving you favours, but it is a bit tedious and once Niko makes a bunch of friends they do ring the phone to ask you if you fancy doing something. It's kind of annoying, but only in a "having to reject a call every so often" way.

[Erkki]

Aargh. I'm on the last mission (I think) and it's a real piece of shit.

Forcing you to make some blind jumps on a bike (or face failure) right after a long shooting sequence, then giving you an option to restart the sequence from nearer than normal, but with reduced health and ammo. Seems like a shitty way to end this game.

[miffy495]

Yeah, that is the last mission. I think I posted about it in aggravation a couple of pages back in this thread as well.

This spoiler is about part of the last mission, not a story spoiler. Just fyi.

Making the bike jump is significantly easier than the helicopter dogfight that follows. Make sure you do the mission in the daytime so you can actually see what the hell you're doing when you pull it off. The first time I got to that point in the middle of the night and couldn't even determine what I was supposed to be firing at as it was too bloody dark.

[Erkki]

This spoiler is about part of the last mission, not a story spoiler. Just fyi.

Making the bike jump is significantly easier than the helicopter dogfight that follows.

Actually for me that part was easier, but I could have just gotten lucky, or maybe the game turned down the difficulty because I had failed so much (it sometimes does that).

[Giebelhouse]

Unless you're chasing 100%, dating the girl you meet on Craplist is a complete waste of time. Her 'special' ability is...

...cheaper clothes. Which is irrelevant since Niko has so much money and nothing to spend it on other than weapons and hats.

[Erkki]

I finished the main story yesterday, now I'm just trying out some of the optional stuff that I mostly skipped on earlier, like keeping friends happy. Although, I guess there is even less incentive to do it now, since the bonuses won't be as useful.

Also, I think I'll play some more San Andreas again soon, for comparison.

If I'd have to give a score, I'd give it something between 9 and 9.5. It's a brilliant game, and almost everything was upgraded to "next gen" and a lot of detail was added; things that were more separate earlier were more integrated this time, with the cell phone playing a big part in that.

However, I feel that the meat of the game, the missions, didn't really see improvement and perhaps were even a step backwards. Yes, the combat gameplay is a lot better with the help of the cover system and better aiming, but the way the missions were set up and structured seemed exactly like earlier games and, I think, had even less variety than Vice City and San Andreas. There were occasional exceptions to this -- for example

the mission where you kidnapped that girl

-- but for the first time in a GTA game I really felt like I was mostly driving from A to B and getting into a firefight at site B. This complaint has been brought up against the series earlier, but I never really felt it until now.

Of course, it could be just me -- maybe I'm just getting tired of this formula, having played and enjoyed all of the GTA games so far. On the other hand, all the added depth and detail in this game, which is unprecedented for a sandbox game, got me thinking if it isn't time for the appearance of sandbox games with completely different themes. Frankly, I don't think shooting is the most interesting thing to be done in this type of game. I would love to see a GTA-like game that focused on something else entirely and didn't have any weapons at all.

[Erkki]

Heh, I've played for over 40 hours, the stats say my favourite radio is Liberty Rock, but I'm still hearing new songs on that station. The total amount of music in the game must be insane.

[Cigol]

Erkki I see you've edited your previous (vs San Andreas) post? I've not yet completed GTA4 (I'm up to the point involving the Italian mobster Jimmy) but I'm finding myself drawn to your original argument more and more. I'm reserving judgement until I finally see the end credits however, just in case.

[Erkki]

Erkki I see you've edited your previous (vs San Andreas) post? I've not yet completed GTA4 (I'm up to the point involving the Italian mobster Jimmy) but I'm finding myself drawn to your original argument more and more. I'm reserving judgement until I finally see the end credits however, just in case.

Yeah, I don't stand by that paragraph exactly any more, but I still partially think that. I wasn't able to find the right words to say exactly how, so I left that part out of the edit. I guess I'll post more thoughts later after letting it soak in for a bit and maybe watching some cutscenes again (if they can be found online or something).

[Nachimir]

There are already torrents around of the radio stations, though they're fairly poor quality rips, it seems taken from audio piped out of a running copy. some of the stations have 19 or so tracks, and it seems the game mixes them with slightly random adverts and bits of DJ talk.

At the moment, I'm still staggered by by the art direction and visual depth of it, but the missions are feeling really tired. The ones that make me smile, like

lugging a coffin or bodies around

are essentially repeats of similar missions from earlier GTA games. I'm nearly 40 hours in and can only take it in small doses. Though the

jogging in middle park folled by the Faggio chase made me laugh

Staggered that, with that kind of playtime under my belt, still only have quite an abstract mental map of the city. By this time in GTA 3 I knew that version of Liberty city like the back of my hand.

[miffy495]

Yeah, but did you memorize San Andreas either? I find that if I boot up LCS or VCS on the PSP I can navigate either city incredibly easily and know exactly where everything is thanks to my time with the earlier versions of each game. Even after playing through SA's story twice though, I still have very little idea how to get around (for example) downtown Los Santos or western San Fierro. To contrast, I don't know Alderney too well, but the 4 buroughs I have at least a decent grasp of.

[Tommy Gun]

There are already torrents around of the radio stations, though they're fairly poor quality rips, it seems taken from audio piped out of a running copy. some of the stations have 19 or so tracks, and it seems the game mixes them with slightly random adverts and bits of DJ talk.

Whoa, someone had fun naming all of these files. I was hoping someone would do this -- I rushed through the game and really didn't get to listen to the stations (and even if I hadn't rushed, you still only hear pieces). I don't have a 360 in my room, so unless I wanted to just pause the game and sit for hours in my living room....

EDIT:

Other Info: In July of 2007, Rockstar sent out an e-mail to their mailing list subscribers advertising an opportunity to get on the radio in the game. The e-mail included a link to a website with more information. On the website, it was explained that anyone could call a phone number provided and leave a message complaining about America. Select messages would be chosen and would appear on the political talk station WKTT in the final build of the game.

Holy shit that's awesome! I so would have called if I had known about that!

[ThunderPeel2001]

Man, that's so cool, I wish I'd known, too. I only just learned this, but apparently Juliette Lewis is the DJ on Radio Broker...!? Wow! I need to listen more carefully...

[Tommy Gun]

Yep, I read that in the manual. And actually, the guy for the station I was referring to is from SNL:

WKTT - We Know The Truth

Program: Richard Bastion Show

Host: Richard Bastion (Portrayed by Jason Sudeikis)

Topics: Right Wing Political Talk Radio

[Nachimir]

Yeah, but did you memorize San Andreas either?

Good point, I knew San Andreas less than LC or VC. I did have a better grasp of SA than the new LC though (nearly 40 hours spent in GTA IV now); I only played through it once but can still remember a lot of locations and how they relate to each other for some reason (On that note, my boss and I were walking around San Francisco in February, recognising fragments of it from San Fierro ).

Perhaps because the three cities in SA are so visually different to each other I found them easier to parse. Maybe because of the lower level of detail. I don't know.

In SA I generally always knew roughly where I was and how to get to wherever else, but in GTA IV I can get lost and so often see completely new places. I'm not complaining about it

[Scrobbs]

We managed to get Bad Man killed on his first given mission - does he offer anything worthwhile?

[miffy495]

You can get Badman killed? That just added a whole other layer of awesome to the game. I'm not sure exactly what he offers. I had him on a couple of missions with Little Jacob and ran into him once as a street event in upper Algonquin. If you have any other encounters with him after that, I haven't seen them.

Also, I just noticed the Trailer Park Boys signature. Right on, man. I didn't realize it was watched all that widely outside of Canada.

[Scrobbs]

Yeh, man TPB is ace. I was shown it a few months ago, watched series 3 in one sitting. Now seen the film, series 1,2,3, have got 7 (not watched), with 4,5,6 on the way. Bubbles is an absolute legend. It's bloody funny.

Bad man showed up as a friend on the map, he was minding his own on a park bench. He needed some help with some russian gangsters in the area of the city you go early on in the game to deal with faustin's daughter's biker friends. They were in an alley, and in cover behind bins, so we ran around the side of the building to take them in the rear (oo-er). Bad man, like a fucking DICK, couldn't bear to be far from us (as with all folks following) so ran straight through the middle of the firefight. He died in 2 seconds flat. The twat.

[miffy495]

Yeah, he lived through that with me, but I still haven't seen him since.

[Thrik]

I noticed I wasn't learning the map at all because I was constantly using the GPS (being able to add waypoints is great). I've tried to force myself to rely on it less though, and now I'm using my own guidance I'm starting to grasp the layout better based on landmarks.

Maybe some of you have the same problem.

[Erkki]

Try going back to something like San Andreas after you've played GTA IV for a good few hours--it's almost primitive by comparison if you ask me.

You're right. I just played some SA and it seems really primitive. Also, it doesn't help that there's an issue with AMD Dual Core processors and although it could be fixed partially, I still have some weird things, like farther away cars moving faster than normal etc.

[ThunderPeel2001]

I noticed I wasn't learning the map at all because I was constantly using the GPS (being able to add waypoints is great). I've tried to force myself to rely on it less though, and now I'm using my own guidance I'm starting to grasp the layout better based on landmarks.

Maybe some of you have the same problem.

It's annoying, really, but I'm usually so focussed on the little map that I'll slam into a cop car and spend the next ten minutes evading the police. It would be better to get a good idea of the layout, but I don't think that's going to happen unless I take the time out to really learn the map properly.

I don't know why the didn't use the waypoint system from the races - that would allow you to learn where you were going without taking your eyes off the road. (Did anyone notice that glaringly missing waypoint during the race, btw? A big "sharp left" wasn't there, which was pretty annoying!)

Also

I lost my comet from the race! Can I get it back anywhere else? I loved that car!

[Wrestlevania]

You're right. I just played some SA and it seems really primitive. Also, it doesn't help that there's an issue with AMD Dual Core processors and although it could be fixed partially, I still have some weird things, like farther away cars moving faster than normal etc.

Thanks for backing me up, Erkki; I really appreciate it.

I think once the dust's settled, and the "anti-cool-cool" press gets ahold of itself (but not in the typical way *fap-fap*), I think more people will realise just how much of a leap GTA IV is for videogaming.

It is not the same tree with new tinsel and baubles, and this shallow, fundamentally flawed analogy - which certain parties insist on perpetuating in the deluded idea that simply being different via a few big words makes them better - completely misses the point. Which makes me genuinely sad and angry on Rockstar's behalf.

Regardless of all the stupid, juvenile and deliberately nihilistic things Rockstar might be guilty of; regardless of all the money spent making this and advertising the game; they have genuinely tried so hard, and poured so much obvious love and care into it, to make this such a fundamentally different Video game experience for everyone. I truly believe they've achieved it too--and perhaps beyond even what they hoped would be possible.

"We now return to regular, grumpy, frothing Wrestlevania..."