Movie/TV recommendations

[Nachimir]

You weren't, and it could partially explain it: http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/faq/

1/ I noticed a helicopter shadow in The Shining, is this a mistake?

"This is probably the single most often-asked and most irritating question to recur over and over again on alt.movies.kubrick.

The opening titles of The Shining consist of long, dreamlike, sweeping shots of the Rocky Mountains, as Kubrick explained to Michel Ciment (1): "It was important to establish an ominous mood during Jack's first drive up to the hotel -- the vast isolation and eerie splendour of high mountains, and the narrow, winding roads which would become impassable after heavy snow."

The helicopter footage was filmed by Greg McGillivray and Kubrick was apparently very pleased with his work: "He spent several weeks filming some of the most beautiful mountain helicopter shots I've seen." While the grace and scope of these shots is hypnotic, there is a moment, just before a low fly-by pass of the yellow VW car, where the shadow of the helicopter filming the scene is clearly visible in the lower right hand corner of the picture.

So, why is this such a hot topic on the newsgroup? Kubrick has a reputation as a perfectionist, and this is something of a very apparent gaffe. It's generated no end of commentary, mostly facetious, as to why Kubrick had "clearly" left the shot in. Some say that, if the film was projected through a widescreen gate (2) - as it would be in a cinema - the shadow would not be visible, although members of amk have refuted this. For instance Mark Ervin noticed the shadow on The Shining's third showing at Mann's Chinese Theater May 23, 1980 and he has "never failed to see it since."

It carries on, with quotes from people who edited it. Basically there are several ways it could have crept in, from tweaking frames late in the editing process, to cinemas projecting at the wrong aspect ratio.

[ThunderPeel2001]

You weren't, and it could partially explain it: http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/faq/

It carries on, with quotes from people who edited it. Basically there are several ways it could have crept in, from tweaking frames late in the editing process, to cinemas projecting at the wrong aspect ratio.

Interesting! So is it visible on the new remastered DVD (the widescreen one)?

[Nachimir]

No idea I'm afraid. Somehow, I have never even seen the film, only read the book

[Kolzig]

Last weekend we watched a few movies.

After ten years since last seeing The Exorcist, it's still as effective as it was when I first saw it. This one was the Director's cut that came out in 2000 or 1999. I've had it for years on dvd, but I guess it was waiting for the right moment.

I really love the older movies that don't use computer graphics at all. All the scenes are really effective when you see the true work of art that the cast and crew have done in the movie and not some five cent CGI.

Linda Blair is simply perfect in her role as Regan, I am not surprised that she got an Oscar nomination for the role in 1974. Max von Sydow's role as Merrin in the end is relatively short, but he delivers his acting with such power and effect that I would've given him an Oscar and all the other major trophies for the role.

I want to watch the movie with William Friedkin's commentary. I've never done that before and I usually have problems watching commentaries because I'm a bit lazy.

The other movies we watched were Se7en by David Fincher, and both versions of Willy Wonka and Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.

I had seen the Burton version couple of times before, but my wife had not. We watched first the original 70's version starring Gene Wilder and afterwards the Burton version. Both of us agreed immediately after watching these that the original is the superior version in all possible ways.

I'm losing faith in Tim Burton, he used to be one of my favourite directors, but he is making quite a lot of shit these days. Planet of the Apes, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, Alice in Wonderland... all remakes. One big problem with Burton's movies the days is that he just seems to be really lazy and is using the green screen all the time.

I have not seen Big Fish or Sweeney Todd yet for some reason, but his recent record doesn't look good.

But to get back to the Willy Wonka, Gene Wilder was really unique as Wonka. The scenes were he starts to go a bit crazy are wonderful to look at. Johnny Depp is of course being Johnny in the new one and he is actually the only interesting thing about the new movie. I seriously have a problem with Helena Bonham-Carter beíng in every Burton movie. Come on, you don't need to put your wife in every movie just because she is your wife.

I liked a lot the first movie where Wonka got mad at Charlie for using the bubble drink even though he said don't touch anything. Even though I believe it is so that the first movie basically took a lot more freedom from the original book by changing some scenes, like the scene I wrote. The new one is really not as good in my opinion, I think he made for example Wonka's daddy issue thing totally from thin air.

Se7en I had never seen before.

Kevin Spacey was the best in this movie, really scary guy.

It was a two hour movie, but didn't feel it took that long, the movie went really quickly as it really pulled you in to the sick world of John Doe.

At the end my wife was saying "I was thinking all the time, I hope it's not the wife's head in the box, I really hope not."

The dvd is full packed with all kinds of extras, I usually have a hard time going through and listening to the commentary tracks of movies, even though originally when I started collecting dvd's about 10 years ago, I tried to hunt always the best dvd version of each movie with the most extras. This one has four commentary tracks and lots of other extras. I did watch the alternative ending which was clearly not as good as the one in the final movie. I get why they wanted to chance it after test screening.

[toblix]

The dvd is full packed with all kinds of extras, I usually have a hard time going through and listening to the commentary tracks of movies, even though originally when I started collecting dvd's about 10 years ago, I tried to hunt always the best dvd version of each movie with the most extras.

This is exactly what happened to me too. I started out watching all the extras I could come across, but I think I got so disappointed by how promo-y most of it was that I stopped at one point. I've probably missed a lot of sweet extras because of that.

What was the alternative ending?

[ThunderPeel2001]

What was the alternative ending?

It's a live kitten in the box.

[Hermie]

It's a live kitten in the box.

Schroedinger?

[Rueler]

I finally saw One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest, with a young Jack Nicholson. I definitely can't believe I waited this long to watch it; easily recommended. It is a very sad movie though.

I also watched The Machinist, a kind of psychological thriller starring Christian Bale. Apparently Bale lost a LOT of weight for this movie, because he was SCARILY thin. I definitely liked it also.

Both movies are on Netflix instant.

[Joflar]

I have not seen Big Fish or Sweeney Todd yet for some reason, but his recent record doesn't look good.

I thought Big Fish was pretty good, it was mostly light-hearted fun and the ending was touching. Haven't seen Sweeney Todd

[Garple]

Sweeny Todd is great. It's just kooky enough for such an off-kilter tale, but the performances are engrossing and the fake old london is gorgeous. I really want to re-watch it (to see how good it must look on bluray).

I finally saw Heat. It was great. What other Michael Mann movies are essential viewing? The only other one I've seen is Collateral (also excellent).

Also watched the original Assault on Precinct 13. Sort of a cross between Night of the Living Dead and The Warriors, in that it's about a group of people trapped in a building by a huge of hostiles and trying to hold them off, but instead of zombies it's B-Movie gang members. "They delivered the cholo!" I didn't think it was great, although certainly watchable and there's a certain early scene that's a real punch to the gut, and as always, John Carpenter's score is beyond awesome.

[Murdoc]

I finally saw Heat. It was great. What other Michael Mann movies are essential viewing? The only other one I've seen is Collateral (also excellent).

.

Just saw Heat? Damn I'm envious. I liked Collateral, but thought that was a pretty low level movie for Mann.

Essentials according to me:

Miami Vice (Tv: executive producer, but important note in his history)

Miami Vice (movie: completely understated, but basically staying true to the tv series while updating the detective action movie genre)

Manhunter (awesome.)

Public Enemies (I've mentioned this, its not so much the story, but the awesome experiments in cinemetography going on)

Last of the Mohicans (Not a huge fan of his period peices and this is totally the most typical hollywood movie he has made, but it has aspects of his regular stuff I enjoy)

[Nevsky]

I liked Sweeney Todd as a piece of visual eye-candy, but I didn't like the actual musical much at all.

I take exception with complaints over Tim Burton 'casting his wife' in each of his movies. I mean, I would, because Helena Bonham Carter just happens to be the best British actress of her generation*. Perhaps he's monopolising her time a little, but I always think she brings something to her roles - which are mostly supporting characters anyway.

*Controversial - and wildly subjective - statement, I know, but it's between her, Tilda Swinton and Emma Thompson.

[miffy495]

Sweeny Todd and Big Fish are actually the only recent Burton movies I've liked. I agree about his other stuff, but I'd still suggest giving those two a chance.

[Kolzig]

I also watched The Machinist, a kind of psychological thriller starring Christian Bale. Apparently Bale lost a LOT of weight for this movie, because he was SCARILY thin. I definitely liked it also.

You have to really appreciate Christian Bale's work on this one as I think he was working on Batman Begins and then this one or the other way around.

In one his scarily thin guy that weighs nothing and in other one his a really muscled weightlifter type. You really put your body in health in danger for just a couple of movies.

[brkl]

I think he's addicted to it. He did The Machinist before Batman Begins, then Rescue Dawn before The Dark Knight. I respected him for The Machinist, but then I began to suspect he's a nutter.

[James]

I just saw Four Lions. I was worried I was going to miss it, so I decided to watch it on my own on the way home from work. I really liked it, which was a relief, since I wasn't too sure what to expect, and the trailer didn't quite do it for me. It may have helped that I was in a nearly empty screen, so my own reaction wasn't too tainted by everyone else's -_ apparently some people have been in hysterics throughout, even during the more tragic scenes, which could be quite off-putting, and impose a degree of tastelessness and exploitation which I don't think is actually present in the film. Of course, the film treads fully intentionally on very sensitive ground (mixed metaphor, anyone?), but it never seemed to me as though it was doing so crassly. There were grim gags, but they all served to drive home the personal tragedy. That's not to say it was miserable, either. I can definitely understand differing reactions to it, but I thought it was pretty great.

[Ben X]

I was trying not to think of this yesterday, because it started to make my head hurt, but yeah, in the sequels it goes out the window. So much so that you have weird bits like how Old Biff can go back in time to give Young 50s Biff the Almanac, yet he then returns to an unchanged 'There's something wrong with your kids!' future, where Marty, Jennifer and Doc are farcing around. It's only once they go back to 1985 that history has changed.

So it seems that anyone who has even touched the Delorean becomes unaffected by the shifts of history.

No, Old Biff returns to the future and it changes around him, Marty and the other time-travellers. You/they don't really notice, as they're far out in the suburbs. The bttf.com forums used to have a load of interviews with Bob Gale where he explains all this, but they just got hit by a virus. Why the fuck do hackers attack harmless sites like these? Aren't they supposed to be fighting evil mega-corporations or Fisher Stevens or something?

[Sleepdance]

I just saw 'Big river man'. This movie is acctualy funny, even if it doesn't intend to be. Watch it and don't read anything about it. It will be bigger suprise than District 9 was.

[ThunderPeel2001]

Just saw The Apartment. WOW. What a movie

BBX, yeah, I seem to remember there being more police or some sounds of rioting or something, as Marty and Doc are leaving. Very subtle, but a nice detail.

[Kolzig]

Rewatched both Toy Story movies this weekend with my wife as we are going to see in July the third one in Japan in an IMAX 3D theater. It's going to be my first time in an IMAX theater.

Both movies are really good, I especially like first Toy Story, I can't believe that it's from 1995, time flies so fast, but the movie still looks amazing. I did not remember that Joss Whedon was part of making the script for that one. No wonder the movie is so good and the dialogue is so snappy. Also executive producer in that one is Mr. RDF himself Steve Jobs when he was still at Pixar.

Pixar just seems to be the only company that can make computer animated movie the right way. I'm a big supporter for traditional hand painted animation, but there's something special about these Pixar movies.

I think it's because you guys continuously talked about BttF trilogy, I had to go on saturday and buy the whole set for 9,99€. It was about time I got that to my collection. Started watching some of the extras immediately. The old original trailer for the first movie is really funny.

[ThunderPeel2001]

Pixar just seems to be the only company that can make computer animated movie the right way. I'm a big supporter for traditional hand painted animation, but there's something special about these Pixar movies.

Wha...? Oh no! Oh shit! RUN FOR COVER!!!!

I think it's because you guys continuously talked about BttF trilogy, I had to go on saturday and buy the whole set for 9,99€. It was about time I got that to my collection. Started watching some of the extras immediately. The old original trailer for the first movie is really funny.

There's an extra on the set that quite upset me: As a joke, Michael J. Fox plays dresses up and plays Marty "like a Mexican". Yeah. For reals.

[syntheticgerbil]

Pixar just seems to be the only company that can make computer animated movie the right way. I'm a big supporter for traditional hand painted animation, but there's something special about these Pixar movies.

Although I'm really not a fan of Pixar and I find them growing more stale and boring with every passing year, I'll agree with this. I can't think of any CG film US or International that is anywhere as solid as your average Pixar film. Too bad while they once were good at pushing the envelope, they've halted and even have gone backwards.

But I don't expect them to do much in the way of experimentation or push new styles or creators anymore after the Disney buyout. I think the time is ripe for a new up and coming company to wow the pants off everyone. Certainly the technology is cheap enough now that a small team that knows what they are doing can look better than the average farting animal 3D movie.

[Murdoc]

Pixar just seems to be the only company that can make computer animated movie the right way. I'm a big supporter for traditional hand painted animation, but there's something special about these Pixar movies.

Agreed, I think there are a lot of companies out there that can achieve a visual style that is very comparible, but what Pixar does best is well crafted stories and editing. Not to mention their voice acting is leagues above anyone elses. They can take some two bit, no name actor and they can be perfect in a Pixar film.

I especially enjoy Toy Story 1 more to the second(though it's really good) simply because it was a bit more "mature" with a few dark jokes and moments that had kind of an edge comparative to the next. I remember seeing the breakdown for the original concept where Woody was a bugsy malone type puppet and it was supposed to be really sadistic... glad they went the route they ended up in.

I'm cautiously optomistic for Toy Story 3... I really hate 3d, but I'm sure it'll be great. However, the original synoposis I saw of the story during my time at Disney years back was honestly the saddest god damn story I've ever seen(meaning great story that was sad not that it was so bad it was sad).

While the plot from the trailers seem to have stayed the same from the synop, I don't get that sense gravity from the trailer. But again, it's pixar, who the hell knows what'll be until going in.

I also cannot disagree with gerbils opinion about Pixar anymore heartidly then to leave it at this paragaph. I fear if I tried to counter it'd just end up a foaming incoherent post of 200 pages.

Though I will agree with him that other companies really need to take the opportunity at making a quality film, or short film that isn't about gags or talking/farting animals. Though I will still disagree about the price; even a 1-2 minute game promo done for E3 still costs millions even when it's done by a company that makes them endlessly and resuses assets and pipeline methods between shorts.

[syntheticgerbil]

Though I will still disagree about the price; even a 1-2 minute game promo done for E3 still costs millions even when it's done by a company that makes them endlessly and resuses assets and pipeline methods between shorts.

The way I figure is that the salaries for the animators/artists doesn't have to be so bloated. So let's say a team of "not-so-well-paid" guys who are good.

Students of multiple schools around the world have been doing amazing things recently for thesis and final shorts before graduating, as well other animators posting junk they did on Vimeo that looks super professional on their own time, alone or with a group.

Also, every year multiple feature length ugly vanity CG films get made by small companies with some delusional leader with stars in his eyes and money in his pocket to burn (Delgo being the major "break-out" of these types). I figure it's only a matter of time before one of these delusional presidents gets his act together and hires the right sort of people and invests his money wisely so that the movie doesn't end up as this utter CG mess that sells for $4 on DVD-R in the bin at the nearest giant grocery chain.

Somewhere the latter must meet with the former for a harmonious collaboration in the middle, I imagine.

I mean, after seeing the fifth documentary with the dudes in Hawaiian shirts driving around on scooters and jumping on trampolines in their studio workspace claiming how amazing their job is, I'm more than ready for someone else to step up in this country and do something more interesting.

Also since I spent some time bashing the awful Up earlier in the thread and upset a few, I should say I did really enjoy the first half of Wall-E. I want more like that. The movie got increasingly generic and did fall apart near the end, but the idea and atmosphere was so much better than those stupid promos led me to believe (the Brazil rip off that two other CG films were doing at the time and the "we need a robot" one). I'm glad Pixar at least hasn't started subsequent trailers reminding you of every movie they made and what geniuses ahead of their time they were/are before introducing the movie. Yech.

Also for the record, I used to be a Toy Story fan boy in my younger years, owning a shitload of toys and even buying at least three copies of that stupid comic book that just uses screens from the film with dialogue overlapped. I still like the first Toy Story a lot and I bet I could beat that video game without using one continue possibly.

Edited June 8, 2010 by syntheticgerbil

[Murdoc]

The way I figure is that the salaries for the animators/artists doesn't have to be so bloated. So let's say a team of "not-so-well-paid" guys who are good.

As someone who collects a salary in one of those positions I don't consider them bloated at all and grossly unbalanced compared to the time at work/effort vs. compensation collected. And this is ignoring the mildly naive human thought of compensation vs. revenue of product.

But yeah, that's my disagreement of pure opinion.

The desire to want better movies to be made or the question to ask of why there isn't better films isn't what I'm disagreeing with, but I can use those two motivations against video games and live action films too. Live action is infinitely more cheap to produce then any cg production, yet so few quality films, large or small are made ever year.

This has nothing to do with budget, salaries, or investors. The film industry is literally swimming in money and it is comparatively easy to get funding for a live action flick then animated films, visual effects pictures, or video games.

So why don't more people release better things? I don't know, but with the above example in mind I can only say that I think the problem is a lot more varied and complex then saying that salaries are too high and talented people can't find an outlet for their medium because I think that is simply untrue.