Steam - Why do you hate/dislike it so much?

[ysbreker]

What is it with everyone disliking steam? It's a free platform which offers a cheap way to distribute media and software. Yes, you do give away a bit of control over the games you own. (which isn't entirely true tho. You can make complete back-ups in several ways.)

I know steam used to be a nasty resource hog. but it has come a long way since the first release.

Please tell me why I shouldn't be using steam to buy/play my games?

[baconian]

Steam is great.

I was having annoying problems with my credit card on it though, but I figured it out. You should go ahead and use it if you want any of the games. The support team will do whatever they can to help you.

It's just the vocal minority that have had deal-breaker problems that make so much noise about its shortcomings, I reckon.

[elmuerte]

I don't like their EULA and how they think it's legally sound (concerning privacy, ownership and customer/seller relationship), I don't like their account handling policy. I don't like their intrusive software and their policy on how I may use my own computer. I don't like how much control I give to a single vendor.

Steam has a lot of similarities with spyware vendors and scammers.

It would be much less if it wasn't a single company responsible for all of it.

[loonyboi]

Steam's great. I've had no problems with it whatsoever.

I don't leave it running in my system tray unless it's specifically downloading something though...even if it's not a system hog anymore, i'd rather not chance it.

But otherwise it's great. I pick a game, download it and play it what's not to love?

[Thrik]

I thought all the Steam hate had faded out by now for the most part. Sure, it was truly a train wreck back when it was beta software when it debuted years ago, but it's evolved into a comfortable and useful piece of kit as far as I'm concerned.

Some people who used it in its early days and haven't really done so since do still cling onto the "STEAM :(" bandwagon, but anyone who's regularly used it in recent times should be able to see that it is almost all good. And, from what I've seen, they do — I rarely witness Steam bitch-outs anymore.

It's put an end to the days of having to go to shops to see what games are available and buy them, go to sites to download patches, download third-party software to browse server lists from the desktop, use some other third-party software to track your friends (granted, this has only recently been revamped), and of course having to go to download sites for trailers and demos for upcoming games.

As far as the games that choose to use Steam go, anyway. Really, I can't see how anyone could not find the aforementioned a positive step forward, and I can only hope that more developers decide to join up with Steam.

[Nappi]

A couple of days ago, I was bored and decided to try Counter Strike (which I hadn't played for a long time) before I had to go somewhere. I opened Steam and it started updating itself and all the games, which took over 20 minutes. When it was finally ready, I actually didn't have time to play anymore.

That and the program being kinda heavy are my only complaints about Steam. Haven't tried downloading or buying games with it, though, and don't even use it that much.

[David]

I'd like it if it the client dropped some of the graphical flare in exchange for better performance. It's a bit bulky, a stripped down version would be ace.

[loonyboi]

I like that I can buy a game at home, load up steam on my work PC and play all my games there too. That rules.

[-MaSQuE-]

I lost my password and it cut me off from easily a 100$ worth of games.

Still working on getting them back though.

But it left a bitter taste in my mouth.

[baconian]

Remember the movie Project X? Where a room full of kids are playing games, but in reality they are remotely piloting warplanes? Or was that another movie?

Well, Steam can do that now! Probably.

Also, someone playing battefield 2 was the one who actually took out Zarqawi. Well, almost. In backwards land.

[elmuerte]

Remember the movie Project X? Where a room full of kids are playing games, but in reality they are remotely piloting warplanes? Or was that another movie?

Wasn't that in the movie "Toys"?

Well, Steam can do that now! Probably.

nice piece of spyware results

[ysbreker]

I don't like their EULA and how they think it's legally sound

What are your biggest gripes with the EULA of steam then, elmuerte? And why do you think it's not legally sound?

[The Tingler]

A couple of days ago, I was bored and decided to try Counter Strike (which I hadn't played for a long time) before I had to go somewhere. I opened Steam and it started updating itself and all the games, which took over 20 minutes. When it was finally ready, I actually didn't have time to play anymore.

To be fair, you'd have to update ANY online game before you could play it, and some servers might be on a completely different version - at least Steam makes sure everyone in the world is using the same version.

I still hate Steam however. I hated it from the very start, back when it was just a paranoid reaction from Valve to being hacked and having half their game stolen - so they made sure that they watched everyone who played their games.

I hate it because:

1. You have to have an internet connection, even to play a single-player game you've bought from the shops. No other game does this, for a reason: it's utterly stupid. Yes, most people have 'net access on their computers, but there are plenty of people who don't. Like families who have one computer for gaming, and another for internet. Not everyone plays online games.

2. And now you have to have a incredibly fast internet connection. I bought Episode One from the shops, and I couldn't play it for about three hours because it was updating. Updating? They only just released the damn thing!

3. As I just said, you have to patch a game for hours before you can play it. Great for online games like CS, but Half-Life 2 worked just fine for me without it.

4. It over-complicates an already complicated gaming system.

- With consoles it's just turn on, stick disc/cartridge in, play.

- With PCs it's turn on, wait for Windows to start, insert disc, click 'Install', get through all the waffle like licensing agreements and DirectX, wait for game to install, start game, set up video and control options, play.

- With PCs + Steam, it's turn on, wait for Windows to start, insert disc, click 'Install', get through all the waffle, wait for game to install, start Steam (not the game), click 'Games', click 'Activate a product on Steam', enter CD-key, start game, wait for game to update for 3 hours, set up video and control options, play. And that's if you've already got Steam set up correctly. What if lose your password, like [MaSQuE]?

5. It removes the second-hand gaming scene. You cannot buy any Steam-related CD preowned, because that CD-key is bound to your name.

6. Steam is not a choice. It should be. I didn't want Steam, I just wanted Half-Life 2.

7. Valve does not like, listen to or trust its own consumers. They only made Steam, as I mentioned, to make sure they could keep an eye on us every time we use their game. It's not for us, it's for them.

I like that I can buy a game at home, load up steam on my work PC and play all my games there too. That rules.

You can do that with any game. Just remember to bring the CD/DVD. And you wouldn't have to wait hours for those games to download or update, either.

[SpiderMonkey]

I still hate Steam however. I hated it from the very start, back when it was just a paranoid reaction from Valve to being hacked and having half their game stolen - so they made sure that they watched everyone who played their games.

Eh? Steam's development massively predates the HL2 leak/hack job.

[loonyboi]

You can do that with any game. Just remember to bring the CD/DVD. And you wouldn't have to wait hours for those games to download or update, either.

But that's the point. I don't *have* to bring the CD or DVD. I just download the program, log-in and I'm good to go.

And I don't get your complaint about waiting hours to play games...it seems to me that I'm able to play them pretty quickly after installing the program.

That's not an issue for me anyway, as I rarely have to play games the instant I install them, but I've never had a problem there.

Also, since I have always-on internet connections at work and home, I don't really care about having to have an internet connection to play those games.

[Nappi]

To be fair, you'd have to update ANY online game before you could play it, and some servers might be on a completely different version - at least Steam makes sure everyone in the world is using the same version.

Yeah. I should have said I tried playing single player HL2 in order to make my complaint more justified, but that wasn't the case this time.

Installing Half Life 2 was one of the most frustrating experiences I have ever had with software. It wasn't hard or anything, but damn it was annoying to realize that "No, I still can't play the game, Steam is performing an update. I thought it did that already?"

As I already said, or was supposed to say, I can live with Steam. But I sure hope that in the future each company won't have their own equivalent for steam.

[elmuerte]

What are your biggest gripes with the EULA of steam then, elmuerte? And why do you think it's not legally sound?

Steam and your Subscription(s) require the automatic download and installation of software and other content and updates onto your computer ("Steam Software").

I think not. Since I am responsible for my computer and my steam account you can not require me to allow automatic download and installation. Because I don't have control it and therefor can not be held responsible for what happens with my steam account when I allow this. You will need confirmation from me before I allow any of the listed actions. Then we can talk about being responsible for my account.

Except as otherwise permitted under Section 2© with regard to the SDK, you may not, in whole or in part, copy, photocopy, reproduce, translate, reverse engineer, derive source code, modify, disassemble, decompile, create derivative works based on, or remove any proprietary notices or labels from the Steam Software or any software accessed via Steam without the prior consent, in writing, of Valve.

Bullshit, I'm allowed to do almost all of those things. But still, this bull shit is included with most EULAs and they simply include it for fun. It violates rights granted to me by local laws, an EULA can not deny me these rights unless this EULA is transformed in a legal document (and therefor has to be signed by both parties, and what not).

host or provide matchmaking services for the Steam Software or emulate or redirect the communication protocols used by Valve in any network feature of the Steam Software, through protocol emulation, tunneling, modifying or adding components to the Steam Software, use of a utility program or any other techniques now known or hereafter developed, for any purpose including, but not limited to network play over the Internet, network play utilizing commercial or non-commercial gaming networks or as part of content aggregation networks, without the prior written consent of Valve;

In short, I'm not allowed to use steam through a VPN or even a gateway unless I have written consent of Valve. Well so far for using this for multiplayer games.

Subject to the Valve privacy policy referenced in Section 1 above, as applicable, you expressly grant Valve the complete and irrevocable right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and perform the User Generated Information and derivative works thereof in any form, anywhere, with or without attribution to you, and without any notice or compensation to you of any kind.

Talking about big brother.

Valve reserves the right to collect fees, surcharges or costs incurred prior to the cancellation of your Account or a particular Subscription. In addition, you are responsible for any charges incurred to third-party vendors or content providers before your cancellation. In the event that your Account or a particular subscription is terminated or canceled by you, no refund, including any Subscription fees, will be granted.

So... they can charge you when you want to cancel your account?! That doesn't sound right.

In the event that any provision of this Agreement shall be held by a court or other tribunal of competent jurisdiction to be unenforceable, such provision will be enforced to the maximum extent permissible and the remaining portions of this Agreement shall remain in full force and effect.

Ahh.. no harm done. Not a single point will hold up in court since this is not a legally binding contract. But this is a normal clause.

Further more they reserve the right to cancel your account at any time for any reason taking with them all licenses you aquired. Sorry, but licenses are not stackable. A license can only cover whatever came with it at the time the license was acknowledged.

Anyway.. that may not be all, didn't read the EULA again that carefully this time (also skipped everything that wasn't valid in the european union).

So you might say I don't use a lot of software since a lot of EULA's are crap like that. Well, no. I simply click "I agree" because I know the EULA is premium crap. The thing is that the company who's EULA I might have violated can't simply take away my license when we don't agree. With Steam license revokation is quite easy, therefor I'm more cautious

[baconian]

two words: offline mode.

[miffy495]

Games I have purchased on Steam:

Darwinia

HL2: Ep1

Ragdoll Kung Fu

SiN Episodes: Emergence

Haven't had a problem with any of them, and it's the only way I was ever going to be able to track down a copy of Darwinia, which I absolutely loved. At present, all they're collecting about you is what games you own, (necessary for the service) how long you've played them for, (marketing mumbo-jumbo) and your system specs. (optimization of games) It's a bit big brother-ish, but it allows me access to great games that I couldn't find otherwise and doesn't collect stuff that would worry me to have people find out. I really like the idea of Steam, and like elMuerte said, it's not like the EULA can really be enforced.

[Erkki]

Valve should do with Steam what IBM did with Eclipse -- release control to a neutral organization and get other companies to join in (and maybe open source it). Not a lot will join if it will remain controlled by Valve.

Except with Steam it might be a bit more complicated -- Eclipse is a platform that the Eclipse Foundation members build their commercial products on, but with Steam it probably wouldn't be good for each publisher to have their own steam-based product (because people will buy games from different publishers and it would be a mess to have to have 10 different Steam-derivatives installed); rather Steam should be one product and every publisher should just have their own plugins for it, if they need to have their own encryption or security code, or whatever.

But I think a big problem is that while Eclipse was meant to be universal right from the start, that is not the case with Steam (or am I wrong? -- haven't read that much about it's background). So Valve would probably have to almost start over to do this. And I'm not even sure there's a good business reasons for them to make Steam that open and universal.

[The Tingler]

Eh? Steam's development massively predates the HL2 leak/hack job.

Not at all. Steam and the 'you must have an internet connection to play' came way after it.

The Tingler:

You can do that with any game. Just remember to bring the CD/DVD. And you wouldn't have to wait hours for those games to download or update, either.

But that's the point. I don't *have* to bring the CD or DVD. I just download the program, log-in and I'm good to go.

And I don't get your complaint about waiting hours to play games...it seems to me that I'm able to play them pretty quickly after installing the program.

That's not an issue for me anyway, as I rarely have to play games the instant I install them, but I've never had a problem there.

Also, since I have always-on internet connections at work and home, I don't really care about having to have an internet connection to play those games.

You must have a really fast internet connection. I just have a fast internet connection. It took me over 2 hours until I could play Half-Life 2: Episode One. And I do like playing games after I've finished installing them. So it was a bit of a bugger.

[MrHoatzin]

Not at all. Steam and the 'you must have an internet connection to play' came way after it.

Steam was there from the moment HL2 was announced. It was the means to buy the game from day one. And it was more rabid about requiring an internet connection than it is now, two years later.

[steak-flavored gum]

I'm wondering what the issue is with losing a Steam password; isn't that situation something akin to that of losing a password for, say, an online banking service? Both offer measures to be taken in the case of a forgotton password, and if for some reason one is unable to take advantage of those measures then due to their nature it really can't be blamed on Steam.

This is not to belittle the issue - losing an investment in games all linked to one account is annoying and expensive - but prevention of such an issue isn't exactly difficult.

[Thrik]

Yeah, seriously. I definitely remember Steam being around and used by myself prior to the release of Half-Life 2, and according to Wikipedia it entered active service as far back as 2002 before becoming the official replacement for WON as of 2003.

But yeah, every experience I've had thus far with Steam has been really nice. I got the physical copy of Half-Life 2, and installing it was a breeze — I didn't experience any of the extraordinarily long activation delays that others have complained of. I also bought Day of Defeat: Source via Steam, and was ready to go almost immediately. Add to this my ability to easily download and view full screen trailers, get demos of upcoming Steam releases, keep my games up to date, and browse servers.

Prior to the system I would have had to install All Seeing Eye to achieve the same server browsing convenience, go to some video site to grab trailers, and sit in a download queue at FilePlanet or something to get patches and demos. How the fuck could that ever be seen as preferable to just using Steam? I have to wonder if those who complain about it ever actually play games, because updating and such for others is far less convenient. Not to mention that games still come with shit server browsers for the most part.

[General Fuzzy McBitty]

My only major beef about Steam is the user agreement.