Moosferatu

Dreamfall discussion *spoilers*

Recommended Posts

I loved dreamfall and I loved the ending (the fighting was bad, not enough puzzles blabla - but these are minor things)..

I definitely think there is something suspect about Brian Westhouse, funny enough I understood White Dragon's reaction to him when they first meet as pure and simple human love/desire - see white dragon aren't used to these human feelings (she said that) - she gets goose-bumps .. so I think her body quite independently was attracted to Brian... Well that was my initial reaction anyway - it seemed very clear to me when I watched the scene where they first meet. On the other hand I'm sure there is something suspect with Brian - hmm also the way he was so eager to help -get-to-the-dark-peoples-city-(where-white-dragon-is)-oh-well-he-throws-

everything-aside-to-help-this-strange-girl... suspect I say....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
AND WHAT HAPPENED TO DAMIEN?

Yeah, I thought about that too. I feel confident that Ragnar didn't just "forget" about him. There must have been some reason he decided not to include him in the ending, but I'll be damned if I can figure it out.

I'm currently playing it through for the second time. It's great, that scene after the Victory Hotel when you talk to Emma and Charlie still gives me goosebumps. I think it's that awesome feeling of nostalgia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just finished it again. A couple of things I noticed my second time through:

--I don't know if I somehow missed it the first time or if I just forgot about it, but I thought it was interesting to note that the drawings on Faith's wall depict Zoe and whatever it was that happened to Brian at the beginning. How the heck does she know about all that stuff? Also, if she knows about what happened to Brian why doesn't she tell someone?

--I'm becoming more and more suspicious of Zoe's mother. I suspect there's a whole lot more to her. It stuck me a couple days back that there has to be someone running the Stark side of things in coordination with what the Prophet is cooking up in Arcadia. It's obviously not Petes. He's pretty much clueless, and just thinks the dreamer is some great new pleasure device to feed his hedonistic desires. I highly doubt it's what's her face, his whining second in command just because she's so stupid. That only leaves Zoe's mother left, if we assume we've already been introduced to the character. I'm not going to say that it is her because it's quite possible that we haven't met who's in charge yet, but I certainly think that she's involved in someway. There's more to it than this. From the things she was saying at the end it's fairly obvious that she has a high level of access to the dreamer program. She said that she tried to locate Faith herself, but was able to. She also was somehow able to get her hands on a dreamer. I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that her company was just involved with developing morpheus. It also seems that they might be into some sort of genetic engineering as it sounds like they created Faith and possibly Zoe as well. Regardless, she would have had to have been actually at WATI HQ to search the dreamcore for Faith, which doesn't add up. Also, what's her motivation for wanting the dreamer to ship so badly? She's not really part of WATI (though her company is owned by them), and she tries to give the impression that she disapproves of what they're doing. Yet, at the same time she works incredibly hard to make sure that it launches. It just doesn't add up at all. As it stands she has absolutely nothing to gain, unless she's working toward part of the bigger picture. Really the only problem with this that I see is the fact that someone tried to kill her at the beginning. I think it's interesting that it wasn't the twins though that tried to bump her, they were clearly in town. No, instead, it was some weird guy in a black coat who we never see again. It almost makes me think that it wasn't WATI that was trying to bump her, but someone else who knew what she was up to. Of course, I have no idea who. This is probably all bullshit. I think I'm done speculating now. :gaming:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I discovered something tonight that I haven't read about in any of the forums discussing Dreamfall.

At the very beginning of the game, when Brian is at the monestary, Brian is led out into the chamber where he gets sent to Storytime.

When you first enter the chamber, there are two monks on the left hand side that are whispering when you enter the room. If you stand by the first pillar on the left when entering the room, then activate the "long range targeting mode", you can actually eavesdrop on their conversation. It turns out, the monks at the monestary actually KNOW that Brian will get "Tainted" (hence the name of the chapter) and are aware of the unchaining of the undreamer (which makes a little more sense at the very end of the game when Chavez rescues him and tells him he is "needed").

I thought this was quite interesting. I missed listening in on the monk's conversation on the first completion of the game. Any thoughts?? The dialog of the monks suggest that they are aware of the purpose of the Undreaming, but the following storyline fails to provide any more detail. Curious :blink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

heh... I completely forgot about that part of the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone find it interesting about the White Dragon's words to Zoe

"Faith will bring you where you are needed most"?

This statement is DEFINETLY open to some interpretation. The two theories I picked up from this are that a.) The dragon of the white is aware of the little girl Faith, this is somewhat supported by the fact that Faith said the dragon of the white came to where she was, and b.) It could be that Zoe was intended to go to the undreaming in the first place?

Mind you, her statement can be interpreted that her belief in herself would lead her to where she was supposed to be... but it seems like what she said has a dual meaning, don't you think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If you stand by the first pillar on the left when entering the room, then activate the "long range targeting mode", you can actually eavesdrop on their conversation. It turns out, the monks at the monestary actually KNOW that Brian will get "Tainted" (hence the name of the chapter) and are aware of the unchaining of the undreamer (which makes a little more sense at the very end of the game when Chavez rescues him and tells him he is "needed").

Ragnar made a comment on his blog that has been annoying me for weeks: that there's something quite minor you can do right at the start of the game that has an impact on the ending.

I wonder if this is it?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ragnar made a comment on his blog that has been annoying me for weeks: that there's something quite minor you can do right at the start of the game that has an impact on the ending.

I wonder if this is it?!

Put Wonker's brain back or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you don't put him back together before leaving for New Port he'll still be broken when you get back in chapter 12. This leaves open the question of how your father was able to talk with him on the phone seeing as he had no brain. If you do put him back together he'll talk to you some when you first come back and tell you that someone is waiting to see you. Then, after you're asleep he has a couple of touching lines about wanting to play a game and wondering if you'll play a game with him when you wake-up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I *finally* got this game after weeks and weeks of waiting for my super-special limited edition to arrive. And I just finished it.

What. The. Fuck.

Forget the ending - I didn't understand the entire game! Ok, scratch that. I understood bits of minor plots - like the Alvani taking over Arcadia, WATI Corp developing a dream machine, etc.

But what the fuck? I still don't know who that girl was or how she tied into anything. She was Zoe's sister, experimented on in Russia...and somehow that ties into the Static and Dreamcore? And the world?

Don't get me wrong. I loved the game. Awesome. But two things are clear:

1) This isn't really a sequel to TLJ. It's just another game set in the same universe.

2) Someone has some 'splaining to do.

Seriously. You guys talking about Westhouse...I don't even know what you're saying. This goes down with KOTOR 2 as "most confusing ending ever."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Faith was causing the Static and the corruption of the Dreamcore; something of her was left in the Wire after the massive Morpheus overdose killed her body.

She was also being visited by the White Dragon, who told her to tell Zoe to save April Ryan (but why isn't really clear, nor how Zoe "saved" April by witnessing her "death").

Also presumably, if Faith would have brought down the Wire as she (through the Static) threatened to do, the Dreamer would have never been released and the Tower in Marcuria wouldn't have succeeded in its purpose (as shown at the end). Of course, the Tower's purpose has yet to be revealed, though it appears likely that the Prophet is behind both the Tower and the Dreamer... and the Prophet, as shown by the screenshot earlier in this thread, appears to be Brian Westhouse. Which is spooky.

Perhaps the concentrated dreams collected by the Dreamer and focused in Tower can be a weapon against the Undreaming? Probably not, considering Brian (as the first chapter title tells us) is "tainted" (presumably by the Undreaming). Maybe they're just bringing them together so they can be easily destroyed...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Faith was causing the Static and the corruption of the Dreamcore; something of her was left in the Wire after the massive Morpheus overdose killed her body.

But...but...how? So there's a girl...and she's experimented on and drugged...and so she can just randomly go "Oh, I think I'll turn my mind into an electronic form and store it in the Wire, and then mess with this Dreamcore thing and cause Static. Just 'Cause." ?

She was also being visited by the White Dragon, who told her to tell Zoe to save April Ryan (but why isn't really clear, nor how Zoe "saved" April by witnessing her "death").

Yeah, didn't the White Dragon also call Zoe "big sister?" So are the White Dragon and Faith the same person? Or...related or something?

Also presumably, if Faith would have brought down the Wire as she (through the Static) threatened to do, the Dreamer would have never been released and the Tower in Marcuria wouldn't have succeeded in its purpose (as shown at the end).

So...Zoe's convincing of Faith's suicide was actually a bad thing?? Then why did she do it?!? I'm so confused! :P j/k, it's cool...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A part of Faith remained somewhere after she died because of two things. First of all, I'm pretty sure that she's a dreamer, like Zoe. If I understand correctly the two of them were more or less genetically engineered by Jiva, which explains why they're different than everyone else. The second factor has to do with the fact that she died while she was in the Dreamcore. The combination of these two things resulted in a part of her being left behind.

Nope, there's no relation between Zoe and the White Dragon. Did you play The Longest Journey? The relation is between April and the White Dragon. What exactly that relationship is remains one of the biggest unanswered questions in the series. I'm guessing it'll finally be answered in the next game and reveal what April actually is.

Zoe convincing Faith to give up her connection to the world was both good and bad. It was good because Faith was tormented and needed to be free from the world. It also prevented another collapse in Stark. But it's also part of the irony of ending because you end up bringing about that which you spent the whole game trying to prevent. Also, Zoe was tricked by her "mother" into thinking that the dreamer wouldn't be launched if she freed Faith, but that it still might be if there was a collapse. This is obviously false, so it raises some interesting questions about what her "mother's" motives are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nope, there's no relation between Zoe and the White Dragon. Did you play The Longest Journey? The relation is between April and the White Dragon. What exactly that relationship is remains one of the biggest unanswered questions in the series. I'm guessing it'll finally be answered in the next game and reveal what April actually is.

D'oh! That was April? Stupid memory. Hmm...well, I definitely remembered the White Dragon saying someone was their sister. :) Yeah, I played TLJ, but that was a looooong time ago.

Though, after this game, I really hope the focus turns back to April Ryan/Cortez and saving the world/balance/stuff. Zoe was a nice little detour...but I'm already bored of her. April's sections of the game were more interesting and more fun to play, partially due to (IMHO) the great voice acting behind April versus the relatively poor voice acting behind Zoe...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, the White Dragon's big sister is April. In the original TLJ, the (elder) White Dragon refers to April as "daughter" and is protecting an egg. When the (elder) White Dragon dies, the egg hatches and the new White Dragon emerges, which is the one you see in Dreamfall.

Also, Cortez is (probably) dead. I, too, was surprised that the Balance featured so little in Dreamfall; the Dreaming/Storytime stuff seems to actually be even bigger than the Balance, though, which means I don't think it's going away.

Additionally, I really liked Zoe's voice. Maybe it's the accent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Really? I loved Zoe and her voice.

I didn't dislike it...but it didn't grab me. Her voice worked well for describing things, narrating, and the like, but whenever she had to talk to anyone else - April, Damien, Gabriel - it felt like the other person was talking and she was...reading with punctuation? Maybe I'm picky...

I don't really think it was the accent, but who knows. Maybe it was simply a function of the actress having three times as many lines as everyone else and getting bored with the game.

Ah, well. This was a game of highs and lows.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just finished, and I bought the game yesterday:

My problem is that the whole game (story wise) plays like one HUGE introduction.

It does little, if nothing, to tie up the major story, and opens up far more than it tried to wrap up.

I understand that there was a good deal of underlying events that you could infer from the story, but it feels very much like there isn't a complete story.

It doesn't even play like a cliffhanger. It just stops. The ending is very strange in that it makes many of the things that you'd worked to stop occur.

I was left wondering what the point was.

It was the longest intro ever.

Now... as to the death of April. It's hard to understand what is going to happen with that. Is the ending from TLJ still cannon?

What happened when the Westhouse monster killed the last Dragon?

The Reza at the end wasn't the real Reza... but then we end.

The whole story was to set up a bigger story, but I felt that it was actually a very short game. It took me much less time to get through than the original.

The game play... well... it wasn't really there. The story kept you going, but really, you found yourself holding the 'run' button a good deal. There are only a few places where you actually have to figure anything out. Most of the time the game tells you outright what to do. Several would-be puzzles can be skipped just by beating people up.

If the game had been longer, which I feel it needed to be to tie up at least a BIT more of the can of worms it opened, I may have stopped playing simply because of the lack of challenge.

I'm still not sure how I feel about the three-character system.

It was interesting to see the difference in perspective, but Kian didn't get enough screen time for you to really adjust to him, and most of the time you spent as him you were just hacking away at people you didn't want to kill.

It was worth playing for the characters and the story elements, but I didn't feel any fulfillment at the end. I didn't really feel that I accomplished much, and everyone that I liked ended up pretty much screwed over in the end.

I would play another TLJ game, but I know that it’ll take forever for them to release… and I want the rest of the story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Didn't have (mis)fortune of playing this game, but it seems that this... specific kind of ending is becoming the trademark of TLJ franchise.

While the original TLJ had well-developed story, the ending felt like something rushed just before the deadline - as if all of a sudden the developers had plenty of decent ideas but didn't know how to tie them together. Or, even, as if they didn't know where the story was going to from the very beginning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now