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Nick

"in the mould of Doom - but without the gore"

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Those games look dreadful. Not because of their aged graphics, but for their total lack of design. It's like Quake, but then with blue instead grey as the main washed-out colour. I'm not saying you couldn't make a good 'Christian' game. In fact it could very well be super. If you take some stories from the Bible and do something with it you could make an awesome game. But these (Catechumen and something called Ominous Horizons) aren't it.

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If you take some stories from the Bible and do something with it you could make an awesome game.

you could make some seriously violent games from it.

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Obviously, but not necessarily. It's about the Christian virtues and all that. But what strikes me is when I look at screenshots of Cutechumen I see all those bats and vampires and zombies and tombs. Such dabbling in the occult seems hardly Christian, even if there isn't any blood* or gore**

*or green blood

**or green gore

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It reminds me of a game presented at Milia three or four years ago : it was financed by several european governments willing to create an alternate type of RTS in which you would play an ONU-like organisation and try to build things and rescue people in opposition to the destruction, war-oriented RTS games of those times.

I though the idea was wonderful but the game was never finished.

Anyway, I think that making creative games that carry "healthy" ideals is a nice idea, but this Cutechumen seem more like an undercover Requiem than anything else.

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This in turns reminds me of the lowest of the lowest triple-F game called "Ebola". You play a doctor trying to save Africa from the virus. You're in a helicopter and you have to kill everything in sight. The tagline is "save the victims".

This concept sounds godawful, but wait till you see the execution. That was the worst birthdaypresent ever. Fortunately it was never meant seriously :gaming:

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What's so wrong with socking it to the forces of darkness a la Doom? I know the Bible doesn't say "Pick up your BFG and whoop Satan's ass"--Joe 2:13, but still. I can't see why that'd be more objectionable than killing innocents in the street in Grand Theft Auto. And if it is just the violence factor, well, I think Lorne Lanning said it best when he pointed out how the Bible is utterly steeped in violence and death....

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Christians tend to ignore the gory bits (i.e. The Old Testament, Revelations) and instead focus on Jesus' "turn the other cheek"-esque bits.

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Christians tend to ignore the gory bits (i.e. The Old Testament, Revelations) and instead focus on Jesus' "turn the other cheek"-esque bits.

I don't think it's so much that those things are ignored as much as they're not really considered as relevent. In terms of how to live your life and so forth, the New Testament should be the template, since that's when Jesus came and laid down all of his guidelines and teachings. (That's why it's the "new" and "old" testaments instead of just the first and the second one, or something)

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I don't think it's so much that those things are ignored as much as they're not really considered as relevent. In terms of how to live your life and so forth, the New Testament should be the template, since that's when Jesus came and laid down all of his guidelines and teachings. (That's why it's the "new" and "old" testaments instead of just the first and the second one, or something)

However if there is a convenient passage in the old testament for banning queer people from getting married, they'll use it without batting an eyelash.

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However if there is a convenient passage in the old testament for banning queer people from getting married, they'll use it without batting an eyelash.

Sorry but seriously, THOSE AREN'T CHRISTIANS! those are Homophobic epsilon semi-morons... :frusty:

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The thing is that the Bible is such a huge book that you can find nearly any opinions on any subject (and its opposite) coming to your mind.

In this case, you can justify a game like Requiem, a super violent game in which Jesus would "not come to bring peace but a Sword" and a Myst-like game taking place during the events taking places in the desert from Exodus 3....

but I doubt sane people would take everything in the Bible and apply it in real life : the old testament is merely a text describing in insane details rituals and laws about how to build a campment that can challenge for the Christian Campment of the Year.

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There's a christian review site named Christian Centered Game Reviews.

http://www.ccgr.org/default.asp

It's a serious site, though it may be ridiculously dumb (and funny) at times, its intentions are good. It reviews appropriateness and such.

For example, here's their Psychonauts review: http://www.ccgr.org/article_read.asp?id=802

And here's a GTA San Andreas review that was written in their forum, it's the only San Andreas review that I agree with, and I'm not christian nor religious: http://www.ccgr.org/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=875&FORUM_ID=1&CAT_ID=1&Topic_Title=Grand+Theft+Auto%3A+San+Andreas+review&Forum_Title=Announcements+and+Polls

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I don't think it's so much that those things are ignored as much as they're not really considered as relevent. In terms of how to live your life and so forth, the New Testament should be the template, since that's when Jesus came and laid down all of his guidelines and teachings. (That's why it's the "new" and "old" testaments instead of just the first and the second one, or something)

Sometimes I wonder what it would have been like if Marcion and co had done better for themselves; we'd probably just have a "Testament" then.

[/Religious Textual History Tagent]

P.S. Marcion of Sinope

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What the hell? What's more christian than fighting back hordes of hell spawn?

xTreme Foot Washing?

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What's funny about this is that the most Christian movie of last year was also one of the bloodiest and most violent films of the year.

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What's funny about this is that the most Christian movie of last year was also one of the bloodiest and most violent films of the year.

Of the year? I think it stacks up well against most films in the violence stakes.

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"As believers in Christ, we pray that God will be glorified through our work and that each of us draw nearer to him as we develop and grow as a business," the company says.

"We also pray for God's unyielding protection for our company, as well as others who are involved in his perfect plan for the world."

The sentiments of Christian developers will also strike a chord with the many family groups concerned about the effects of violent games on children.

Okay, I am NEVER playing anything from a company that tries to whore their god to me. And yes, I was raised Catholic, and though I love the philosophy that Christ represented, I never whored Jesus to any of my friends and total strangers on the street. Screw that shit.

I would LOVE to play, say, the Ten Commandments as some kind of adventure game, but NOT if it pimped the 'glory of God' and tried to convert me. I have enough crap as it is being bombarded left and right by Viagra spam online. :shifty:

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The bottom line is this:

Don't look at it as 'old' or 'new' testament. It is simply the greek and hebrew testament. Often people look to one or the other to somehow justify something they want to put across or condone such as violent accounts of Joshua or Judges to the non violence many associate with Jesus. Remember this though - It has NOTHING to do with what christian body you belong to if the views and ideals you have are not in harmony with the Creator.

As many of you have correctly pointed out, too often so called religious people use the Lords name when they want to go all 'Righteous' and force 'their views' on the masses. - and that's just it it's 'THEIR views' and not necessarily those of God.

It is VERY easy to take a bit here and a bit there from the scriptures to say anything from 'You should not kill' to 'Go slay anyone who doesn't bow down and do as you do'.

Yes, there are many religious groups who all say THEY are the right one to be with and (give your money to ;)) but how do you know who to listen to or if you should at all?

If you do have an leaning to believing in a creator and you would like to understand his purpose then do study the bible. You will see that it, infact, is perfectly in harmony throughout - and why wouldn't it be? If you beleive that God wrote the bible with the use of faithful individuals inspired by him then don't you think he wuld get it exactly correct and as he wanted it? If you can't get past that first hurdle you will never progress.

So let's say for points sake that the bible is completely accure throughout, the next thing you want to know is - what is it exactly about? That again is actually a very simple message and is the basis for why Jesus came in the first place: to restore Gods kingdom. That's it. Adam and Eve sinned. We inherited that sin. Jesus shed HIS blood and died a perfect man so that we no longer have to make animal sacrifices as the priests did and God can forgive our sins through his son Jesus. We just have to be honest in our heart that we want to do better. It does not require a priest or a king to hear your confession - that is what Jesus came for. When he was born it bonded the Priestly line and the kingly line of descendants which is why God told Abraham he would be the father of 'a great nation'. God says very clearly (Psalms 55:22)to throw your burdens on he himself and HE will sustain you.

Jesus puts many new points that modern people find conflicting to those of the Hebrew scriptures but they are not. Remember, Jesus could not perform any miracles (raising the dead, healing sick etc) without Gods holy spirit. He looked ONLY to God in all decisions he made - even down to the disciples he chose. He was sent by God as a model for modern man to see that it is possible to serve the Creator and remain true to his teachings.

But why do this you may ask. And like many you may feel that the bible is a stuffy views forcing 'don't do this' book. It is, infact, to put it in a way to easily understand, a manual for the human being on how to mantain a safe and healthy body. When you read that you should not drink to excess and sleep around it is for your own good and not a beating stick as to whether you will get through the 'gates of heaven' or burn in hell. (by the way, the bible makes no reference to hell as a place. It does not exist. It is the word SHEOL or HADES which actually just means 'the common grave' - the place you are burried in.) so stop worrying that you will burn in hell! (Or sorry if you were hoping you might ;))

Armageddon is not the end of the world (or a good film) but it is the 'end of a system run by Satan' ie. the world we currently live in with death and war and al the crap we take seriously when we aren't on Idle Thumbs. Armageddon is simply the coming of Jesus as a spirit King to remove Satan and his demons from the powerhold it has on mankind. So dont think we are going to be destroyed in some catastrophic explosion. Your collection of NES games are quite safe. (except for the demonic ones. And the Sammy corporation.)

There is sooo much more but if you really want to know, then read the scriptures honestly. Your heart will tell you 9/10 if you are doing right or wrong. But if you want to know more then go for it. It should only make you a better person and not a judgemental fool like so many are.

But how do you know who to follow? Follow yourself. A christian body of people should exist for the sole reason to encourage one another and pick you up when your down. And they will ALL follow the creators teachings for the good of all. The minute you hear a religious group damning someone, or arguing amongst themselves over issues then chances are it is the wrong group to be with. You don't need to 'join' something to understand and be close to God. Those people should only be with you because they encourage you to keep trying to be someone kinder and better.

The cabbage has spoken...

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There is sooo much more but if you really want to know, then read the scriptures honestly. Your heart will tell you 9/10 if you are doing right or wrong. But if you want to know more then go for it. It should only make you a better person and not a judgemental fool like so many are.

I hate that saying 'judge not lest ye be judged'. It seems to me that it was written by someone who doesn't want you to make up your own mind. Critical faculties? A terrible thing indeed.

But how do you know who to follow? Follow yourself. A christian body of people should exist for the sole reason to encourage one another and pick you up when your down. And they will ALL follow the creators teachings for the good of all. The minute you hear a religious group damning someone, or arguing amongst themselves over issues then chances are it is the wrong group to be with. You don't need to 'join' something to understand and be close to God. Those people should only be with you because they encourage you to keep trying to be someone kinder and better.

The cabbage has spoken...

My point would be that the ponderous edifice of religion was created in the first place to control people, not encourage them to be kinder. The fall of the Roman Empire? Never happened. They just added 'Holy' to the name.

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Man a game about the Bible would be so cool. David vs Goliath ? Best boss fight ever ! It could be FPS , a sim game "The MeSIMSiah" , an adventure game (Use Water with Miracle = Wine). Maybe even a racing game...

On a side note I didn't know the Invader Zim guy did the voice for Raz.

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baconian, I don't disagree with you but my point is that the things you point out are actions of MEN, not of GOD. Yes, men such as the Pharisees put in complicated rules and laws to control people. That is precisely what Jesus was talking about which is why he was crucified.

Don' t mix laws of men with those of GOD. There is not a single law of God that controls you to your detriment. I have laws for my son, but they are all there to protect him. Gods law is there to protect us just the same. The fact that individuals use his law as a means to burden others is a sad fact of men. They will answer to God for their actions. We just have to live our lives as best we can and IF you do have a belief and you follow the scriptures accurately, you will find it adds genuine joy to your life. But many knock it before they have experienced it.

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baconian, I don't disagree with you but my point is that the things you point out are actions of MEN, not of GOD. Yes, men such as the Pharisees put in complicated rules and laws to control people. That is precisely what Jesus was talking about which is why he was crucified.

Don' t mix laws of men with those of GOD. There is not a single law of God that controls you to your detriment. I have laws for my son, but they are all there to protect him. Gods law is there to protect us just the same. The fact that individuals use his law as a means to burden others is a sad fact of men. They will answer to God for their actions. We just have to live our lives as best we can and IF you do have a belief and you follow the scriptures accurately, you will find it adds genuine joy to your life. But many knock it before they have experienced it.

oh please... :shifty:

And how will you know which are the laws of god and which are the laws of stupid men? I know: What feels best for you - what seems right - blablabla.

All of this requires that humans have a faculty somewhere that makes us able to tell right from wrong. But it is quite clear that we don't have this (if we had all religion would be superfluous) - just look everywhere around you...

I could say a lot here, but I think my gist is clear.

I genuinely believe that there is a lot of cleverness going on in the bible - and a lot of it is usefull for thinking about the way we live out lives. BUT everything you say could lead to everything from a nice and good way of living your life to killing people én masse. Humans are totally crazy in that way - you might even say totally Xtreme...

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oh please... :shifty:

And how will you know which are the laws of god and which are the laws of stupid men? I know: What feels best for you - what seems right - blablabla.

All of this requires that humans have a faculty somewhere that makes us able to tell right from wrong. But it is quite clear that we don't have this (if we had all religion would be superfluous) - just look everywhere around you...

..

It is easy to tell the difference, but it is best if you to study the bible to ensure that where we would faulter we have, in this case, a book that provides consistent and sound advice on our choices. The reason things breakdown in this world we live in is directly related to our inheritance of sin and the effect Satan has on us. (I can go into clear detail to show this but it would be inappropriate for me to do it in this forum as some may not care or believe) Anyone who would like me to provide the exact scriptures just mail me.

If we did live in a world where it worked, we wouldn't be having this chat. The reason things go wrong in this world is because it is currently directly ruled by Satan. That is why he offered it to Jesus when he was in the desert. It is why armageddon is coming - not to end the world, but just the system controlled by Satan. Then it will be returned to it's original purpose and we will live without all this chaos we currently have. Again, this only would seem logical if you have a belief or are open to actually believing that the bible is Gods word written by man.

I apologise to those who are not interested. I mean no offence.

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