Jake

Twin Peaks Rewatch 49: The Return, Part 14

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36 minutes ago, Endofastart said:

you missed Balthazar Getty

 

they said Red in Lost Highway

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7 hours ago, Mr. Jackpots said:

- I truly love Gordon Cole but I´m not ok with his handling of the Dougie search. Now Dougie is (again) in danger because of Gordon´s hint that he might be armed and dangerous. I hope the Las Vegas FBI section will not screw this up. Why didn´t Gordon just asked Diane where her sister lives? Not good police work Director Cole!

 

And even this is nothing compared to Sheriff Truman's horrible game of telephone passing on the note from Laura's diary to Gordon.  He just summarizes it as alluding to "two Coopers"?!  He doesn't bother to mention the bit about the Good Cooper being trapped in the Lodge and can't leave?!?!

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16 hours ago, Lacabra said:

Seems like Dougie got sucked into the lodge on account of dying while wearing the ring. Those early episodes are a great rewatch now even a few episodes from the end. Definitely seems like a Twin Peaks Rewatch Podcast Return Rewatchcast is gonna be in order.

But Dougie didn't die, or at least not exactly. He was pulled into the lodge because he vomited (garmonbozia?) while DoppelCoop held his in. 

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10 hours ago, Mr. Jackpots said:

- it seemed to me that Sarah is able to control this powerful spirit inside of her. And it´s interesting that the killing of that trucker was a response to his harassment. Because, in an ethical sense, you want this guy to be punished in some way for this kind of behaviour (which does not mean that I would excuse to bite the shit out of others people´s necks). I do not believe that Sarah will use this power to murder innocents. And because of that I don´t think that she is this "experiment" thing from the box in N.Y.

 

Now that you mention it, I think it's worth mentioning that Truck You is the one who escalates things at every stage (up until the last one).  He starts with propositions, then admonishments, then slurs, and then threats.  Sarah gives him several chances to back down, but he keeps pushing.  I'm not convinced that she's inhabited by anything good (did anyone else wonder if the 'something in the kitchen' might be the grocery boy trying to escape?) but it doesn't seem to be flagrantly sadistic.

 

10 hours ago, Mr. Jackpots said:

- Someone mentioned the strange way of putting Naido into a prison cell and I totally agree...WTH? So very yrev absurd! I´m afraid that bad things will happen down there with Chad, Naido and the bleeding guy (maybe Billy). Did I see it right that his blood dissolved the floor of the prison cell?

 

I'm also concerned that putting someone in a cell is Andy's idea of keeping them safe.  We know that the Woodsmen a) bump people off, and b ) have no trouble getting in/out of gaol cells, head or no head. Of course, if the purple scene does take place chronologically later, then it seems likely Naido will be okay.  Maybe that's why she's so insistent on keeping Cooper away from the electrical outlet?  She has seen him as Dougie!Coop and wants him to try another way.  Or maybe the fall from space ripped the stitches out and reopened the wounds.  Who knows?

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2 hours ago, Vellan said:

 

Now that you mention it, I think it's worth mentioning that Truck You is the one who escalates things at every stage (up until the last one).  He starts with propositions, then admonishments, then slurs, and then threats.  Sarah gives him several chances to back down, but he keeps pushing.  I'm not convinced that she's inhabited by anything good (did anyone else wonder if the 'something in the kitchen' might be the grocery boy trying to escape?) but it doesn't seem to be flagrantly sadistic.

 

Whatever that thing inside Sarah is certainly has some level of moral control, in that it will probably act visciously if someone really wants to go there.

Wow, I really hope it wasn't the grocery boy!  Maybe it was something else that had pissed her off on her way home!  She certainly had the same kind of look.  Honestly, I'm enjoying everything about Sarah.

 

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16 minutes ago, helplesswhite said:

pls hurry up with the episode!!!!!!!!!! this was such a banger and i need to hear you chat about it

 

They are in Ireland this week so the episode is gonna be delayed for couple days.

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5 hours ago, SuoTempore said:

 

Also, I mentioned Grace Zabriskie (Sarah) :)

 

 

Haha oh my god. Well. Fuck me I guess. JACK NANCE THOUGH.  He's all I have left. 

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I loved the serious business time Andy moment this week. Showing him actually do something! Him and Lucy have been painted as utter incompetents this season and it so great and surprising seeing Andy involved in that way. 

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Two things I haven't seen anyone mention (maybe they're too obvious).

 

The "Fireman" - firemen fight fires. "Fire Walk with Me." Fire = Bob/evil.  Fireman fights Bob/evil/the experiment, etc.  Yes?

 

The sheriff's department guys were at Jack Rabbit's Palace at 2:53 p.m., when the vortex appeared.  You know what else happened at exactly 2:53? (Albeit I don't know how the days/timeline work out) The moment when the Black Lodge was trying to get EvilCoop back by triggering the vomit of garmonbozia while he was driving; same time as Dougie was being sucked into the Black Lodge; same time as Good Cooper was being sucked through the electrical socket to take Dougie's place. 

 

Discuss amongst yourselves.

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to add to that, when Hawk was interpreting his map, he said the fire symbols represented electricity, the modern form of fire.

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The timing also works for Naido, having fallen from the Purple Room just prior, maybe landing in our world. 

 

When watching the episode I'd assumed 2:53 was just some kind of magical time that things happen on any given day, but it seems pretty plausible that Twin Peaks of episode 14 is concurrent with that stuff from the early season. 

 

I'm never going to remember all the things that caught my eye in this thread. I did like the two Mothers theory, though. They're also both eyeless, which is a loose but potentially meaningful association. 

 

Finally, though I feel awful for the character, Sarah, and the Palmer house, are the perfect bridge between the grand cosmic battle kind of mythology (or whatever that actually amounts to) and the deeply human side of Twin Peaks that makes it so poignant. And Lynch's unique knack for the domestic nightmare. Demons still inhabit that house, all these years later. It's still in the shadow of all that's happened there. It's still haunted by indescribable anguish. It's host to both an absurd fantasy and something altogether too real. 

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9 minutes ago, James said:

When watching the episode I'd assumed 2:53 was just some kind of magical time that things happen on any given day, but it seems pretty plausible that Twin Peaks of episode 14 is concurrent with that stuff from the early season. 

 

I don't think that seems likely though.  If we accept the following chain of events:

 

Naido's fall preceeds Cooper's arrival in Las Vegas

Cooper's arrival in Las Vegas and DoppelCoop's car crash are roughly synchronous

DoppelCoop's car crash preceeds the arrival of the FBI in Buckhorn

 

Given that Cole is in Buckhorn when he takes Truman's call, and that (from what I remember of the chronology of the episode) Truman calls Cole before they find Naido, the finding of Naido and the Cooper-swapping don't seem likely to have happened on the same day.  This is Twin Peaks though, so I won't say it's impossible

 

But that reminds me - weren't there two dates on Major Briggs' message?  Will they go back to Jack Rabbit's palace?

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Just a passing thought, but the rotation of the ceiling fan in the Palmer house brings to mind the rotation of the vortices. 

 

Also, isn't whatever's going on with the guy in the cell the same as what was wrong with the girl in the car outside the Double R? As the various random-seeming Roadhouse conversations would seem to indicate, there is something very wrong in the town of Twin Peaks. 

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22 hours ago, WickedCestus said:

 

It seems that all his intuition comes to him from dreams or visions, which as we've seen, involve beings from the Other World. Even as Dougie, all his actions are being directed by Mike and (maybe) The Fireman via visions. In the scene from FWWM used in this week's ep, he's telling Cole about a dream he had about that day, and uses this intuition to predict what will happen on the security camera. Then Jeffries points to him and asks Cole, "Who do you think this is?" Is Cooper not what we think he is?  Did he ever actually have any agency, or was he always just being directed around by beings from the Other World, just like Dougie is being? Or was he himself somehow created through the Other World? Is this how he became involved in Blue Rose anyway? I don't really know where I'm going with this; just some weird stuff to think about. I doubt any of this will be answered in the show!

 

All this might be disproven by the autobiography that was published in the 90s, but I'm not sure if that's canon. I've never read it. 

I think it´s good stuff, not weird at all. In my perception Cooper was guided through supernatural forces from the very beginning of the series. He had been always connected to The Giant and was able to solve the crime with a little help of his dreams and intuitions. Interesting questions you ask. I mean, at first there were Gordon and Philipp Jeffries, the origin of Cooper is not quite clear. My understanding of the FWWM scene is that Jeffries somehow travelled into future and knows about the existence of Cooper's Doppelgänger. And maybe that´s why he plays such a prominent role in The Return. Would have loved to see Bowie in this role again.

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Just a few random questions about what might come in the last few hours.

 

So, back at the beginning, the Giant/Fireman told Cooper,  " It is in our house now," anf "All cannot be said aloud now," after telling him to listen to the sound, which seemed to come from the phonograph. 

 

Now that we're a ways in, any thoughts on what this means and how it's going to play out? What was the sound? I wonder if it was the sound of a frogfly. 

 

Cooper was also told to remember Richard and Linda. Who is Linda and when will we meet her? Did we already?

 

Also, in addition to 253, 430 was mentiomed.

Edited by Mentalgongfu
Corrections/elaboration

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Black Yukon Sucker Punch! (as mentioned on the cast)

 

 

 

That guy was also on Binging With Babish for a Twin Peaks specials:

 

 

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The Andy / Fireman scene:

This was a time lapse of images representing Past/Present/Future.  Past = Woodsmen/Convenience Store/Laura Palmer's death, etc.  Present = Nido being found in the woods  Future = phone call(?), leading Lucy to a "reveal" of some sort?

This is obviously all out of sequence, but that's the point I believe.

 

Leading to the storyline of the green glove guy.  The Fireman revealed answers to him, more succinctly and apparently in spoken form (buy the glove, fly to Twin Peaks).  Will be interesting to see where Andy's new found confidence leads him.  My theory = Andy becomes central to sleuthing the reveal of good Coop / bad Coop.  Is able to accurately identify the difference, and saves the good Coop from "elimination".  The bumbling deputy finally becomes a "real" law enforcer.  We saw a glimpse of this when he shot Jacque to save Sheriff Truman (Season 1).

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Not sure if anyone has noted this yet but Erica Eynon is credited as having a voice acting part in the credits of this episode on some of the streaming services. She is the voice for the Experiment. It only makes sense the her voice was the voice we heard when Sarah took off her face. All signs point to her being inhabited by that creature.

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I still think Audrey could be in a coma. Nothing about the Billy and Tina mentions in that Roadhouse scene cement the same reality for Audrey and Charlie to me. Audrey could just be hearing people talk about similar events from her bed and incorporating them into her coma dream state or bizarre constructed reality, whatever that may be. Audrey wanting to go to the Roadhouse to find Billy could be from a conversation of one of those women or someone else wanting to go to the Roadhouse to find Billy. Doesn't one ask right away if the other had seen Billy all?  Then the other replies not for a couple of days, and gets something like "I heard you were the last one to see Billy" back, then the story unfolds. Doesn't Audrey say in a previous episode that she heard Tina was the last person to see Billy? It was very similar, whatever the quote was.

 

I don't know if that stuff in the Roadhouse was meant to be a red herring or what, but it definitely seemed fishy to me. Especially the way the one woman hesitated a moment when asked what her mom's name was before saying Tina (almost seemed like a lie, or wanting to protect someone). Then the ominous background noise kicks in. And how she said a few times how she was unsure if her uncle was there or not. Very strange. I don't know what to make of the particulars being tossed out, and perhaps I'm grasping and it's all super straight forward, but I dunno. The Audrey scenes and her exchanges with Charlie are so much more unsettling if she's actually awake and kicking.

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