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Idle Weekend December 18, 2015: Destined for a Reboot

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Idle Weekend December 18, 2015:

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Destined for a Reboot

This episode, the weekenders ponder the curious monstrosity of Destiny, a game that still has Rob caught firmly in its snares. Danielle, meanwhile, is caught Raiding Tombs, trying to raise a floating crypt with an ancient water wheel just like the good old days. Ancient architecture certainly makes for fertile rebooting ground.

You can learn more about the show at idleweekend.net, and send us questions for our weekend correspondence at [email protected]. To keep up with the latest from us, follow us on Twitter at @idleweekend.

Discussed: Destiny, Rise of the Tomb Raider, The Witcher 3, Limitless, Star Trek, Both Flesh and Not

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So good to have Thumbs and then Weekend right next to each other in the week!

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I'm glad Rob & Danielle landed where I land on series and reboots in video games (I'm for them!). The games I'm most excited about coming out next year are XCOM 2, Dishonored 2, and the next Deus Ex game. The only game I'm really excited about that isn't some sort of sequel is Firewatch.

 

Who makes the reboot is a great point. I used to think it was only okay for games to be remade, not movies just because you can tell the same story in a game, but if the reboot has greatly improved game mechanics & systems then it'll still be great, but the same isn't the case for movies... but now that I think about it that isn't really true. I'm just so used to blockbuster Hollywood remakes that are cynical cash grabs that my mind immediately jumps to that. But you can point to examples like Herzog's Nosferatu to see remade films with artistic merit.

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About facial animation and who is responsible:

Usually with mocap or performance capture there is still a lot of clean up and refinement done by animators after the fact. Sometimes you only keep elements of the original performance, either to make it more stylized or pushed, and to make actions flow together smoothly. See the Andy Serkis VS animators debate if curious (in particular the comment by Randall William Cook).

In games facial animation is sometimes still done by hand even on realistic otherwise mocapped characters. Apparently the Witcher 3 facial animation was all keyframed. Naughty Dog as well

always done their facial animation by hand, even on Uncharted or Last of Us, giving it that extra flair and character. Don't know if this is still the case for Uncharted 4.

One disadvantage of performance capture that no one ever seems to talk about is its inherent linearity. It's great for cutscenes, but interactively speaking it's not very flexible... whereas if you construct a facial performance from individual expressions and procedural elements (like look-at) you can react dynamically to what the player is doing to some extent, more so than with a couple of alternate branching takes.

Then again as
, it's going to be easier to make even captured facial expression more adaptable and interactive.

Personally I'd love to see a Phoenix Wright-like detective game that's not just branching cutscenes like LA Noire, but characters actually reacting *in real-time* to player action and dialogue... like maybe as you're going down a particular line of questioning you could read from a witness' body language that this isn't working (eg them getting visibly annoyed, or stressed to the point of clamming up) so you back off and try a different angle... while their gaze direction (what they look at and how long) provides hints as to what they're focused on or concerned about, even as you walk around the scene. Body language and facial expression as gameplay feedback are a largely unexplored goldmine for game design, if you ask me.

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But you can point to examples like Herzog's Nosferatu to see remade films with artistic merit.

invasion of the Body Snatchers and The Thing also spring to mind. Maybe it's just your example that got me thinking horror, but it feels like there's something to it. (I hope I'm not repeating stuff in the cast, I haven't listened yet, but I'm really excited to!)

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Don't want to be too critical so take the comment for what it's worth.  I have gone into a media blackout prior to Star Wars.  Danielle you were the first to mention any feedback regarding the movies which I was trying my best to avoid.

 

Great new show.  You two obviously have a great rapport and I'm sure I'll be a long time listener.  M

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About facial animation and who is responsible:

Usually with mocap or performance capture there is still a lot of clean up and refinement done by animators after the fact. Sometimes you only keep elements of the original performance, either to make it more stylized or pushed, and to make actions flow together smoothly. See the Andy Serkis VS animators debate if curious (in particular the comment by Randall William Cook).

In games facial animation is sometimes still done by hand even on realistic otherwise mocapped characters. Apparently the Witcher 3 facial animation was all keyframed. Naughty Dog as well

always done their facial animation by hand, even on Uncharted or Last of Us, giving it that extra flair and character. Don't know if this is still the case for Uncharted 4.

One disadvantage of performance capture that no one ever seems to talk about is its inherent linearity. It's great for cutscenes, but interactively speaking it's not very flexible... whereas if you construct a facial performance from individual expressions and procedural elements (like look-at) you can react dynamically to what the player is doing to some extent, more so than with a couple of alternate branching takes.

Then again as

, it's going to be easier to make even captured facial expression more adaptable and interactive.

Personally I'd love to see a Phoenix Wright-like detective game that's not just branching cutscenes like LA Noire, but characters actually reacting *in real-time* to player action and dialogue... like maybe as you're going down a particular line of questioning you could read from a witness' body language that this isn't working (eg them getting visibly annoyed, or stressed to the point of clamming up) so you back off and try a different angle... while their gaze direction (what they look at and how long) provides hints as to what they're focused on or concerned about, even as you walk around the scene. Body language and facial expression as gameplay feedback are a largely unexplored goldmine for game design, if you ask me.

 

Write to [email protected]!

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I figured I'd post here so others could chime in, and because of all the links, but I will do that.

No worries. That was a great reply and I'd love to hear more people's thoughts on it. The links you included are really helpful, too. Thanks!

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My friend met the editor of hanibbal last year (not sure if he went on to do season three)

He was randomly introduced and had a drink with the editor of the televison seties Hannibal

Some choice take aways from his meeting. Apparently an entire episode is created. Filming and editing. All in in 8 days. The shows writer stays up to 5am doing re-writes and only gives the actors the script on the day on the shoot. Then 8 days latter an edited finished episode. Also, he's told to be as flamboyant with the editing as possible which is the opposite of any other television editing job :tup: cool

I really need to catch up and watch season three. Absolutely loved the previous two seasons.

Just finished watching Mr Robot which is highly recommend.

You guys make me want to play ever game you talk about :)

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Congratulations on the launch of the podcast, and thank you for making it.  I find it lively, warm, and thoughtful.
 

The topic of different cultures in games made me want to ask if you've played any of the Yakuza games.  Sega recently released Yakuza 5 as a download only release for the PS3.  The mind boggles.  There's a Giant Bomb quick look.

 

EDIT: Also I think this is the Simon Pegg nerd conspiracy article that was mentioned.

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invasion of the Body Snatchers and The Thing also spring to mind. 

 

I'm not one to be pedantic,but they were more re-adaptations than remakes...

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Rob, I too am an unwilling convert to Limitless. It was the 8-bit Naz combat sequence that finally hooked me.

 

The latest episode has a number of expositions that, given the movie, just put the overarching plot into motion.

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