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Idle Viewers: Feminist Film Club (Hedwig and the Angry Inch, 5/18)

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Hello everyone and welcome to the thread that we were discussing in the feminism thread. The purpose here is that every week we will watch one film and then have a rousing discussion about possible feminist techniques, narratives or overall points of a movie from a feminist angle. 

 

Participation is voluntary and you are definitely welcome to skip a week if a movie is not suitable for you (content or genre, we have a lot of people who don't like horror, etc). I will try to mix the movies up in terms of seriousness/humor and the like, so we're not watching a month's worth of uber-depressing films about the human condition. I believe that most films have some value from a feminist critical lens, so I am pretty sure we will have a lot of great suggestions to talk over. If you have any suggestions, pop them into the thread.

 

Suggestions so far: 

 
  • Hedwig and the Angry Inch
  • Alien
  • Jeanne Dielman, 23 Quai du Commerce, 1080 Bruxelles
  • A Girl Walks Home At Night (horror)
  • Babadook (horror)
  • Gremlins 2
  • We Are the Best!
  • Wetlands

Since the presumption is that everyone is going to be watching the movies for discussion, spoilers will be permitted uncut but if you have spoilers about future movies for content/discussion reasons, please cut those and label what they are about. General content warnings are absolutely recommended (and don't count as spoilers) as we don't want to have people watch a movie and be surprised by something so if you've seen a movie prior to, let us know and we can put the appropriate content warnings on the movie of the week. Also welcome is any outside critical work that has been written about said film. 

 

MOVIE OF THE WEEK: HEDWIG AND THE ANGRY INCH (5/18)

 

 

 

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Yaaaaaay

 

Copy-pasting my thoughts from the feminism thread here to spark the discussion:

 

It's a horror film where the monster is essentially a rape analogy, and most of the characters embody a rigid patriarchal archetype that's completely ill-equipped to handle the existential threat the alien presents. The gung-ho he-man is the first to die; the stern iron-willed leader, the deferential woman, the paternal robot (an actual device created by the Powers That Be) that uses rape (shoving a porno mag down Ripley's throat feels like a clear rape metaphor to me) as a tool of control... all of them are inadequate, all of them unwilling to accept that this danger exists and should be feared. I can imagine that there were some happy accidents along the way, people coming up with ideas that "feel" right for the movie's tone that no-one consciously realised extend the metaphor.

 

Edit: oh yeah, lots of happy accidents. The alien as rape metaphor was in the original script, but all characters were originally written without a specified gender with the exception of Ripley, who was also written unisex but the writers thought of the character as a man. Ridley Scott reportedly showed women in the production office the casting material to get their perspective, and they mostly settled on Sigourney Weaver. Ash as a robot was part of a rewrite. It's interesting how that guiding star realigned the movie to be in harmony with its most potent elements, and I think it emphasises just how far we've slid back since the 70s,

.

 

I also like that its heroine is a survivor - and what made her a survivor is not her being attacked by an alien. She's not defined by the attack, and Alien (as well as its action movie sequel) does a good job of saying that she has more to offer than surviving an alien. If the alien is a metaphor for rape, then I think Ripley is a metaphor for a rape survivor as they should be treated, in a way that popular culture almost never manages.

 

The working-class aesthetic is really distinctive, and I'm surprised that it doesn't turn up more. Only real example I can think of is Firefly, and even then it doesn't really feel right.

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Yay! This gives me a little more incentive to finish my term paper early too, I'd hate to miss Alien

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the paternal robot (an actual device created by the Powers That Be) that uses rape (shoving a porno mag down Ripley's throat feels like a clear rape metaphor to me) as a tool of control...

Yeah that part is the most disturbing to me out of most things in the movie. It was definitely intentional as an act of sexual violence going by Ridley Scott's commentary track.

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Fun! :tup: There's probably a wealth of opinions on this subject matter, but which version are we watching? Original Cut or Director's Cut, or whatever they're called. Maybe there are even more?

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I'd vote Original Cut because that actually is the director's cut, but do we all need to watch the same version?

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Nah, just wanted to get a feel for what cut is people's favorite. I was bummed when I went to watch Aliens and happened to watch a Director's Cut which had an intro section that sort of dampened the mystery of it all for me. Was wondering if there was any consensus regarding which one is preferred with Alien.

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Nah, just wanted to get a feel for what cut is people's favorite. I was bummed when I went to watch Aliens and happened to watch a Director's Cut which had an intro section that sort of dampened the mystery of it all for me. Was wondering if there was any consensus regarding which one is preferred with Alien.

 

If I remember, the director's cut is actually an attempt by Scott to cut down the movie after its runtime was extended by adding back several scenes that had been cut, particularly the one with the cocooned crew members. I generally like it for being a bit tighter, but the lack of self-consciousness in the editing of the original is maybe to be preferred for its effects on the horror. The original is Scott's preferred cut (although he said that in 2003, shortly after what I would consider his last good film) but he claims to like both cuts a lot.

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Well, since I don't have a huge DVD/BluRay library, I am going with whatever cut is on streaming services for rent, unfortunately! 

 

I saw parts of the original as a  KID in the 80s, it'll be interesting to sit through it now as an adult, especially now that I know I am looking for rape metaphors. Really stoked. 

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So wait, it's back to Alien rather than Aliens now? (And Jeanne Dielman is still in there?)

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Those were just thrown out as suggestions/references as far as I know, Ben. I'd imagine that we are still open for more.

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Jeanne Dielman was thrown out as a suggestion for what not to watch! Perhaps Aliens is coming later, but it's not on the suggestion list...

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Here's where the confusion lies: I had no idea that the SERIES of films is Alien, Aliens, etc. I seriously thought I was just getting Alien wrong. I AM A HORRIBLE NERD. We are watching "Alien" which is the first film in the ...trilogy? Is that the one that everyone wants to see or is the second film somehow better/more relevant than the first one?

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Both are probably worth watching for these purposes, although I think the sexuality stuff is a lot more prominent in the first one.

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The second film is more of an action movie (and also an amazing metaphor for the Vietnam war). I think the first one is definitely the one to watch for the purposes of viewing it through the lens of feminist critical thought, although maybe there is stuff in the 2nd film that also works from that angle... it's been awhile since I last watched it.

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There is a fourth one called Alien Resurrection and I doubt anyone would want to recommend that movie for anything.  I guess that's what happens when Joss Whedon tries his more humorous approach to Alien franchise lol.

 

And Prometheus.  Let's not watch that either I guess?

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I think all the Alien movies are worth watching in their own way, they're all really, really interesting, even when they're bad. But for the purposes of this exercise, only the first movie is probably necessary. If we want we can have an Idle Viewers: Alien Marathon Movie of the Year vs XxXXenomorphXxX movie watch later on or something but when people talking about the Alien franchise as a feminist work, they're talking about the first movie.

 

Also I'm really really excited to see A Girl Walks Home Alone At Night, I haven't had the chance before now but that movie is right up my alley.

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Same! So much horror is really valuable from a feminist perspective, even if I am too fraidy-cat to watch any of it.

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Also I just saw We Are the Best! about a month ago, and man that movie is so much fun!

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Aliens would probably make for valuable contrast, because James Cameron felt that the only way audiences would relate to his female protagonist and female monster being strong, capable characters was by making both of them into mother figures doing it all ~for the children~ (and then beating you over the head with it in the director's cut).

 

Get away from her, you bitch indeed!

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Two horror movies that I'd strongly suggest to add to the list of potential movies would be Carnival of Souls (1961) and Cat People (1942). Both are films that cast women who don't fit neatly into social roles as The Monstrous Other but show enough empathy so that, viewed with a modern eye, they are now our points of identification and become films about the horrors of the patriarchy. Neither are air-tight feminist tracts (they were made by men before the dawn of second-wave feminism, after all) but they both blossom under a modern feminist critical eye as looks at the crushing terror of rigid gender roles.

 

Cat People is especially potent in it's frank sexuality (it's the story of a woman who thinks she is cursed to turn into a snarling panther when aroused, and as a result is too afraid to have sex with her husband) and it's dreamy atmosphere. Also it's use of shadows and the power of suggestion was a big influence on Ridley Scott when he made Alien.

 

Other good classic films for this (I'll try to link to relevant scenes to give you an idea):

 

 

Of course the problem with classic films is that 99.9% of the time they're directed by white men. 98% of the time by straight white men. But the good thing is they exist in a world where gender roles were much more rigid, so stories about the obstacles women (and men too, though most classic films are much too homophobic to ever truly question traditional ideas of masculinity) face as a result of these roles are much clearer. 

</classic film dork>

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